NOT dual rate!! There are NO dual-rate springs available to us at the present time, Tyler.
Ooops..They arent dual rate, they are progressive rate...Whats the diffrence?
Tyler
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No more Crotas. . .
Ivan,
Please keep me posted either in this forum or the Bay Area sub-forum (and EXWRX too) if the mini-meet for suspension comparisons works out. Any time/place is OK for me. Obviously, dry weather would be best for safety reasons, but I don't need much of an excuse to go to a Fit meet.
Happy Holidays to you and Tamara (still not sure of the spelling!).
Dave
Ohh ill be there aswell!!! Someone make a topic in the Bay area Sub-Forum.
Tyler
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No more Crotas. . .
Ooops..They arent dual rate, they are progressive rate...Whats the diffrence?
Tyler
ciburri,
Please correct me if I describe this incorrectly- I have no personal experience with dual rate springs. Tyler, it is my impression that since dual rate springs are made from wire that has a thinner cross section at each end, getting thicker in the middle coils of the spring, the behavior of the spring is in smaller compression ratio, the spring is softer. With greater compression, as in hard turns with more body mass on the outside spring, the spring rate is harder/stiffer, making body roll less.
Progressive rate springs just get stiffer with more compression. They start our stiffer than stock, maybe similar to stock depending upon the maker, then get more stiff in hard turns.....
So far, every maker of after-market springs only offers lowering springs. What I, and at least EXWRX, are looking for is stock ride height, with softer ride characteristics on the freeway expansion joints, but stiffer ride in hard compression circumstances in overload conditions and hard turns, with NO CHANGE AT ALL in ride height. Nobody addresses these issues except for KG/mm, now unavailable from Japan.
Ok i see...Then the Eibach pro-kit seems like the best bet for me.
Its a little bit of a drop- 1.6Front, 1.3back and i dont think it would be too stiff of a ride. If Ivan has these i have to ride in his car before i buy them lol. I wont be buying them for a while though. First rims.
Thanks Dave,
Tyler
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No more Crotas. . .
Hey Guys, make sure that you post the date and time when this mini meet comes together. I too would be interested in experiencing the different ride qualities of the various springs mentioned/installed in this forum. BTW, I'll even volunteer to provide sausages for "nutrition break" during this next meet. Keep me in the loop!
Hey Ciburri, do you know the exact model number(s) of the Kg/mm springs that apply to our Fits? As I mentioned to you last meet, my cousin travels to Japan several times a year. I'll see if he can bring back a few sets for us.
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Progress Swaybars save gas...I no longer brake for turns! I/H/E+BTC = HP+Kinesthetics
To keep this thread on topic ill go make a "Ride quality mini meet" thread in the B-A Sub Forums..
Tyler
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No more Crotas. . .
Ok i see...Then the Eibach pro-kit seems like the best bet for me.
Its a little bit of a drop- 1.6Front, 1.3back and i dont think it would be too stiff of a ride. If Ivan has these i have to ride in his car before i buy them lol. I wont be buying them for a while though. First rims.
Thanks Dave,
Tyler
Uh, Eibachs ARE stiffer than stock. Every ride I've had up till now, I've put Eibach progressive-rate coils on, and they're definitely stiffer. If you're wanting a lesser drop, you should go with the GF210s anyway. Or write to H&R and see if they plan on producing their O.E. Sports (.8" drop in front, .5" drop in rear) for the Fit.
One thing to note about the Eibachs, depending on if you're dropping with Sportlines or Prokits, is that they're not exactly developed with your stock struts in mind. The Progress coils and the GF210s are; they're not simply the springs from a coil over kit made available seperately. At least, that's what the manufacturers are saying .
Either way you go, as soon as you drop your ride with only springs, you will be putting a bit more stress on the factory dampers, and as such, shortening their lives exponentially. Hopefully, KYB or someone will make aftermarket dampers, but with the new Fit on the way, I kinda doubt it.
Hey Guys, make sure that you post the date and time when this mini meet comes together. I too would be interested in experiencing the different ride qualities of the various springs mentioned/installed in this forum. BTW, I'll even volunteer to provide sausages for "nutrition break" during this next meet. Keep me in the loop!
Hey Ciburri, do you know the exact model number(s) of the Kg/mm springs that apply to our Fits? As I mentioned to you last meet, my cousin travels to Japan several times a year. I'll see if he can bring back a few sets for us.
Hi Mike-
You might want to PM Ivan to get the right spring model numbers for KG/mm. I will gladly provide cash up front to anyone who can bring a set of these to the U.S. I am not looking for low priced deals, and realize that there will be extra costs involved. I just want to be certain, from "ciburri's" details, that whatever springs I am paying in advance for will actually fit my car. I will even accept a minor drop- 1" to 1 1/2", because I assume that in "overload" conditions, the increased spring rate in compression will keep the car from dropping as far as it normally would with stock springs.
Thanks in advance for your offer of sausages for the suspension comparo "mini-meet". If this comes off, I will bring another propane mini-BBQ to speed up food prep.
hey Carlos Alicea
im from Bayamon, very near from San Juan..
BTW..back on topic..i really apreciatte how everybody is comparing springs, specially the both im undecided with, Progress or Eibach's Pro Kit. Just to give some info, Eibachs are bumpy..a friend of mine had a set on his Lancer and took em off since it bothered him way too much. Just a heads up though.
hey Carlos Alicea
im from Bayamon, very near from San Juan..
BTW..back on topic..i really apreciatte how everybody is comparing springs, specially the both im undecided with, Progress or Eibach's Pro Kit. Just to give some info, Eibachs are bumpy..a friend of mine had a set on his Lancer and took em off since it bothered him way too much. Just a heads up though.
fits_all-
Thanks for your input. We'll keep this thread going for quite a while because there is a lot of interest in improving handling as well as comfort with replacement springs.
There is no part number on Kg/mm website, jut a listing under Honda, GD3 and then it shows two models. SS-super sport and R-race. Obviously SS is the way to go for daily drivers and stock shocks. R is for hardcore track cars with occasional street use.
On the top right click on DUAL RATE and check the flash video animation for explanation on how dual rate works.
Dave you are correct. Depending on a car model primary spring is on the top, bottom or middle of main spring rate. It is very rare even for spring manufacturers to have the ability to wound coils with more than one progressive rate. From what I can tell they vary the thickness of the wire for primary rate.
It is hard to judge spring brands across the board. Sometime they do more research on one car model than another and come up with better ratios. Sometimes types of cars (sedan, SUV, wagon, coupe,...) work better with one brand than another. Keep in mind that judgement is subjective to each individual. What one considers perfect might be opposite for others.
Macbuddy, just one set is bulky enough to be carried on a plane let alone few. If we can get reliable contact at Kg/mm, thanks to your cousin, that can ship us sets to US that would be the best. Somebody we can contact from US. We can set up group buys and go for it. Problem is that Kg/mm severed ties with every single distributor world wide. They are up to something. They cover very small but very specific track market in Japan. They just might be content with that at this point. Who knows!
If your cousin can actually visit them and speak to them directly that would be by far the best. At some pint I clicked on some link at their web page and run into their address and phone number, but kill me I can't find that again. LOL!
Guys, let's just get one set here somehow and test it out before we go full force. Let's make sure each individual likes it. There is no need for anybody to jump in a fire by him/herself. If everybody interested pitches few bucks, we can get a set and everybody can drive it. Equal rights to everybody. If somebody does not like it, they can get out and get their few bucks back. Somebody will like them and buy them out. If they are anything like what I have on my CRX at the moment (no reason to believe they are not!), I am sure it will be me! My wife will kill me! I am yet to go back to work sometime in January!LOL!
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Religious: WRC, F1,........... Rides: 07 MR Fit Sport A/T - 90 CRX Si (track bound) - 06 Civic EX Sedan A/T
That drop looks pretty minimal in comparision to what I look at nowadays (actually it looks stock...). Hmm. Setup?
BTW, y'all I've been riding around (on the icy street of KC, nonetheless) with FULL cargo (long story but the short of it is that I have two DJ's gear in my car right now ) est weight of 600 lbs and the Progress coils are holding up pretty well. No rubbing on the stock shoes over speed bumps , but I do hear the springs more under this heavier load. Fronts are quiet, but the rears aren't so much.. Its not just the springs either, I can hear the shocks' valve-action when entering driveways and stuff. I usually ride with the radio, but I turned it off yesterday and today just to zone in on the car and noticed this stuff. I don't think its a big deal, I just don't remember hearing that with the stock coils. However, I've never had so much loaded in the back of the car either, so that may be the issue... questions questions..
Last edited by Bahumut; 12-08-2007 at 06:22 PM.
Reason: Hastiness
There is no part number on Kg/mm website, jut a listing under Honda, GD3 and then it shows two models. SS-super sport and R-race. Obviously SS is the way to go for daily drivers and stock shocks. R is for hardcore track cars with occasional street use.
On the top right click on DUAL RATE and check the flash video animation for explanation on how dual rate works.
Dave you are correct. Depending on a car model primary spring is on the top, bottom or middle of main spring rate. It is very rare even for spring manufacturers to have the ability to wound coils with more than one progressive rate. From what I can tell they vary the thickness of the wire for primary rate.
It is hard to judge spring brands across the board. Sometime they do more research on one car model than another and come up with better ratios. Sometimes types of cars (sedan, SUV, wagon, coupe,...) work better with one brand than another. Keep in mind that judgement is subjective to each individual. What one considers perfect might be opposite for others.
Macbuddy, just one set is bulky enough to be carried on a plane let alone few. If we can get reliable contact at Kg/mm, thanks to your cousin, that can ship us sets to US that would be the best. Somebody we can contact from US. We can set up group buys and go for it. Problem is that Kg/mm severed ties with every single distributor world wide. They are up to something. They cover very small but very specific track market in Japan. They just might be content with that at this point. Who knows!
If your cousin can actually visit them and speak to them directly that would be by far the best. At some pint I clicked on some link at their web page and run into their address and phone number, but kill me I can't find that again. LOL!
Guys, let's just get one set here somehow and test it out before we go full force. Let's make sure each individual likes it. There is no need for anybody to jump in a fire by him/herself. If everybody interested pitches few bucks, we can get a set and everybody can drive it. Equal rights to everybody. If somebody does not like it, they can get out and get their few bucks back. Somebody will like them and buy them out. If they are anything like what I have on my CRX at the moment (no reason to believe they are not!), I am sure it will be me! My wife will kill me! I am yet to go back to work sometime in January!LOL!
Ivan, thanks for your latest info.
Mike (macbuddy), if your cousin is at all interested in helping with this, I will still send you cash up front to hold in payment to your cousin for a set of KGM Model "SS" springs to fit the Honda GD3. With the weak U.S. dollar, and no retail dealers anywhere from which to buy these things, who knows what the cost will be until someone actually contacts the manufacturer. If I am the only one for whom your cousin is doing the shopping and transport back to the U.S., I will add a 15% commission for his trouble.
My offer will stay open until or unless your cousin says "No thanks, not interested", or I find some new source for similar sounding springs. In the unlikely event that the latter happens, I will contact you directly to cancel my offer to your cousin and to let you know about the springs that I found instead, then will post info. for general discussion.
I am SERIOUS, and do not say things that I don't mean. But for anyone with personal business in Japan to lug home a 20lb. box of springs for somebody else would be a huge PIA.
drop looks really nice.
Either springs they are, please give some info about them. Bumpy, comfort etc...
yep, i have progress springs and sway bar. a little stiffer than stock, but also bouncy due to stock shocks. overall, not that bad, but i wouldn't go any lower with OEM shocks.
Mike (macbuddy), if your cousin is at all interested in helping with this, I will still send you cash up front to hold in payment to your cousin for a set of KGM Model "SS" springs to fit the Honda GD3. With the weak U.S. dollar, and no retail dealers anywhere from which to buy these things, who knows what the cost will be until someone actually contacts the manufacturer. If I am the only one for whom your cousin is doing the shopping and transport back to the U.S., I will add a 15% commission for his trouble.
My offer will stay open until or unless your cousin says "No thanks, not interested", or I find some new source for similar sounding springs. In the unlikely event that the latter happens, I will contact you directly to cancel my offer to your cousin and to let you know about the springs that I found instead, then will post info. for general discussion.
I am SERIOUS, and do not say things that I don't mean. But for anyone with personal business in Japan to lug home a 20lb. box of springs for somebody else would be a huge PIA.
Dave
Hey manxman, I will contact Gnak and see what he says. Just for the record, he loves cars and cannot leave any of his cars alone. He mods everything he owns, and lowering a car is one of his passions. If I had to trust anyone to come back with the "right stuff", it would be him.
macbuddy
__________________
Progress Swaybars save gas...I no longer brake for turns! I/H/E+BTC = HP+Kinesthetics
Hey manxman, I will contact Gnak and see what he says. Just for the record, he loves cars and cannot leave any of his cars alone. He mods everything he owns, and lowering a car is one of his passions. If I had to trust anyone to come back with the "right stuff", it would be him.
macbuddy
macbuddy,
Thanks for pursuing this, and thanks in advance to your cousin. If it doesn't work out for him for whatever reason, that's OK. If it does work out, I'll even drive to Modesto to pick the springs up.
ciburri's suggestion of a more cautious approach makes sense, but I am impatient to try the dual rate springs, and am willing to risk the investment. So many others don't seem to mind a harsher ride along with lowered stance, so if these springs are at all disappointing (if I ever get them at all), I can probably find a buyer in NorCal.
Thanks again---
Dave
P.s. Sorry to go so far off topic since my comments have nothing to do with Progress springs. Thanks for the Progress info. that everybody posted- most of you seem happy with them, but you have helped me to definitely decide against them.
Someone make a topic in the Bay area Sub-Forum.
I/H/E+BTC = HP+Kinesthetics
.
) est weight of 600 lbs and the Progress coils are holding up pretty well. No rubbing on the stock shoes over speed bumps 
, but I do hear the springs more under this heavier load. Fronts are quiet, but the rears aren't so much.. Its not just the springs either, I can hear the shocks' valve-action when entering driveways and stuff. I usually ride with the radio, but I turned it off yesterday and today just to zone in on the car and noticed this stuff. I don't think its a big deal, I just don't remember hearing that with the stock coils. However, I've never had so much loaded in the back of the car either, so that may be the issue... questions questions..
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