SPARK PLUGS Which one is better?
#1
02-07-2014, 03:52 AM
SPARK PLUGS Which one is better?
I have a Honda Fit 2011 here in China, it came with DENSO SKJ20DR-M13 Iridium Sparkplugs
SKJ: 14x16 ( protected 0.7mm diameter miniature iridium plug) Thread Diameter/Hex size
20: Heat range 6
D: Reach 19.0 mm ( shroud 2mm)
R: Internal construction resistor
-M: Larger Ground Electrode
13: Gap 1.3mm ( .050”)
Unfortunately, due to my ignorance, I used the Plugs from my previous Honda Fit VK20, and recently, by mistake, I found out that DENSO's website advice:” In asia Market, use extended type iridium Power IK20L instead of IK20 no VK20) find below the differences as per the website:
I panicked and I put back the original (from factory) ones......funny thing is that I used that VK20 for 3 years!!!
When I changed the Plugs i realized that there were some sort of discoloration over 2 Coils which I replaced, no questions asked....
I dont know if the VK20 caused any problem to the Coils, or how the VK20 work in the car, but it ran ( lol).. some sort of loss of power which i blame to other causes not to the Plugs... I dont have any tool for running diagnosis ( I should have one perhaps..)
Now why I have to use IK20L in Asia? Couldn't find that answer anywhere on Denso's website or on the internet... or why VK20 can't be used.... Both Original and IK20L are iridium but website says their purpose is different. Electrode Diameter and ground electrode specifications also differ. Long life type ( SKJ20DR-M13) to High Performance Type (IK20L).. mmmm yes i like performance, but what would be the use of having a spark position.... at 5.0mm instead of 3.0mm?? or a longer Electrode 7.8mm instead of 5.5????
IK20L
I: VF High Performance Plug 0.4mm diameter Iridium
K: 14x19x16 Thread diameter, Reach, Hex Size
20: Heat Range 6
L: Spark Position 5 mm
SKJ: 14x16 ( protected 0.7mm diameter miniature iridium plug) Thread Diameter/Hex size
20: Heat range 6
D: Reach 19.0 mm ( shroud 2mm)
R: Internal construction resistor
-M: Larger Ground Electrode
13: Gap 1.3mm ( .050”)
Unfortunately, due to my ignorance, I used the Plugs from my previous Honda Fit VK20, and recently, by mistake, I found out that DENSO's website advice:” In asia Market, use extended type iridium Power IK20L instead of IK20 no VK20) find below the differences as per the website:
I panicked and I put back the original (from factory) ones......funny thing is that I used that VK20 for 3 years!!!
When I changed the Plugs i realized that there were some sort of discoloration over 2 Coils which I replaced, no questions asked....
I dont know if the VK20 caused any problem to the Coils, or how the VK20 work in the car, but it ran ( lol).. some sort of loss of power which i blame to other causes not to the Plugs... I dont have any tool for running diagnosis ( I should have one perhaps..)
Now why I have to use IK20L in Asia? Couldn't find that answer anywhere on Denso's website or on the internet... or why VK20 can't be used.... Both Original and IK20L are iridium but website says their purpose is different. Electrode Diameter and ground electrode specifications also differ. Long life type ( SKJ20DR-M13) to High Performance Type (IK20L).. mmmm yes i like performance, but what would be the use of having a spark position.... at 5.0mm instead of 3.0mm?? or a longer Electrode 7.8mm instead of 5.5????
IK20L
I: VF High Performance Plug 0.4mm diameter Iridium
K: 14x19x16 Thread diameter, Reach, Hex Size
20: Heat Range 6
L: Spark Position 5 mm
Last edited by camivill; 02-20-2014 at 09:49 PM. Reason: Revised some mistakes
#2
02-07-2014, 04:11 AM
1, 2 3 or 4 Ground Electrodies...
The point is after readin about Spark Plugs, I see that some guys have tried Plugs with 3 electrodes with good results.. but mostly are used in BMW or other models of cars....
NGK BKR6EQUP
B:14mm K: Hex size 5/8” R: Resistor Type 6: Heat Rating
E: 19mm thread reach Q: 4 Ground Electrodes U: Semi-surface Discharge P: Premium Platinum
BOSCH FGR6DQI Platinum Fusion
F: M14x1.25 G: Surface Gap Spark Plug. Ground Electrode
R: Resistor Type. 6: Heat Range D: Thread Length Spark 19mm (short tip) Q: 4 tips.
I can see that the electrodes are different in design, as the NGK ones are flat but the BOSCH have a slight bending end...
Now the questions is those 4 ground electrodes, besides lasting longer, do they represent any benefit?
Shall I go back to IK20L for better performance or shall I try something new without damaging the engine,,, or the coils?
NGK BKR6EQUP
B:14mm K: Hex size 5/8” R: Resistor Type 6: Heat Rating
E: 19mm thread reach Q: 4 Ground Electrodes U: Semi-surface Discharge P: Premium Platinum
BOSCH FGR6DQI Platinum Fusion
F: M14x1.25 G: Surface Gap Spark Plug. Ground Electrode
R: Resistor Type. 6: Heat Range D: Thread Length Spark 19mm (short tip) Q: 4 tips.
I can see that the electrodes are different in design, as the NGK ones are flat but the BOSCH have a slight bending end...
Now the questions is those 4 ground electrodes, besides lasting longer, do they represent any benefit?
Shall I go back to IK20L for better performance or shall I try something new without damaging the engine,,, or the coils?
#4
02-07-2014, 11:49 AM
So basically you got the IK20's when you should've gotten the IK22's?
As for those Bosch, I didn't have a good experience with them on my old Integra, switched back to NGK's & the car was running beautifully.
#5
02-07-2014, 12:16 PM
I've never had a good experience with Bosch plugs on higher comp motors. I have no idea why this is and it seems like a universal thing that gets thrown around a lot.
For the Fit I will be sticking with NGK or Denso plugs. Probably Denso IK22.
For the Fit I will be sticking with NGK or Denso plugs. Probably Denso IK22.
#6
02-09-2014, 07:31 AM
IK20 instead of IK20L.....
Which the difference is just a "longer" spark..... Position of spark is different....
So Bosch are not good...... How about those 3 or 4 tips? Is that better?
So Bosch are not good...... How about those 3 or 4 tips? Is that better?
#7
02-09-2014, 08:28 AM
At the shop, we generally don't substitute different plug types on customers cars because in some cases they cause problems.
That doesn't mean you will have a problem by using a plug with 3 or 4 electrodes but you must be willing to change to something else if you do.
That doesn't mean you will have a problem by using a plug with 3 or 4 electrodes but you must be willing to change to something else if you do.
Last edited by 2010FitSport; 02-09-2014 at 05:08 PM.
#8
02-09-2014, 12:51 PM
I have never seen a benefit to having more than one strap on the plug.
NGK or Denso plugs are the only ones I recommend to any who ask me, and for good reason.
You want a cheapo plug that works great in your fit? Get the Denso OEM plugs for a Honda S2000 2.0 liter, whether its partsstore or honda, the Denso plugs are great in our motors
NGK or Denso plugs are the only ones I recommend to any who ask me, and for good reason.
You want a cheapo plug that works great in your fit? Get the Denso OEM plugs for a Honda S2000 2.0 liter, whether its partsstore or honda, the Denso plugs are great in our motors
#9
02-10-2014, 06:31 AM
Okay so it seems IK22 is the way to go...
I am still wondering what is the difference on a IK20L in where the Spark Position is 5.0 instead of 3.0 mm and Spark electr Height is 7.8 nistead of 5.5 ..... as recommended byt DENSO website for cars in ASIA....
Hope one day i get to understand this...
I am still wondering what is the difference on a IK20L in where the Spark Position is 5.0 instead of 3.0 mm and Spark electr Height is 7.8 nistead of 5.5 ..... as recommended byt DENSO website for cars in ASIA....
Hope one day i get to understand this...
#10
02-20-2014, 10:01 PM
and the winner is ....
It seems that Spark plugs with unprotected center with short electrodes on sides tent to fail instead of last longer... lol
I have seen that the design that is commonly used, has the center protected by the center electrode from Gasoline and combustion, also those BOSH 4 electrodes one already not available at BOSCH website in western hemisphere replaced by other common models. Funny thing is those are in huge sale here in China ( I wonder why..lol).... with this in mind, a "normal" designed Spark Plug was the way to go.... and DENSO with that "extended" spark location caught my attention....
So I followed DENSO's advice and changed to IK20L, with dielectric grease.... delicious....
30,000 Km plugs....
And this is the comparison, on the left is the IK20L new, you can see the longer electrode and the protrusion of the spark location compared to the center, which is the original factory Denso. On right is the VK20.... used for 3 years... puff!
I did have the "wonderful" idea of use oil on the thread of the plugs when i inserted them a couple of weeks ago, AND NOW I KNOW THAT SHOULDN'T BEEN DONE.... because the oil damages the electrodes...
I also cleaned the Air throttle, and i got a very powerful engine back.
It used to be very sluggish at start, going to 1,000RPM and slowly going to 1500RPM during warm up....
Now it goes to 2000RPM with an easy soft startup, and the engine warms quicker, going down to 1000 RPM idle.
I know Sparks were not to be changed that oftern but, as I found the VK20 - IK20L issue i went for it without delay.....
And I am Happy again
I have seen that the design that is commonly used, has the center protected by the center electrode from Gasoline and combustion, also those BOSH 4 electrodes one already not available at BOSCH website in western hemisphere replaced by other common models. Funny thing is those are in huge sale here in China ( I wonder why..lol).... with this in mind, a "normal" designed Spark Plug was the way to go.... and DENSO with that "extended" spark location caught my attention....
So I followed DENSO's advice and changed to IK20L, with dielectric grease.... delicious....
30,000 Km plugs....
And this is the comparison, on the left is the IK20L new, you can see the longer electrode and the protrusion of the spark location compared to the center, which is the original factory Denso. On right is the VK20.... used for 3 years... puff!
I did have the "wonderful" idea of use oil on the thread of the plugs when i inserted them a couple of weeks ago, AND NOW I KNOW THAT SHOULDN'T BEEN DONE.... because the oil damages the electrodes...
I also cleaned the Air throttle, and i got a very powerful engine back.
It used to be very sluggish at start, going to 1,000RPM and slowly going to 1500RPM during warm up....
Now it goes to 2000RPM with an easy soft startup, and the engine warms quicker, going down to 1000 RPM idle.
I know Sparks were not to be changed that oftern but, as I found the VK20 - IK20L issue i went for it without delay.....
And I am Happy again
Last edited by camivill; 02-20-2014 at 10:06 PM.
#11
06-30-2014, 02:50 PM
I have a Honda Fit 2011 here in China, it came with DENSO SKJ20DR-M13 Iridium Sparkplugs
SKJ: 14x16 ( protected 0.7mm diameter miniature iridium plug) Thread Diameter/Hex size
20: Heat range 6
D: Reach 19.0 mm ( shroud 2mm)
R: Internal construction resistor
-M: Larger Ground Electrode
13: Gap 1.3mm ( .050”)
Unfortunately, due to my ignorance, I used the Plugs from my previous Honda Fit VK20, and recently, by mistake, I found out that DENSO's website advice:” In asia Market, use extended type iridium Power IK20L instead of IK20 no VK20) find below the differences as per the website:
I panicked and I put back the original (from factory) ones......funny thing is that I used that VK20 for 3 years!!!
When I changed the Plugs i realized that there were some sort of discoloration over 2 Coils which I replaced, no questions asked....
I dont know if the VK20 caused any problem to the Coils, or how the VK20 work in the car, but it ran ( lol).. some sort of loss of power which i blame to other causes not to the Plugs... I dont have any tool for running diagnosis ( I should have one perhaps..)
The plug comparison is fascinating.Quire large differences in heat conduction (heat range) and actual reach. And the electrode pad is interesting for its purpose. And are the gaps really supposed to be that different? And whats that little shiny pillar between eltrode and center pin? very interesting.
Now why I have to use IK20L in Asia? Couldn't find that answer anywhere on Denso's website or on the internet... or why VK20 can't be used.... Both Original and IK20L are iridium but website says their purpose is different. Electrode Diameter and ground electrode specifications also differ. Long life type ( SKJ20DR-M13) to High Performance Type (IK20L).. mmmm yes i like performance, but what would be the use of having a spark position.... at 5.0mm instead of 3.0mm?? or a longer Electrode 7.8mm instead of 5.5????
IK20L
I: VF High Performance Plug 0.4mm diameter Iridium
K: 14x19x16 Thread diameter, Reach, Hex Size
20: Heat Range 6
L: Spark Position 5 mm
SKJ: 14x16 ( protected 0.7mm diameter miniature iridium plug) Thread Diameter/Hex size
20: Heat range 6
D: Reach 19.0 mm ( shroud 2mm)
R: Internal construction resistor
-M: Larger Ground Electrode
13: Gap 1.3mm ( .050”)
Unfortunately, due to my ignorance, I used the Plugs from my previous Honda Fit VK20, and recently, by mistake, I found out that DENSO's website advice:” In asia Market, use extended type iridium Power IK20L instead of IK20 no VK20) find below the differences as per the website:
I panicked and I put back the original (from factory) ones......funny thing is that I used that VK20 for 3 years!!!
When I changed the Plugs i realized that there were some sort of discoloration over 2 Coils which I replaced, no questions asked....
I dont know if the VK20 caused any problem to the Coils, or how the VK20 work in the car, but it ran ( lol).. some sort of loss of power which i blame to other causes not to the Plugs... I dont have any tool for running diagnosis ( I should have one perhaps..)
The plug comparison is fascinating.Quire large differences in heat conduction (heat range) and actual reach. And the electrode pad is interesting for its purpose. And are the gaps really supposed to be that different? And whats that little shiny pillar between eltrode and center pin? very interesting.
Now why I have to use IK20L in Asia? Couldn't find that answer anywhere on Denso's website or on the internet... or why VK20 can't be used.... Both Original and IK20L are iridium but website says their purpose is different. Electrode Diameter and ground electrode specifications also differ. Long life type ( SKJ20DR-M13) to High Performance Type (IK20L).. mmmm yes i like performance, but what would be the use of having a spark position.... at 5.0mm instead of 3.0mm?? or a longer Electrode 7.8mm instead of 5.5????
IK20L
I: VF High Performance Plug 0.4mm diameter Iridium
K: 14x19x16 Thread diameter, Reach, Hex Size
20: Heat Range 6
L: Spark Position 5 mm
Be aware you did one of the worst things you can do to an engine ! Just because the old car was the same make does not mean the new engine has the same physical plugs. I hope you did check that; its absolutely standard practice.The reach and electrode design can be different and when the old plug has less actual reach, that is extension into the combustion chamber, due to plug design you will cause the plug ti hit the piston at top dead center and the result is catastrophic costs, usually new cylinder head and pistons at best. Even the crankshaft is potential damaged.
You can check with plug manufacturers on the net to find suitable alternate plugs but at least always compare the firing ends of old and new plugs to make sure the new ones won't protrude into the chamber.
You have some leeway in heat range to match your driving conditions but in your case you don't sound like the high revving type so the OEM range is likely best.
And are you sure the hex is 20mm and not 14? Whats that shiny pillar between the electrode and center pin? Are the gaps really that great on the 3 plugs?
Last edited by mahout; 06-30-2014 at 02:52 PM.
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