Doug Thorley Supercharger & Kraftwerks Supercharger Comparison Thread

[JDMchris.com]

Originally Posted by Mr_ET

Just so everyone is informed here OP could you give us more details about this SC kit and why it is very very similar to the KW SC kit?

Maybe some background info on yourself and why this would be a good choice?

I just want to let everyone know that this is the OLD supercharger design I had on my car BEFORE the Flaws with the Kit were Fixed. My Kit was also improved to make up for the LACK of low end torque. There is no considerable difference from stock numbers until almost 1/2 way through the powerband on this kit if you look at the dyno. I believe from my old dyno it wasnt until about 3500rpms. Theres actually a loss of torque under stock for the first few thousand RPMs.

So a recap... this is a old less efficient design kit i had that was improved to the kit I have now. Let me tell you the difference in the Kits were like night and day. This is my .02 cents.

[smatts]

Well hopefully they can tweak this kit so that it doesn't have the problems that your old kit used to have. The price on this kit is really good.

[JDMchris.com]

Originally Posted by smatts

Well hopefully they can tweak this kit so that it doesn't have the problems that your old kit used to have. The price on this kit is really good.

Unfortunately thats not possible...

I know these flaws arent fixed on the kit because we encountered them AFTER partnership was ended. BTW it is not a easy fix


notice the HUGE difference in low end torque

[tricolor]

Originally Posted by JDMchris.com

.. this is a old less efficient design kit i had that was improved to the kit I have now. Let me tell you the difference in the Kits were like night and day.

Chris, don't you take your upgraded injectors in account? and headers, and downpipe?

Just trying to remain impartial here

[JDMchris.com]

I was running the same mods when I was running this kit...

here is my old dyno... as you can see i am making WAY more low end torque with my new kit. Something this design wasnt able to achieve.



this is with header back and upgraded injectors.... Remember to safely run on this design with header and test pipe u NEED the upgraded injectors or it will run lean. Will they offer this with a new fuel map? probably not. I am very familiar with both of these designs as i was the FIRST to be the test mule for the Kits.

[Illusive]

Originally Posted by tricolor

Chris, don't you take your upgraded injectors in account? and headers, and downpipe?

Just trying to remain impartial here

The OP did say that they made 3 runs, one was a base pass, one was the base kit installed, and the final one with headers and exhaust. Not sure if the upgraded injectors were installed (I think Chris' comments above reflect that they were, but he will need to confirm), but the KW one does seem to make a lot more low end torque. Also, there is about 10-15hp difference with all the upgrades between the two kits.

[tonyd3773]

Maybe it is just me but what is 500 bucks now a-dayz?
If hypothetically I went the S/C Route there would be NO way 500 bucks was going to stop me from purchasing the KWSC Kit....JDMCHRIS just got finished telling you this was the exact kit he had......and from his statement above soundz like the gap between the NEW n OLD kit was huge!!! This is just my logic.....my 1 cent..

[JDMchris.com]

Originally Posted by ToyotaLover

any info on a AT version? Also...any info on a group buy that is significantly lower in price then the KWSC kit? Maybe a $500 discount how KWSC is doing for your next group buy?

probably no Auto kit as they did not design this kit and will require a different setup.

Originally Posted by ToyotaLover

keeps the reliability without doing a ton of other changes, injectors etc

When adding certain mods it will make this kit run lean and injectors will have to be upgraded period. I am speaking from experience ON THIS KIT. I was REQUIRED to run injectors when I had the kit? Why because my motor wouldnt last long without them. My best interest is the Fitfreak community and the reliability of their cars. Since I am the FIRST/ONLY person to have experience with this kit (besides this company) I feel its my responsibility to post Correct TRUTHFUL information.

[s0x]

Originally Posted by JDMchris.com

When adding certain mods it will make this kit run lean and injectors will have to be upgraded period. I am speaking from experience ON THIS KIT. I was REQUIRED to run injectors when I had the kit? Why because my motor wouldnt last long without them. My best interest is the Fitfreak community and the reliability of their cars. Since I am the FIRST/ONLY person to have experience with this kit (besides this company) I feel its my responsibility to post Correct TRUTHFUL information.

TESTIFY BRUTHA HALALUJA!!!!

[ToyotaLover]

Originally Posted by JDMchris.com

When adding certain mods it will make this kit run lean and injectors will have to be upgraded period. I am speaking from experience ON THIS KIT. I was REQUIRED to run injectors when I had the kit? Why because my motor wouldnt last long without them. My best interest is the Fitfreak community and the reliability of their cars. Since I am the FIRST/ONLY person to have experience with this kit (besides this company) I feel its my responsibility to post Correct TRUTHFUL information.

I didn't state that(what you quoted)....but to add to that. I'm guessing that the little piggy back from this kit is identical to the KWSC kit. This sounds very interesting as people purchasing this kit might be able to get the KWSC injector upgrade.

[TOOL]

Originally Posted by tonyd3773

Maybe it is just me but what is 500 bucks now a-dayz?
If hypothetically I went the S/C Route there would be NO way 500 bucks was going to stop me from purchasing the KWSC Kit....JDMCHRIS just got finished telling you this was the exact kit he had......and from his statement above soundz like the gap between the NEW n OLD kit was huge!!! This is just my logic.....my 1 cent..

I agree. This kit may be good, and really done right. But how do i know? This guys just joined and posted that he is selling a SC for the Fit..? Do you have a Website? I mean if im going to shell out 3k+, i want to make sure i know what im getting and who im dealing with. If that costs me a extra 500$ so be it.
Plus if you really want to succeed in the Fit community, start making a SC for the AT.
Just me .2 cents.

Tyler

[JDMchris.com]

Originally Posted by rider307g

I will also throw out an offer to anyone in the area if they want to see the car or take a ride in it, just give us a call. Also, I will try to post some info about the fuel mixture and see if I can download it off of our dyno for everyone to see to prove that it does not run lean. Again, our car has over 12000 miles on it without any issues and anyone is welcome to come and look at it. Also, are kits are available.

I didnt say its running lean now... but when some other mods are thrown in the mix it will for sure. I had that kit on my car for about 10k before it was switched so I know it just as well as you.

Carb legal? no
2 year warranty? no

[JDMchris.com]

Originally Posted by ToyotaLover

I'm guessing that the little piggy back from this kit is identical to the KWSC kit.

This is untrue

[ToyotaLover]

Originally Posted by JDMchris.com

This is untrue

Chris,

I have not been on Fitfreak.net for long, and have not meet you in person but from my observations you need to be more diplomatic on things and also stop jumping to conclusions.

Reason is, is that you are making it sound like you are preaching KWSC all the time. I’m not saying KWSC is bad, it’s just that without it being publicly available we don’t have solid information for it yet. Nor do we have info on this SC setup. You also have to understand that besides KW, AEM already has an injector controller that does the same thing. It doesn’t have a pretuned map yet, but in due time, it’ll perform to what the KWSC Supercard will do and more as it also has ignition retard, and potential to expand to wideband in the future and is retailed for $465.

In the pass you jumped to the conclusion that you didn’t have injector upgrade, then you slang T1R on the power output and that KWSC didn’t need the injector upgrade where T1R did which wasn’t the case and now you slang this kit saying it is a bad unit to the Fit community. I’m not saying which is better, or which is not I’m just seeing that you get on the defensive a lot, and that’s not cool and kind of makes KWSC questionable at times as different info was provided multiple of time (I know it was cleared up in the later posts). You could of just say something like “This was the original KWSC kit that was not to par with the current kit and at the time of testing had fuel issues with headers, and full exhaust”. I know businesses partnerships change, and fall apart, and good friends turn to bad through businesses, but no need to put down this kit. Let the people discover the strengths and weaknesses from data and actually vehicle installs.

So be more diplomatic and I think you will earn a lot more respect from cynical members like me.

[GAFIT]

Well said ToyotaLover!

Whether the Doug Thorley kit is good or not has yet to be seen. I can tell you that they are a reputable company that has been making products for domestics for longer than I've been alive. I remember their Tri Y headers from when I was a kid.

[JDMchris.com]

This is off topic, but the injector thing was a miscommunication between myself and Oscar because they were originally removed, but i didnt know they were put back in. In any case I was never Bashing the T1R kit, I always said it was a good kit. Ben is good at what he does.

Back on topic. Being more "diplomatic" What I am saying is with me being the test mule for the kit, which I ran for almost 10k We found things that REALLY needed to be fixed, and those of you who followed my thread in the past now about the issues I had. When these Issues happened Jardine/Thorley was no longer in the picture... so these issues were never fixed on the kit that they are currently selling. Nor do they have any idea what the issues are.

I am just looking out for the FF community. If you had purchased and run into some issues with a crank pulley that would malfunction, and another member was interested in getting one what would you say? Would you not state your experience with the pulley and warn the potential buyer?

[ToyotaLover]

Originally Posted by JDMchris.com

This is off topic, but the injector thing was a miscommunication between myself and Oscar because they were originally removed, but i didnt know they were put back in. In any case I was never Bashing the T1R kit, I always said it was a good kit. Ben is good at what he does.

Back on topic. Being more "diplomatic" What I am saying is with me being the test mule for the kit, which I ran for almost 10k We found things that REALLY needed to be fixed, and those of you who followed my thread in the past now about the issues I had. When these Issues happened Jardine/Thorley was no longer in the picture... so these issues were never fixed on the kit that they are currently selling. Nor do they have any idea what the issues are.

I am just looking out for the FF community. If you had purchased and run into some issues with a crank pulley that would malfunction, and another member was interested in getting one what would you say? Would you not state your experience with the pulley and warn the potential buyer?

You did very well being diplomatic..but I would state it this way:

"When this version of the kit was on my car (test mule), we had experience a few problems that Thorley may not have known. For more information feel free to contact me or read post ## of link XX."

well good to know, and if they potentially have that problem, like to hear their side of the story too.

[JDMchris.com]

Originally Posted by GAFIT

Well said ToyotaLover!

Whether the Doug Thorley kit is good or not has yet to be seen. I can tell you that they are a reputable company that has been making products for domestics for longer than I've been alive. I remember their Tri Y headers from when I was a kid.

I am aware of the company and yes Many of the parts they make are great, as well as those prototype Headers for the Fit. Just saying I had the Kit and ran into issues. I am VERY familiar with the SC kit as it was on my car for some time.

[ToyotaLover]

Originally Posted by JDMchris.com

I am aware of the company and yes Many of the parts they make are great, as well as those prototype Headers for the Fit. Just saying I had the Kit and ran into issues. I am VERY familiar with the SC kit as it was on my car for some time.

THey would have to be or KW wouldn't of initially contacted them to build the kit in the first place...correct? Is this the main reason why KW is no longer making headers?

Oh damn....sorry i'm way off topic.

[JDMchris.com]

Originally Posted by ToyotaLover

well good to know, and if they potentially have that problem, like to hear their side of the story too.

The crank pulley thing was a ex. not what actually was wrong. Just so there is no confusion