Hi All
I have a Jazz\Fit 2009 base GE8, 196 000Km purchased in 2012 on 130 000Km in the last few months my fit has had a loss of power or stutter under load, when accelerating or uphill, the "stutter" is from around 4500 rpm up, it is also generally sluggish. On idle it is smooth, no hunting etc.
I have done the normal service (Oil, Oil filter, air filter) also changed spark plugs, and the fuel filter, I have cleaned the coil packs and tubes (that fit onto the spark plugs) and covered the tubes with dielectric grease.

I am now at a loss as to what the problem is, can someone shed some light on my problem.
I have read (on fit freak) that one of the coil pack could be the problem if idle is erratic but idle is fine/smooth

Any ideas anyone?

 

At that km level, I would also check the valve clearances. Not saying this is your problem, but it wouldn't hurt to check that all are within spec.

 

I personally found that erratic idle on my '07 GD3 was due more to valve clearance issures than to coilpacks. On my Fit, erratic idle was cured with a valve adjustment, not coilpack replacement.

From what you have described, I am guessing that you have at least one weak coilpack. On my Fit, I was able to remedy the hesitation by decreasing the spark gap down to 0.35". Doing so immediately got rid of the problem, and returned the power back to normal. The good news was that I was able to delay replacing a coilpack.

If you are able, try regapping your plugs. If the GEs are anything like the GD3s, it shouldn't take more than 30 minutes of your time.

I find that running a gap smaller than factory spec is not a problem. I am presently running Denso IK-22s with a 0.32" gap with no loss in drive-ability or fuel economy. I recently installed a Hondata Flashpro, and my engine revs freely to 7,200 rpm without problem.

 

I have now done the valve clearances, all set to spec, and set the spark gap to .35
Any more ideas to help me

 

why such a small spark gap?


I run .50 with the S2000 sparkplugs I have.

Smooth as butter!

 

I reduced the spark gap on suggestion from macbuddy, but it did not make any difference.

 

13fit, I ran 0.50" when my coilpacks were new, and my Fit also ran smooth as butter. As the miles piled up, the coilpacks started to weaken. I was able to regain performance by closing the gap. Eventually the weakest coilpack fried. My theory was that the wider gap put too much stress on the coilpack, which caused premature failure. Our GD coils may not be as robust as your newer model.
Anyway, since Brian was not able to get rid of the hesitation after closing the gap, and performing a valve adjustment, it definitely sounds like he has at least one dead coilpack.
I was able to determine which cylinder had the bad coil with the use of a Scangauge2. I replaced the faulty coil, and it's been running great ever since!

 

Looks like I'm going to have to go to the dealer for a diagnostic, as I am in South Africa, most of the suppliers of Scangauge2 and the like, will not ship to SA, and they end up costing a fortune to get hold of.

 

I kinda figured I will eventually need to lower the gap. I Keep forgetting my car still has under 30k miles.

On monday or tuesday, I leave for wisconsin. That long trip will help guide me on whether I need to reduce the gap a bit.


I am going to be researching the specs on our coils, as I hope to eventually find a much more reliable replacement.

I honestly wish honda had gone cheap and simply reused K20 coils, as those seem to last much longer then ours. But different coilpacks can have dramatically different design.

Good thing we have the intrawebbernetzz!!

 

Brian, you could try buying just one new coilpack, and systematically swapping it out with cylinder, i.e. 1, then 2 etc. Test the performance after each install, and see if you can solve the misfire issue.
You might want to take a look at my checklist:
https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/1st-...coilpacks.html
Good luck, let us know what the fix is for your Fit.

 

I got hold of a coil pack, and tried it on each cylinder, and found no noticeable change, thinking now that more than one coil is not happy, so have booked it at the local Honda dealer for a diag test, for R650 (about $60)
Will let you know the outcome.

 

One sanity check, should be free at your friendly neighborhood auto parts store (autozone does it here, I have no idea if this is the same company there), would be to pull OBD codes. Even if the check engine light isn't on there may be clues stored there. Of course this is the first thing Honda will do...

 

We do have Autozone, but they just sell spares and don't do Diags, the other mechanics also do it, but are for some unknown reason more expensive than Honda.

 

Check around. Do-it-yourself parts stores here provide this service free. It's a 5 minute check for them and enables selling lots of parts.

 

Ok, Diags done and they did not find 1 fault, everything was perfect, I took the tech for a drive to show him the problem, he said he did not now what could be causing the fault as the Diags showed nothing. I don't think these guys are mechanics, they just know how to replace something if the computer says they must. the service manager said I must book the car in for 3 days so they (in his words) can swap components out to find the problem.
I then spoke to the guy in spares, as I had got stuff from him before, he told me to go to another Dealer up the road and speak to the service manager there as he knows him personally and thinks he can solve the problem.
I went to that dealer explained the problem, he took the car for a drive, and after 2 min in the car said the Catalytic converter is blocked, put it on the lift took it out and sure enough it was blocked. (it was the second one) he said they can replace it for R10 000 (around US$920) but said not to replace it but to remove it, to go to an exhaust place and get them to cut it out and put a straight pipe in. I did this R200 (US$18) and problem solved.

They hooked up the Catalytic to an air supply and there was maybe 2% coming out the other end.

Its amazing how some people are more than willing to help, but others couldn't care.

 

thanks for updating. I think their ability to help is also a determining factor. The 2nd guy knew what he was doing.

This is the 2nd catalyzer in 196k KM (about 120k miles)? What's killing the cats? They typically last the life of the car here. Clogging is usually caused by the things overheating/melting as a result of incorrect fuel/air ratios.

There's something else at work...

 

When we got it out it looked like it had come apart and melted on the engine side, the other side the honeycomb structure looked perfect, and holding it up to the light you could not see any light through it.

On the engine side the inside of the pipe was white, he said it was running lean to compensate for the blockage, on the back inside it was black. He also said the ECM will reset itself now there is no blockage.
Funny the guys that did the diag said everything was 100% normal that should include fuel/air ratios?

 

The check would include air/fuel, but it's the air/fuel ratio as determined by the car's own o2 sensors unless they used an external analyzer. The car's sensors could be bad, but not bad enough to throw a code. Analyzing the exhaust with an external device (a wand they stick up the tailpipe) would be the next check.

If an o2 sensor or mass air flow (MAF) sensor is bad this would not get the best fuel consumption.

Is it using a lot of oil or coolant?

 

Not using any coolant, and 500ml oil every +-3 months (+- 7500km)

 

That's not a lot. And I think carbon fouling would look different even if it were using a lot of oil. You had the plugs out so I'm guessing these looked clean.

I don't know enough about the chemistry to know the effects of leaded/bad fuel; I don't think it would cause a blockage.

It's possible to bench test the sensors but this would be expensive. Exhaust analysis would be the first thing to check if you're curious. If fuel consumption and performance in general is ok I wouldn't worry about it.