Winter driving - Fit weaknesses

[polaski]

Originally Posted by zuckered

Interesting... I've heard that if you're on ice you want more surface area (so less tire pressure), so you have more surface area to grip with, but on snow you want less surface area (more pressure) so more weight is pressed per unit area. My problem is generally more on snow, are my tires are under-inflated?

I'm fairly certain these wide dunlops on such a light car are starting to cup and place more pressure on the outer treads at 30 pounds. The middle parts of the tire are summer-only tread design and when tire pressure is higher and the footprint more even they take too much pressure off the part I want to work!

Can't wait for this snow to be gone so I can air the tires up to where I want.

[rushlow]

I'm from the same area and am also running winter tires on 14" steelies (different brand of tire) I have found that traction is pretty good in snow but ice is ice.... not much traction there...
In the few cold spells we've had I found that my rear passenger windows would get really foggy and parts of the driver/front passenger would fog up too but the front and back stayed clear.
same problems with the wipers too they streak when they are frozen. new wiper inserts should help and they are cheap and easy to install. I'm not sure I want to replace the whole blade though- I like the oem look of the wipers.
To be honest though, I'm more worried about other vehicles losing control than myself.... there is alot of vehicles that don't even use winter tires... heck, the other day I saw an escalade with huge chrome wheels and summer tires driving around in the snow!?!? LOL
At least the transit strike is over now though eh?

[der Mond]

NMG, what you say is about the most sensible thing I've ever read about winter driving. The Nokian WRG looks like an outstanding tire; we're getting pretty interested in Nokians up here. I think I'd go with the Nordman, and probably will when my Pirellis wear out.

[cab0053]

might be a dumb question, but has anyone thought/tried making the car heavier? I know mpg will suffer, but it would beat floating over the snow into another car... (idk, sandbags, weights, ect...)

[Firebat666]

i honestly dont mind the fit in the snow... i have issues getting moving but after that im really fine... and im on stock dunlops

[mahout]

Originally Posted by cab0053

might be a dumb question, but has anyone thought/tried making the car heavier? I know mpg will suffer, but it would beat floating over the snow into another car... (idk, sandbags, weights, ect...)

One of the worst 'old wives tales' is that heavier cars get better traction than light ones.
Best icer I ever ran was a 89 geo metro xFi weighing 1500 lb; with suitable tires, tall 155 width on 15" wheels, tires from WRC vintage. No 4 wheel truck, SUV, or anything other than a STi or WRX or Evo could touch it. And if the going got steep they couldn't either.
The trick getting around in snow and ice is having the least weight and most traction tires. (smaller tire patch, hence more pressure, spikes being the best)
Less weight means less chance of going sideways or getting stuck unless you put fat tires on it that had no road contact pressure. (thats why they use studs). Lighter weight easier to push aronud too, by engine or by driver, if need be.
Back in the old days, Caddys got around better than Fords because there wasn't much difference in the tire patch so the heavier Caddy got more pressure and got along better.
Remember its not race car cornering, its traction.

[VBP08GD3]

damn winter sux..i think.. we dont have winter in miami

[ricohman]

Winter weakness?
1. Heater can't keep the car warm at -30 or colder. At -45 its a joke.
2. Can't grab the sunvisor with mitts or heavy gloves.
3. Radio volume knob is impossible to adjust with mitts or heavy gloves.
4. Wipers are awful. Worst of any car I've owned. Freeze up and won't clear the windscreen.
5. Ground clearance could use another inch.
6. Hatch won't open when there is snow and ice frozen to the top of the rear bumper. Have to scrape the bumper to open the hatch. Thats not good for the paint!
7. OEM tires are marginal. But they aren't a true winter tire.

[airborne200208]

Winter weakness?
1. Heater can't keep the car warm at -30 or colder. At -45 its a joke.

Mine works fine at -60.

2. Can't grab the sunvisor with mitts or heavy gloves.

Don't need arctic mittens with the heat on, especially when the cars been plugged in.

3. Radio volume knob is impossible to adjust with mitts or heavy gloves.

Are your windows open? Whats with the gloves?

4. Wipers are awful. Worst of any car I've owned. Freeze up and won't clear the windscreen.

True. But Rain-X helps.

5. Ground clearance could use another inch.

When I go off roading I drive my Ridgeline.

6. Hatch won't open when there is snow and ice frozen to the top of the rear bumper. Have to scrape the bumper to open the hatch. Thats not good for the paint!

Wax that part before winter and snow and ice won't bond to it.

7. OEM tires are marginal. But they aren't a true winter tire.

Yep.

[Mefesto44]

I've had 3 Honda's during the 12 years I've been living in NW Montana. 91 Accord LX 2 door, 99 2 Door Civic DX, and now a 2008 Fit Sport. I have to say I think the Fit is the better performer out of the three.

The Fit really clings to the ice a lot better than the other models (all had studded snow tires during winter). I will agree that it "floats" a little much in deep fresh snow, but I find it just as manageable as my other two.

My wife drives a 99 Mercury Mountaineer AWD and she feels just as safe in the Fit.

[rosta420]

yeah winter is definitely the fits weakness. my wiper blades joints freeze up when it is snowing and below 32 degrees, the ice streak thing. i had my hatchback door freeze up once because it was iced up. i have to clean away snow around my wheel wells when i drive in snow or else the snow freezes and it rubs on my tires. one time the ice froze on my front tire rims and made my car shimmy so i took it to a car wash and melted the ice off the front tire rims, problem solved. i had my stock tires siped so my car doesn't have any traction problems and i haven't had any clearance problems.

[emillkim]

Thanks guys.
Reading these posts makes me thankful that I moved back to Los Angeles.
Sure the house prices suck. There's traffic. Fake boobs everywhere.
But man do I love the Sun.

Stay warm.

(on second thought that last thing on the list really isn't bad at all)

[zukered]

Originally Posted by airborne200208

2. Can't grab the sunvisor with mitts or heavy gloves.

Don't need arctic mittens with the heat on, especially when the cars been plugged in.

3. Radio volume knob is impossible to adjust with mitts or heavy gloves.

Are your windows open? Whats with the gloves?

Don't know how things are in Alaska, but good luck finding an outlet in any non-residential outdoor parking. Consequently, good luck keeping it warm while you're shopping or at work.

From a cold start when it's -30°C out, it takes me 3-5 minutes of driving at residential speeds before the cold engine light turns off (Scangauge consistently reports engine temperature at about 52°C when it does) at which point useable heat is just starting to come from the vents. Don't know how long it takes if you leave it just idling in neutral, I never idle more than a minute or two.

I don't have a problem adjusting the volume or getting at the visor using my mitts, but I see how thicker gloves/bigger hands would.

5. Ground clearance could use another inch.

When I go off roading I drive my Ridgeline.

City roads and highways don't count as off-roading. I'd understand not clearing wheel-well ice chunks the size of softballs, but I'm talking baseball-sized.

[cab0053]

Originally Posted by mahout

One of the worst 'old wives tales' is that heavier cars get better traction than light ones.
Best icer I ever ran was a 89 geo metro xFi weighing 1500 lb; with suitable tires, tall 155 width on 15" wheels, tires from WRC vintage. No 4 wheel truck, SUV, or anything other than a STi or WRX or Evo could touch it. And if the going got steep they couldn't either.
The trick getting around in snow and ice is having the least weight and most traction tires. (smaller tire patch, hence more pressure, spikes being the best)
Less weight means less chance of going sideways or getting stuck unless you put fat tires on it that had no road contact pressure. (thats why they use studs). Lighter weight easier to push aronud too, by engine or by driver, if need be.
Back in the old days, Caddys got around better than Fords because there wasn't much difference in the tire patch so the heavier Caddy got more pressure and got along better.
Remember its not race car cornering, its traction.

oh. ok.
bold stuff were really good reasons

[nevada72]

Great insights from people who definitely know winter driving - Ottawa, Alaska, NY state etc. This has been the 2nd of two very snowy winters here in Wisconsin. I can say it rivals what I have experienced in my winter travels all over Canada including the mountainous areas of BC. My observations -

-Winter tires absolutely make a big difference. At least mine do. I have 14 inch General Arctimax tires. They are a bit more aggressive than the Blizzacks on my minivan. They grip many varieties of snow and ice quite well. Remember - it is snow and ice. One has to be realistic. That said, I have never been even remotely close to sliding or getting stuck. I have to say that I can count on the Fit to get me through moderate storms. The obvious limitation is ground clearance. Due to the dilligence of our snow removal folks, it has been a non-issue so far

-The defroster does seem a bit anemic. It hasn't been overwhelmed, but I do have to turn the fan up higher than I do on other cars. Are you guys using recirculate or fresh air?

-Adding weight absolutely helps.....if you're in a pickup truck. It's all about getting the weight over the drive wheels. I can't think of any way to do that on a Fit. Plus, it would likely throw off the balance on a fairly well balanced car. Pickups are way off balance to begin with.

-I never do 2nd gear starts. Not saying there's anything wrong with it, but ime the Fit needs revs to get it rolling in 1st - no torque. I would think you would really wear the clutch with 2nd gear launches. First gear works for me with the snow tires I use. That said, I do rolling stops from 2nd gear when I can to save wheelspin.

-I was taught to avoid using my wipers or fluid in temps below 20F. I know there are times when the road spray is so thick it makes it hard to see, but unless it's above 20F, I tough it out until I can wipe off the windshield at a gas station. I've had too many times when I've smeared just enough semi-frozen windshield washer on my windshield to make it opaque and really make things scary. I can't say I've ever had a great winter wiper and I've tried many. Naturally I use low temp fluid despite my do not use protocol - just in case. ymmv

At the end of the day I consider the Fit a heck of a good all around car for winter especially considering the cost. When things get ugly I take my Yukon XL shod with Pirelli Scorpion winter tires.

[airborne200208]

How it works here is plug it in at home, then use the miracle of remote start with a 30 minute run time and 2 mile range to keep it warm when shopping or at work.

[polaski]

@nevada72

If the defrost is having trouble, I'll turn to recirc with the AC on. If you haven't deactivated it's automatic switch behind the dial you don't have to worry about that.

[nevada72]

Originally Posted by polaski

@nevada72

If you haven't deactivated it's automatic switch behind the dial .....

One can do that? Sounds like a great idea. I'll search for that. Thanks!

[wdb]

Originally Posted by nevada72

-I was taught to avoid using my wipers or fluid in temps below 20F. I know there are times when the road spray is so thick it makes it hard to see, but unless it's above 20F, I tough it out until I can wipe off the windshield at a gas station. I've had too many times when I've smeared just enough semi-frozen windshield washer on my windshield to make it opaque and really make things scary. I can't say I've ever had a great winter wiper and I've tried many. Naturally I use low temp fluid despite my do not use protocol - just in case. ymmv

I have to disagree here. If it's warm enough that you are getting road spray, it's warm enough that your washers and wipers should be functioning. If they're not, fix them so they do. Driving with intentionally limited visibility is just nuts.

[mahout]

Originally Posted by nevada72

Great insights from people who definitely know winter driving - Ottawa, Alaska, NY state etc. This has been the 2nd of two very snowy winters here in Wisconsin. I can say it rivals what I have experienced in my winter travels all over Canada including the mountainous areas of BC. My observations -

-Winter tires absolutely make a big difference. At least mine do. I have 14 inch General Arctimax tires. They are a bit more aggressive than the Blizzacks on my minivan. They grip many varieties of snow and ice quite well. Remember - it is snow and ice. One has to be realistic. That said, I have never been even remotely close to sliding or getting stuck. I have to say that I can count on the Fit to get me through moderate storms. The obvious limitation is ground clearance. Due to the dilligence of our snow removal folks, it has been a non-issue so far

-The defroster does seem a bit anemic. It hasn't been overwhelmed, but I do have to turn the fan up higher than I do on other cars. Are you guys using recirculate or fresh air?

-Adding weight absolutely helps.....if you're in a pickup truck. It's all about getting the weight over the drive wheels. I can't think of any way to do that on a Fit. Plus, it would likely throw off the balance on a fairly well balanced car. Pickups are way off balance to begin with.

-I never do 2nd gear starts. Not saying there's anything wrong with it, but ime the Fit needs revs to get it rolling in 1st - no torque. I would think you would really wear the clutch with 2nd gear launches. First gear works for me with the snow tires I use. That said, I do rolling stops from 2nd gear when I can to save wheelspin.

-I was taught to avoid using my wipers or fluid in temps below 20F. I know there are times when the road spray is so thick it makes it hard to see, but unless it's above 20F, I tough it out until I can wipe off the windshield at a gas station. I've had too many times when I've smeared just enough semi-frozen windshield washer on my windshield to make it opaque and really make things scary. I can't say I've ever had a great winter wiper and I've tried many. Naturally I use low temp fluid despite my do not use protocol - just in case. ymmv

At the end of the day I consider the Fit a heck of a good all around car for winter especially considering the cost. When things get ugly I take my Yukon XL shod with Pirelli Scorpion winter tires.

The reason to start in second instead of first is avoiding the sudden thrust you get when the clutch or auto finalizes engagement that causes the vtires to start spinning instead of rolling. It works. If you don't have a problem getting the tires rolling in first thats the way to do it.
But some of us got in places where initial motion had to be easier than we could get in first, second worked very well and actually put less wear & tear on the clutch..