This is exciting! Can't wait to see the result. I've been busy with an electrical issue trying to unlock my flashpro...hope to have an exciting update as well soon. Good luck!

 

This came today...

 

Started the cam install tonight. Is going to take me longer than expected. It has to come out the side of the head which means it has to go through the space occupied by the main wiring harness. Can't come out without removing the fuel rail/injectors and complete harness that runs all the way over to the alternator. Thankfully, I'm not in a hurry. This is also Halloween week so lots of plans with the son. Maybe I'll have it done by end of next weekend.

 

Eagerly awaiting your results. Good luck! Any pictures of the cam? They are a rarity round these parts.

 

Not a whole lot to see, but here goes...

 

Very cool!

 

 

Stock cast camshaft above and Cat Cam billet below for comparison.

 

There we go! Seems a bit ridiculous to not have cam caps and be able to lift it straight up on a OHC cylinder head, but ok Honda. At least you didn't have to remove the head.

 

I got curious as to what the FSM had to say... Having completed the cam removal now and seeing as they don't list some of the items you pulled, did you find it worthwhile/necessary to do so? (Sometimes the FSM is wrong... )

 

Yup, it is basically wrong. I have the FSM and this section just isn't accurate or is glossing over major steps. One glaring error is it says to use a 27mm wrench to hold the camshaft. Well, it's 29mm, not 27.

One of the things it glosses over is that "remove harness holder from bracket" on 6-24. It only lists a few of the items you have to disconnect in order to remove that harness from the bracket. It's all one wiring bundle all the way to the alternator and includes the fuel injectors, starter motor, etc connections.

If there's a way to do it by removing less, I don't know what it would be. Even with what I removed, I had to pull pretty hard on that wire you see on top of the camshaft. The cam can't fit over without also removing the radiator hose, so I lifted it up and pulled the camshaft out between the two.

None of it's hard. Just takes time.

Here's where I'm at now...

 

Well, I had this finished a couple of days ago, but on start up, it sounded like it needed a valve adjustment. So, tonight I re-adjusted the valves again to tighter settings. I now have them set to the tightest factory specs. Quieted it down, but it still has that clacking/need adjustment sound.

Debating whether or not I should adjust them a tad tighter still.

One thing I already know is that I will need to bump the idle a tad. It tries, but fails to catch the idle after a poke at the throttle. Guessing it needs a bit more timing and fuel at idle, but I'll try just bumping the idle to 850 or so and see what happens. It sounds cammed, but extremely mildly. Factory domestic v8's still have more cam sound, but it does now have a bit of roughness to the idle. I would like even more. LOL

Hoping to dyno it this week. I'll check with the shop for an appointment.

 

Bumped idle to 850...wasn't enough. Bumped it more...wasn't enough. Finally set it at 1050 and it still wouldn't hold idle.

So, I added timing and fuel to the cells that are all around idle. Still wouldn't catch itself. So, I added nearly triple the original fuel and about 4 degrees of timing, but only around the idle cells. Now it works!

I don't want to mess with the rest of the tune because I want an honest dyno number based on only dropping in the cam and doing nothing else. That being said, I don't think you could drop in the cam and not have a way to tune the car. My Fit at least would not idle without modifying the tune.

Will probably datalog the dyno session so that I can check A/F at WOT.

Edited to add...even with the extra fuel it's staying around 14.5:1 A/F at idle. It would probably like a bit more fuel still.

 

Wow, hopefully it gives nice power up top. 😎

 

Took it for a drive. Can't say it feels any faster, but it definitely pulls harder up top now. Looking forward to getting it on a dyno to see if it's a placebo effect that's in my head or real.

I think I have the idle set pretty well and the valvetrain sounds happy.

 

Glad to see that it's in and running (ish). I'm curious as to the gains as well!

My thoughts are... Have you checked for vacuum leaks? Did you clean the throttle body when it was off? Have you reset the TB? When was the last time you reset the TB? Is your VTEC solenoid operating properly? Did you double and triple check that the engine timing is 100% spot on? A mild "sport" cam shouldn't have come down idle issues or mandate tuning, our wideband ecu should have enough range to compensate for it, especially with an electronic TB. Also, you shouldn't have to add fuel at idle considering that (IIRC) our L15A's VTEC disables one of the intake valves until 1200 rpm.

 

Thanks for the ideas! I appreciate ALL feedback.

The thing to keep in mind with our GD's is that they are speed density. So, they really can't adjust for any changes without a tune if the change is outside of some narrow parameters. Not complaining...I like speed density.

I think the volumetric efficiency of the aftermarket cam is just quite a bit less at idle which has to be compensated for with timing and fuel.

Datalog shows it's not lean with the exception of idle, so I'm pretty sure the wideband is doing it's job and I'm pretty sure there isn't a vacuum leak. Not saying it's not possible.

TB was not touched. Not even removed from the intake. I take off the entire assembly as one piece for ease.

VTEC is kicking in as usual up top. Wish it was like a k20 with a hard hit, but it's still doing it's usual mild hit. It runs pretty hard all the way to the rev limiter.

I'll know more when it goes on the dyno and I can get good datalogs. Not too concerned though since this is only a small step. It will all be coming back apart shortly.

It's running great with my timing and fuel changes. For better or worse. LOL And, don't worry...I will not be the final tuner. I'll leave that to a professional.

 

That makes for two of us, I'm a huge fan of speed density as well. Especially from a tuning/modification perspective. I would like to disagree on your point that is a narrow parameter system, speed density can be incredibly flexible and most OEMs map their systems to allow for a wide range of factors (and sensor degradation) knowing that the vehicle may land anywhere in the world with greatly varying conditions. Consider the variances of Death Valley to Pikes Peak to Central Florida, in North America alone, and then consider regional fuel qualities... True in that the idle VE may be lower via the cam change (contact Cat Cams perhaps?), I think I'm stuck on my experience and expectation that with the sport cam you chose it wouldn't exhibit any change in idle, or mild at best. At that level it should be "drop in" or Cat would/should advise tuning with it's install, as most cam/tuning companies will do. Regardless of it all, this is talk and you're the one in front of the car and I'm glad that you were able to find a solution, now let's go to the dyno!

 

Agree on the flexibility to some point. I guess my last experience with a cam in a speed density car is what had me not shocked about the need to add fuel and timing at idle. Old speed density cars could handle just about any cam when under throttle, but would refuse to idle without changes to the tune or a really high idle.

Granted, that was 25 years ago! My how time flies!

I'm glad you gave me some ideas to check though. Late last night I went back over my connections. All are good including the vtec solenoid. Also drove it a bit more and no codes in the ECU. I'm thinking I would have an O2 sensor out of range or A/F related code if there were a vacuum leak. That being said, I'll check for one tonight just to be sure. I'm always willing to go back over my work. No one is perfect! Especially not this guy! I did reuse the intake manifold gasket, not something I would normally do, since I plan on tearing this back apart shortly.

FWIW, before I made any changes it would idle perfect when in open loop. Tap the gas pedal and it would switch to closed loop and stall. Just guessing, but I suspect the ECU was sent into panic by the really lean A/F being read by the O2 and was trying to compensate, but couldn't. Once again...just a guess. I'm not a tuner. Give me a distributor to turn, a spring or vacuum advance, fuel pressure regulator to adjust, or even jets and power valves to change and I'm good. Give me a laptop and beware!

 

ECU and sensor tech of 25 years ago - absolutely! The basics still apply though. SD calculates air flow via RPM (speed), temperature, and pressure (density) to calculate how much fuel to spray, that much hasn't changed. As a former dynamometer engineer at an aerospace company, a few years ago an associate and I had small displacement engines (sub 200cc) running on pump gas, E85, ethanol (E100), alcohol (110-proof vodka and Everclear), methanol, kerosene, JP-5, and JP-8 using SD on a single map. We could cold start and mix fuel while operating with minimal power loss, that was cool stuff.

I'm certainly not perfect either! But that's why we do this forum nonsense, sharing ideas and solving problems with our misguided passions. I think that re-used manifold gasket may be worth a second look. Especially if its the original 190k+ mile one. Did you put a silicone or gasket maker over it before it went back on? And are you referring to the lower manifold gasket or the two upper manifold gaskets? Both are downstream of the IAT and MAP sensor on the intake and leaks would make sense for a lean idle as they only register air flow through the throttle.

I wish it was as easy as a few screws to turn and a vacuum gauge reading! Three tools and the job's done!