Kraftwerks comparo...well kinda

[eldaino]

So there has been some talk about what kind of acceleration times we are looking at when those who want to upgrade to the KWSC.

I did some research online yesterday to look at weights of cars that some people were mentioning that they'd like to see their supercharged fits keep up with, especially since, if you are anything like me, supercharging a cheaper (price wise) car, is usually more cost effective than dishing out 5 more years of car payments on something more powerful.

what i'm posting may have been useful in the kraftwerks thread, but i knew this was going to be long and i didn't want to sidetrack the thread.


There are 2 cars in particular i'll be discussing: the current Si sedan, and the current civic EX sedan.

The si is one of the newer cars i'd like to be able to at least suprise every now and again at a stoplight.

I used to be a an owner of an 06 civic ex sedan, which according to the newest dyno sheet from kraftwerks, makes around the same hp to the wheels (slightly more tq and hp, but more weight as well.) many have also brought up the fact that the r18 would be the perfect engine for a fit si, given its tq and overall hp.


the following...erm...well 'table' i guess you could say shows basic specs, and then how many lbs each unit of horsepower has to lug around. the results i thought were pretty interesting. i know they don't tell the whole story, but this is all subjective.

So here is what i figured:


07 Honda civic Si sedan:
197 hp @7800rpm
139lb-ft tq @ 6100 rpm
weight: 2945lbs
lbs per hp: 14.95

07 Honda Civic EX sedan:
140hp @ 6300 rpm
128lb-ft tq @ 4300rpm
weight: 2738lbs
lbs per hp:19.56

07 Honda Fit:
109hp @ 5800 rpm
105lb-ft tq @ 4800 rpm
weight: 2471lbs
lbs per hp: 22.67

07 Kraftwerks Supercharged Honda Fit (base kit, no other mods)
145hp@ 6000 rpm
129 lb-ft tq @ 5800 rpm
weight: 2471lbs
lbs per hp:17.04


if you are wondering how i got the numbers for the KWSC i just figured the gains from stock to supercharged, and then added that to the engine producing hp numbers from honda. these numbers are still only a guesstimate, but, well, you know.

The kraftwerks fit losses almost 6lbs per hp, which is amazing! its not as good of a power to weight ratio as the civic si, (and its even more apparent when you take into consideration the ligher weight coupe) but its still a much better number! its better than an ex sedan, and granted that one of those runs 0-60 in about eight some odd seconds, a mid 7 second fit is not too shabby!

JDM chris' fit is even more powerful: judging by the numbers in siphon, hes at an estimated 160 engine producing hp, which give him a power to weight ratio of about 15.44 lbs per hp, almost as good as the si, and almost no real world difference! (remember his kit has the upgraded injectors, a cat delete, and full exhaust, and he has lightweight wheels.)


Again guys, this is all speculation and if it helps give 1 person a better idea of how his or her fit will be transformed after SCing, its worth it.

[tricolor]

Good work! Untill we get more numbers from KR and from The Chosen Few who will test the kit in real life situations, it is fun to speculate.

[TOOL]

Thanks man, really helpful post. +1 rep to you!

Tyler

[lidoshorty02]

that really helps and gives me a god look at wat 2 expect

[ToyotaLover]

kwsc only produces 121hp stock with sc only. chris has upgaded injectors and cat delete with full exhaust which adds a percentage to the figure.

so a stock fit with sc only is 121hp to the wheels adding rougtly 30hp to stock on MT.

[JDMchris.com]

I Do Not Have Upgraded Injectors

[ToyotaLover]

Originally Posted by JDMchris.com

I Do Not Have Upgraded Injectors

so 34hp from
headers
downpipe(cat delete)
exhaust
b-pipe

that's big gains from those minor additions.

[JDMchris.com]

yup, thats all the mods I have. I have the exact kit you guys will be buying.

[vince]

how much does the entire super charger kit weigh?

[eldaino]

Originally Posted by TOOL

Thanks man, really helpful post. +1 rep to you!

Tyler

thanks man!

[eldaino]

Originally Posted by ToyotaLover

kwsc only produces 121hp stock with sc only. chris has upgaded injectors and cat delete with full exhaust which adds a percentage to the figure.

so a stock fit with sc only is 121hp to the wheels adding rougtly 30hp to stock on MT.

i got my figures from subtracting the stock hp figure from the supercharged one and adding that gain to the stock engine producing number.

so basically it was about 95 ish hp plus the about 33 hp gain,hence the 145 number.

chris doesn't have the upgraded injectors, like he said, so you are still looking at a killer setup. 30hp to the wheel is a big number from a F.I. bolt on at such low psi. and look at that tq curve! looks like i'll be happy with just this and an axle back until the fit is paid for and i can do a whole h/e and injectors set up.


and to the poster who mentioned weight...i dunno about that, but i would imagine that the difference isn't huge.

[Tofuman]

you have to take torque into consideration too.

07 Kraftwerks Supercharged Honda Fit (base kit, no other mods)
145hp@ 6000 rpm
129 lb-ft tq @ 5800 rpm
weight: 2471lbs
lbs per hp:17.04
lbs per lb-ft: 19.16

'00 Honda Civic Si
160 hp @ 7600 rpm
111 ft-lbs. @ 7000 rpm
weight: 2601 lbs.
lbs per hp: 16.26
lbs per lb-ft: 23.43

'05 Honda Civic Si
160 hp @ 6500 rpm
132 lb-ft @ 5000 rpm
weight: 2782 lbs.
lbs per hp: 17.39
lbs per lb-ft: 21.08

[ToyotaLover]

Originally Posted by Tofuman

you have to take torque into consideration too.

07 Kraftwerks Supercharged Honda Fit (base kit, no other mods)
145hp@ 6000 rpm
129 lb-ft tq @ 5800 rpm
weight: 2471lbs
lbs per hp:17.04
lbs per lb-ft: 19.16

'00 Honda Civic Si
160 hp @ 7600 rpm
111 ft-lbs. @ 7000 rpm
weight: 2601 lbs.
lbs per hp: 16.26
lbs per lb-ft: 23.43

'05 Honda Civic Si
160 hp @ 6500 rpm
132 lb-ft @ 5000 rpm
weight: 2782 lbs.
lbs per hp: 17.39
lbs per lb-ft: 21.08

per the Kraftwerks website the HP to the wheels is 121.3
Kraftwerks USA Products

so i guess crank is 145

[REXXXXXXXXX]

Good work! Untill we get more numbers from KR and from The Chosen Few who will test the kit in real life situations, it is fun to speculate.

Speculation is the only thing thats keeping me alive right now lol... I wouldn't say i'm "The Chosen Few", but I will definitely be dyno-ing, testing, comparing, etc. as soon as i get mine installed next month! Good job with the numbers. SI's goin' down! lol

[Tofuman]

BASE Fit 5MT with KraftWerks S/C
145hp@ 6000 rpm
129 lb-ft tq @ 5800 rpm
weight: 2432 lbs.
lbs per hp: 16.77
lbs per lb-ft: 18.85

take that, all you Sport owners...

j/k

[tricolor]

Originally Posted by ToyotaLover

so 34hp from
headers
downpipe(cat delete)
exhaust
b-pipe

that's big gains from those minor additions.

Indeed... huge gains! More than the Base SuperCharge by itself, no?.
Now my question to Chris or anyone who has some similar experience with the Intake/Header/CatBack exhaust:Is a 20hp gain realistic with this combo? And if so, would the swap to a Cat Delete (downpipe) add another 14hp on its own?

I am just trying to make sense of all these numbers flying around on this tread and on other related treads.

[GD3-Fit]

Originally Posted by tricolor

Indeed... huge gains! More than the Base SuperCharge by itself, no?.
Now my question to Chris or anyone who has some similar experience with the Intake/Header/CatBack exhaust:Is a 20hp gain realistic with this combo? And if so, would the swap to a Cat Delete (downpipe) add another 14hp on its own?

I am just trying to make sense of all these numbers flying around on this tread and on other related treads.

Chris' Fit has the KWSC.
Of course he's going to gain much more power rather than if he was NA
And no, a test pipe would add at least 5whp

[JDMchris.com]

when i only had the header, testpipe, exhaust i made 100whp after the SC i am now 155ish

[navadv]

If the kit can make the car do sub 7 sec quart. mile timings, i will be SOooo happy!

[Tofuman]

^ you want a funny-car dragster?