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Being an electrician, I know the importance of grounding. I was planning on putting together a grounding wire system for my Honda Fit. I can put together a system for much cheaper (and using custom wire paths, and colors of insulation) using appropriately gauged cable. However, I first decided to take some baseline resistance measurements to see how well the grounding systems works from the factory.
The following measurements were take from the battery to the location mentioned. Note, 0 ohms is continuity.
Negative (-) battery terminal to...
Exhaust manifold - 0 ohms
Engine - 0 ohms
Radiator support - 0 ohms
Left Inner Fender - 0 ohms
Right Inner Fender - 0 ohms
Metal holding the driver's side rear taillight - 0 ohms
***Note - I ran an 8' long wire clamped to the metal near the taillight housing to near the battery, that way my Fluke meter's leads would be able to reach... This way also - the electrical path was effectively DOUBLED.
RESULTS - the Honda Fit is very well grounded from the factory; an aftermarket grounding wire kit is unnecessary.
Perhaps those connections may degrade over the years, and I'll replace the factory grounding wires. But for now - there is no benefit.
Some websites/manufacturers would have you believe that a grounding wire kit is an easy power upgrade. Not so. Just take the following quote: When you replace your stock grounding wires with the SCO grounding cables, don't be surprised if you notice increased torque, better gas mileage, quicker throttle response, more starting power, a smoother idle, and better sound from your stereo. Best of all, you only spent about 50 bucks and less than an hour to get all those benefits. Source: SportCompactOnly.com
Now putting a grounding kit an a 1969 Chevrolet Camaro (or a similar old car) would probably result in a much better grounding path throughout the vehicle. But our cars aren't old enough yet for a grounding upgrade.
__________________
NHBP Fit Mods:Tint (27% sides, 20% rear)... max legal in SC Louder horn, Self-install aux jack, Undercoating, jerry-rigged sound proofing, Rubber floor mats, ScanGauge-II, Lightened gas-foot.
2007 Honda Fit, 1998 Honda Civic EX
Last edited by AppleMac*Fit; 12-01-2007 at 10:24 AM.
Reason: Added image
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nice. I'm sure I speak for everyone in saying thanks for taking the time to do the footwork on this and posting your results.
It seems that A LOT of those universal bolt-on power add-ons are supposed to increase performance, but I'm always doubtful as to if they provide said gains to said vehicles. My thinking is: Just because one thing works on an Accord doesn't mean it's going to work as well, if at all, on an NSX.
Being an electrician, I know the importance of grounding. I was planning on putting together a grounding wire system for my Honda Fit. I can put together a system for much cheaper (and using custom wire paths, and colors of insulation) using appropriately gauged cable. However, I first decided to take some baseline resistance measurements to see how well the grounding systems works from the factory.
The following measurements were take from the battery to the location mentioned. Note, 0 ohms is continuity.
Negative (-) battery terminal to...
Exhaust manifold - 0 ohms
Engine - 0 ohms
Radiator support - 0 ohms
Left Inner Fender - 0 ohms
Right Inner Fender - 0 ohms
Metal holding the driver's side rear taillight - 0 ohms
***Note - I ran an 8' long wire clamped to the metal near the taillight housing to near the battery, that way my Fluke meter's leads would be able to reach... This way also - the electrical path was effectively DOUBLED.
RESULTS - the Honda Fit is very well grounded from the factory; an aftermarket grounding wire kit is unnecessary.
Perhaps those connections may degrade over the years, and I'll replace the factory grounding wires. But for now - there is no benefit.
Some websites/manufacturers would have you believe that a grounding wire kit is an easy power upgrade. Not so. Just take the following quote: When you replace your stock grounding wires with the SCO grounding cables, don't be surprised if you notice increased torque, better gas mileage, quicker throttle response, more starting power, a smoother idle, and better sound from your stereo. Best of all, you only spent about 50 bucks and less than an hour to get all those benefits. Source: SportCompactOnly.com
Now putting a grounding kit an a 1969 Chevrolet Camaro (or a similar old car) would probably result in a much better grounding path throughout the vehicle. But our cars aren't old enough yet for a grounding upgrade.
you sir get super props. you've saved a lot of kids a good bit of money.
nice. I'm sure I speak for everyone in saying thanks for taking the time to do the footwork on this and posting your results.
You're welcome!
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyd3773
So what would your thoughts be on a voltage stabilizer? Since we are on the topic of electric current. Thanks for the info on the electric ground! GD3blaze07'
I think I started a fire in the voltage stabilizer discussion. I'll defer to my previous comments... they're in that thread. For my full thoughts, refer to that discussion. But in summary: their useless
Quote:
Originally Posted by kennef
you sir get super props. you've saved a lot of kids a good bit of money.
No problem.
__________________
NHBP Fit Mods:Tint (27% sides, 20% rear)... max legal in SC Louder horn, Self-install aux jack, Undercoating, jerry-rigged sound proofing, Rubber floor mats, ScanGauge-II, Lightened gas-foot.
I don't belive in grounding kits being worth the cost. Does it work? I think it's possible.
BUT, let me say this. Just cause there is minimal resistance doesn't mean you can't benefit from a ground kit. All that means is you have little resiatnce and voltage drop across that is very little........at certain AMPS!!! If you increase you amps that grounding connection might not hold up and cause a bottle neck in the system;not let enough amperage draw and drop you voltage.
Here is an example:
Lets's say you measure the ground on the engine block to chassis ground. There is very little resistance but it's using 16gauge ground. Yes, there is little ground but at certain RPM's voltage is being draw, the current will be limited by that ground cable as well as other ground cables on that engine. You will suffer performance and can cause a failure.
Another example:
You hook up a 1K watt RMS Amplifier for you subs. They recomend 0 gauge wire but you choose 8 gauge instead. If you measure, resistance will be minimal and amp will perform good will volume and gain at low levels but as you turn up the volume and bass boost you will be limited but how much current can be draw.
I hope I explained it well enough. BTW, I'm not speaking out of my ass, I know electronics. I have a electronics degree, Have worked in car audio/video/security for 6 years before doing Avionics.
Conclusion:
For basic bolt ons like Intake/header/exhaust you won't really need a ground kit in my opinion (you might have a different opinion and I respect that.)
Once you start boosting, chipping, increasing you redline etc etc then I believe an grounding upgrade is essential for maximum performance.
Conclusion:
For basic bolt ons like Intake/header/exhaust you won't really need a ground kit in my opinion (you might have a different opinion and I respect that.)
Once you start boosting, chipping, increasing you redline etc etc then I believe an grounding upgrade is essential for maximum performance.
LOL....you really have no clue
boosting horsepower will NOT deem it necessary to have better grounding. the ignition and ecu are working no harder. hell, the only thing that's increased is heat and fuel consumption....and those, in no way, effect the need of a fit's grounding system to be increased.
If you start upgrading your ignition system it will affect it. I'm not so sure how the ignition system works in our fit but in my EG the grounding gave me a better feel of the power. Idle seems to be smoother and power in RPMS from 6K-9.5K improved.
you mean you're eh? eg's are in japan, not the US.
and why would you need to upgrade your ignition? EVER? shit, even in a civic/teg with a b-series...you don't need to upgrade ANYTHING over stock until around 600whp. you'll NEVER make anywhere CLOSE to that in a fit with the 1.5L, EVER
but, even up grading the ingnition won't make the grounding system any less efficent.
you're just thinking about this the entirely wrong way. i mean, i've built a LOT of fast hondas, a LOT. some in the low 700whp range...and we logged everythign that could/would be affected...and never needed a ground upgrade.
ground kits are rice, just liek all the voltage stabilizers and fuel magenents and shit....jdm, rice. horseshit
If you start upgrading your ignition system it will affect it. I'm not so sure how the ignition system works in our fit but in my EG the grounding gave me a better feel of the power. Idle seems to be smoother and power in RPMS from 6K-9.5K improved.
How did you measure this mystical increase in power and idle smoothness.. butt dyno??
Your ideas about electrical "bottlenecks" do not compare to the real science of current flow you need to learn a lot more about the flow of current before making unsupported statements like yours.
you mean you're eh? eg's are in japan, not the US.
Thanks Captain Obvious!
And as far as this argument, I'm done with it. I've posted what a theory and you're still not proving me wrong. You're still gonna need to upgrade when you reach a certain extent. Maybe not in a fit but I was talking in general.
How did you measure this mystical increase in power and idle smoothness.. butt dyno??
Your ideas about electrical "bottlenecks" do not compare to the real science of current flow you need to learn a lot more about the flow of current before making unsupported statements like yours.
I understand the whole concept of current. You're current WILL be limited by factors that may include wire size.
Now again, you may never reach that in a Fit with it's 1.5L engine, I was talking in general.
BTW, am not here to argue with anyone just for the sake of arguing. I respect what your guys opinion and I believe we may be in the right track with a little misunderstanding.
Overall, I don't believe it's worth a ground kit. I was just explaining something.
But I do believe if theres ground loop issues this MAY help solve it.
Sounds like a placebo, not saying it won't help. I know my 73 Celica could have probably used one. Due to previous owners wiring hacks and electrical items not being properly grounded.
Iono, maybe I am second guessing this. I noticed when I turned on the heater today. The lighting seemed to flicker, then later this evening when the cooling fan kicked on my headlights flickered. But maybe I am being over worried. I guess I will just just wait and see.
Iono, maybe I am second guessing this. I noticed when I turned on the heater today. The lighting seemed to flicker, then later this evening when the cooling fan kicked on my headlights flickered. But maybe I am being over worried. I guess I will just just wait and see.
A grounding kit isn't going to help that... I think a capacitor might be more up your alley.
Park in front of a wall at night and try rolling the windows up when they're all the way up. The draw from the window motors dims the headlights.
BTW, its nice to see someone use a little bit of brainpower before they get a lump in their pants over some ricer JDM ad copy and empty their wallet faster then if they were on a date with a gold digger.
Iono, maybe I am second guessing this. I noticed when I turned on the heater today. The lighting seemed to flicker, then later this evening when the cooling fan kicked on my headlights flickered. But maybe I am being over worried. I guess I will just just wait and see.
i have my hid ballasts close to my battery and i have a teeny spoon battery. when i installed my hid's, i started to get that interference sound with my ignition and in fifth gear, i would get this weird low tone through my stereo speakers. i put in a grounding kit, it didnt help at all. BUT as desperate as i was, i decided to try a voltage stabilizer and BAM! problems solved. i took out the grounding kit and it was still perfect. i agree that the grounding kit had little to no effect on my problem but the voltage stabilizer came through for me.
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