How much damage was done to my engine??

[Brenda414]

Hi there! I am new to this site and I was hoping to get some people's perspectives about how much damage was done to my 07 Fit from a recent trip. I was going out of town so I got the oil changed in my car. They told me needed a new air filter, I said okay, I'll get one when I get back. I went to the desert and the car sat there for almost a week with the dirt flying around from all the dust storms. When I left it was running really rough. It was jolting and jumping when I was driving in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gear. The engine warning light came on, but there was nowhere to stop as I was in the middle of nowhere. I finally stopped 50 miles later and opened the hood and noticed that my air filter was not attached to the car. It was just kinda laying in my engine bay. So that means dirt and dust had blown in there during the week it sat. I reattached the air filter and drove home. The engine light turned off shortly after. The car seems to be running fine, but I am really worried that this could've done some permanant damage to the motor. Does anyone have any suggestions or input about if I am going to have a lot of problems with the car now. I have a friend that said my motor is probably shot now and will not last near as long as it should. I intend to take it back to the shop I took it to and have them change out the oil again, but I really doubt they will take any liability for the damage that is done. They will probably say I have no proof they are responsible, even though I had it done right before I left and no one else touched the car since. Its pretty frustrating. Any help about this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks so much!!

Brenda

[kenchan]

hard to tell cause we can't tell how much sand and foreign matter your engine sucked in...

if your engine is running normally chances are it will probably run fine... but who knows how much damage was done.

was this at like a jiffylube place?

[Brenda414]

It was at Big-O tires. Grrrr......Cant believe they did that still!

[stevet47]

Definitely complain. Get them to pay the bill for having your engine inspected.
If it had been left off and you noticed it before it ran rough, then no big deal, but the fact that it was running bad worries me.

[TurboManGT]

I would throw a fit!!! That is unacceptable

[kenchan]

Originally Posted by Brenda414

It was at Big-O tires. Grrrr......Cant believe they did that still!

they need to update their store name to Big-NO.

[Watsoff]

Dirt damage is in the top 5 worst things that can happen to an engine. However, you may be lucky...based on yer description, the dust storms happened with the car not running. Seems to me, at worst, you had a fine layer of powdery junk common from desert dust storms....it gets everywhere. When you drove off, the engine more than likely ingested some. Question is...how much? What did the engine compartment look like when you checked under the hood? As for the rough running...I'm guessing it's from the air cleaner box being completely disconnected from the throttle body (there's at least one sensor on that box), and not necessarily from dirt ingestion.

What can you do....stay away from dealers.

Before you drive it any further drain oil, flush engine with a formula designed for this condition (AMSOIL Engine Flush), replace oil filter, fill with new oil.

Remove the air cleaner box, blow-it-out, then wipe/clean all reachable interior surfaces...with the air box off, you've probably got powdery dirt on the after-side of the filter. Insert new filter.

Remove, inspect/clean, or maybe replace your plugs.

Fuel additives...this one is highly debateable, but you may wanna look into how Seafoam and/or Lucas fuel treatment may (or may not) help your situation.

Finally, find a local, reputable Import/Honda specialist and tell them your story. Actually, if you do find one, call them first. My guess is they'll wanna do some of the same things I listed above...flushing, replacement, cleaning. I believe it's SOP to do a compression check on all 4 cyclinders. Best case scenario, you've got no compression loss, and the flushing/cleaning/replacing is all that's required. If you've got compression loss, well....don't focus on that right now. Do whatcha can above, and get it to a specialist.

[lostpacket]

You need a leak down test. NOT a compression test as they might want to do. A leak down test pressurizes the cylinder and measures how much is lost. A high loss level indicates compression loss. A new engine should have 3-4% loss at best. If they want to do just a compression test, make them pay for a leak down as a compression test can fool you into thinking it is good when it is not. Also, a leak down test can isolate which valve is bad (i.e you can hear air rushing through intake if it is an intake valve).

What happens is the sand enters through the intake valve, goes through the combusion chamber and out the exhaust value. What this means is you can get sand on both the intake and exhaust valves. If you do, it can hold the valve open a little and also cause it to burn. This is due to combustion gasses getting to the valve when it should be shut. A leak down test will detect valve leakage.

The next thing is sand that gets on the combustion walls. This is not as likely to do much as you would need a lot of sand over time to really scratch the walls. Still, get a leak down test to see if it hurt the cylinder walls.

[jsusanka]

if it helps any two cars ago I got my oil changed at jiffy lube and they left the oil cap off. drove around all day without it on and oil was basically everywhere in the engine bay.

took it back to them and gave them a piece of my mind and then I never went back there again.
from other stories I hear mine was was minor so I consider myself lucky I guess.

those places are alway ripoffs too - they are always trying to sell you something you don't need.
I had also had one place try to tell me I needed an air filter when I had an oem replacement k&n air filter installed lol. I also wonder about their oil too even though I just got it changed it sometimes didn't look to clean so I wonder sometimes if they actually change it.

anyway those days are done I take both my cars to the dealers and bring amsoil and watch them change it. they also let me look underneath the car too just for grins. the dealers I work with really treat me well so I guess I am lucky there. I will never ever go to any quicky oil change places anymore.

[solbrothers]

sup brenda

[qbmurderer13]

I can't believe people are still getting service done at these quick lube places after all the horror stories all over the internet.

[Red 05]

That's why when they say "Oh it looks like you need new tires, or need to replace your AC compressor belt" just flat out say no. Unless you really like being charged through the nose for nonsense services that you probably didn't need in the first place.

After Chrysler failed to put back together the airbox on our cruiser THREE TIMES IN A ROW we now do everything ourselves, from oil changes to suspension bushings. Saves you money and gives you the piece of mind that you did it yourself and you know you did it right and there's no guessing or hoping.

[Vanishing Point]

Come on people! Learn to change your own oil and do routine maintenance and do not use these shoddy run businesses!

[seeremlive]

Originally Posted by TurboManGT

I would throw a fit!!! That is unacceptable

While the fit is light, I wouldn't suggest throwing it.

Anyway, I would have a leak down and a scope of the cylinders. They can take out the spark plugs and look into the engine with one of those fiber optic cameras. Any deep scratches are a cause for concern especially in a modern tight tolerance engine. I do this on old Outboard boat motors before I buy them if I plan on fixing it for resale and not keeping as a non running display model. If I can get a camera for under $150 for home use, a dealer shop should have one.

[kenchan]

um yah, leak test is great, but i wouldn't want BigNo to ever touch my car again if they cant even do the airbox right. lol

have BigNo agree to a leak test at the dealer and they will pay for it (sounds most reasonable?) but then remember that your car will then be on the black list for any
future warranty claims on the engine.... something to think about.

[TurboManGT]

Originally Posted by seeremlive

While the fit is light, I wouldn't suggest throwing it.

Lol I agree, I should have worded it differently

[mikejet]

Make sure you have your receipt and then file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. The did wonders when my Civic's engine started knocking after an engine flush.

[Brenda414]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone! I will take the car in for an engine flush and a leak down test this week. So, I took the car back to Big-No (haha) but the store manager wasn't there. I told them what happened and the guy in charge just had this stupified look on his face. They changed the oil and said that there was no debris in the oil and that it looked clean. They said the engine didn't throw any codes either. I mean, how much of that I can believe, who knows. He then went on to tell me how the car is fine and that that wouldn't cause much damage. Of course he is going to say that though, as he is covering his ass. Im going to call and talk to the manager and raise some hell and demand that they pay for me to get the proper diagnosis. Gotta get all fired up and make myself sound as scary as possible! Grrrrr.....Lol. Im really worried they wont accept any liability and wont agree to pay for any repairs or inspections. I wont take that BS lying down though. I will def. call the Better Business Bureau.

Anyways, to answer a few of your questions. The motor did have a layer of dust all over it. Every nook and cranny of the car did. I took the car there cause I dont know how to change the oil by myself. My ex used to do that stuff, so now I am trying to learn to take care of the car on my own. I have learned that those places are bad and will not be taking my car to one of them ever again. Oh, and I never believe what they say when they say you need this or that. I always try to get a friend to give me a second opinion. I am not all about being taken advantage of by some douche bag at a car shop!! I will let you all know what happens. Thanks again for the advice!!!

[Vanishing Point]

Brenda,
You might give this dealership a try for service. I've done business (Honda parts/accessories) for several years and they are nothing short of professional. Just a thought.....

Company Information - H and A Accessories.com

[Texas Coyote]

Oil change dudes need to be tested for use of illicit substances..... Wacky tobaccy makes some folks stupid.