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Exhaust System Overall haul

  #1  
Old 08-21-2016, 07:53 AM
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Exhaust System Overall haul

Exhaust System Overall haul

Weapon-R CAT delete pipe - $240.28 shipped
- primary tube is 2 ½”
- secondary tube is 2 ¼”
Weapon-R CAT delete pipe is ~$25 more than the T1R race converter shipped to Tampa FL from AJ-Racing in Canada with 1 month wait time. So I decided to pass on and buy the WeaponR CAT delete pipes despite having a T1R race pipe in my car.

Magnaflow Catalytic Converter 50005 - $79.86 shipped
3 ½”body
8” total length
2 ¼” inlet/outlet

Magnaflow 10415 Satin stainless steel round muffler - $73.64 shipped
4” diameter body
2 ½” core
14” body length
20” Overall length
2 ¼” inlet/outlet

Skunk2 exhaust silencer 415-99-1485 - $47.40 shipped
Skunk2 2.25 Universal Muffler 415-99-1470 - $145.90 shipped
5 ¼” diameter body
12” body length
19” overall length
60 mm inlet - ~2.3"
110 mm tip

Weapon-R CAT delete pipe and the Skunk2 Universal muffler came this week. While waiting for the catalytic converter and the resonator/round muffler to arrive I removed the T1R race pipe and the secondary catalytic converter. Both the T1R race pipe and the secondary catalytic converter can be finessed out in one piece from the bottom without removing the sub-frame. But you will have to remove the O2 sensor, the O2 sensor wire holder and the catalytic converter heat shield.

Here are the 3 primary pipes: OEM, WeaponR and T1R racing. OEM and T1R header exhaust port opening are huge compare to WeaponR. OEM pipe is the largest with it integrated catalytic converter. T1R is smaller and the shorter while WeaponR is the larger and longer. The bolt holes on WeaponR has laser cut slit. WeaponR converges to ~2½” at the other end. T1R converges to ~2”. OEM primary CAT converges to ~1¾”.





Here is the secondary pipe. WeaponR pipe is ~2¼” with ~2¼ inlet and outlet. OEM pipe is ~1¾” with ~1¾” inlet and outlet. WeaponR does not include a exhaust flange to the resonator.





 
Attached Thumbnails Exhaust System Overall haul-cat1compare1_zpsbmqfwsei.jpg   Exhaust System Overall haul-cat1compare2_zpszenlccd2.jpg   Exhaust System Overall haul-cat1compare1_zpse3w2rd6r.jpg   Exhaust System Overall haul-cat1compare2_zpslwsrfhqw.jpg   Exhaust System Overall haul-cat2compare1_zpsfdurn3ir.jpg  

Exhaust System Overall haul-cat2compare2_zpswh4kjwpe.jpg   Exhaust System Overall haul-cat2compare3_zpswrat4uqn.jpg  
  #2  
Old 08-22-2016, 07:56 AM
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The two things missing from the WeaponR CAT delete are collector gasket, nuts and bolts to the stock resonator. A short trip to Oriely Auto Part for a FelPro 2 ½“ 3 holes collector gasket, part # 2014 and another trip to Lowes for stainless steel M10 bolts, nuts and washers.

Throttle response seem to be better compare to the T1R race pipe paired with the stock secondary CAT. The smell from the car without any CAT is awful IMHO. I just don't like that smell at all. Droning starts at about ~3000 rpm, gets louder with more aggressive throttle and eventually dies off above ~5000 RPM. There is no rasp. The car idles just a tad louder. Backing off the throttle above 5000 RPM at wide open throttle earns you a backfire pop some of the time. After 45 miles of seat time I have heard the backfire popping several times. For now the droning is bearable but the CATless smell in a daily beater will drive me bonkers.
 
  #3  
Old 08-22-2016, 10:45 PM
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Hi Steven,

I assume you are going to install the Cat Converter by cutting the Weapon-R secondary pipe and put the cat converter in the middle of the Weapon-R secondary pipe right?

On the Weapon-R secondary pipe, I do not see any port for the O2 sensor?
Does it have it on the other side (that not shown on the picture)?

also do you plan to move this O2 sensor port AFTER the new cat converter that you plan to install? perhaps this way, there will be no check engine light even without O2 defouler...

at this moment, with T1R down pipe and stock cat converter, my check engine light sometime comes on (even with defouler) because the O2 sensor is located in front of the secondary cat...

Also I always wonder if the HKS Metal Catalyzer system for Honda CR-Z, will fit our car without any modification:
METAL CATALYZER?CR-Z

The reason is because T1R sell the same down pipe for both CR-Z and our Honda Fit,
although a member of CR-Z forum who buy the T1R down pipe need to bent the EGR pipe to fit the CR-Z, but either this is because the pipe bent during shipping,
or should be easily solved by buying the EGR pipe of CR-Z (the pipe that came from the engine block to meet the down pipe EGR pipe)...

the secondary pipe though is a bit of mystery because I am not sure whether the CR-Z secondary pipe is exactly the same as our Honda Fit...

Do you know about this?
 

Last edited by BMW ALPINA; 08-22-2016 at 10:48 PM.
  #4  
Old 08-23-2016, 08:55 AM
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The CR-Z HKS metallc cat with the downpipe is outrageously expensive at $1450 street price. METAL CATALYZER?CR-Z

KTuner can disable the secondary O2 sensor monitor but not the OBD2 EGR and EVAP monitoring. I have a CEL for both EGR and EVAP. My EGR valve has been replaced with a block off plate and my EVAP valve is bad. Gas mileage has not changed nor has engine temperature with the EGR block off plate. Florida doesn't have emission testing so there is no motivation to fix the CEL but eventually I will replace the valves. I dislike the catless smell personally. That is the main reason for the Magnaflow 50005 catalytic converter. The Magnaflow CAT is 8” long and has a 3 ½” diameter body. There is a good chance it might fit between the secondary pipe and the resonator without hitting the body over speed bump. I might replace the heat shield with adhesive back aluminized heat barrier for more room. Once I have the CAT at hand I will crawl under the car for a better look before heading over to the exhaust shop.

Magnaflow has a direct fit secondary CAT replacement, Federal 51681 and is very expensive at ~$485.78 shipped. The pipe is 2” with a higher capacity CAT which would be a perfect match to the T1R downpipe 2” outlet. You will still need a O2 bung welded for your wideband 02 sensor. A cheaper solution MIGHT be a custom made secondary pipe with a high capacity CAT at a shop using the stock secondary pipe as a template. Magnalfow doesn't have a direct fit secondary CAT for the CR-Z. There is no way to cross reference them.

I also used a straight defouler in my car with the T1R down pipe and didn't had any problem with CEL. When I installed the T1R down pipe I have to bent the stock EGR pipe a little between the T1R and the engine. It didn't aligned. This time around with the WeaponR primary pipe, it aligned perfectly. The WeaponR CAT pipe delete went in very easy. Time will tell about it durability and reliability. Bitch part is running around for the collector gasket and M10 stainless steel bolts, nuts and washers.

The O2 bung on WeaponR secondary pipe is on the other side.
 
Attached Thumbnails Exhaust System Overall haul-80-953_204_107_deb093c0831e0168e0c668d9396843975c9da3aa.jpg  

Last edited by Steven Hung; 08-23-2016 at 12:40 PM.
  #5  
Old 08-23-2016, 08:21 PM
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Here is the Magnaflow 50005 metallic bullet CAT: 3” diameter, 3½” length, 8” overall length and 2¼” inner diameter inlet/outlet. Hopefully it should be enough not to stink up the garage.

 
Attached Thumbnails Exhaust System Overall haul-magnaflow50005_zps6mjnc3qf.jpg  

Last edited by Steven Hung; 08-24-2016 at 05:37 AM.
  #6  
Old 08-24-2016, 01:28 AM
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I found the CR-Z direct fit secondary cat:
Federal 52028
According to Magnaflow website
It looks like the CR-Z have the same unit as Insight but different in length compare to the Fit, that mean the HKS CR-Z Metal Catalyzer will not fit without modification...

but strangely,
according to AJ Racing/T1R,
the T1R Racing Convertor are interchangeable between CR-Z and Fit... hmmm
https://www.aj-racing.com/newshop/?p...nda-fit-09-ge8
 

Last edited by BMW ALPINA; 08-24-2016 at 01:53 AM.
  #7  
Old 08-26-2016, 09:52 PM
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After 3½ hours at the exhaust shop, Mad Hatter on waters ave in Tampa FL my exhaust system is done. Yes it is louder than stock when you get on the gas but eerily quiet at idle. When the rpm drop below 725 rpm it is silent. No noise. No exhaust rumble. No vibration. Just calm silence. Boy, when you get on the throttle the Skunk exhaust roars,”HERE I AM”. Lifting off the throttle and holding will subdue the roar. The Skunk silencer does help to muffled the roar but I like the drama and the roar from the Skunk. It is as loud as the Amuse Ti CAT back exhaust system on my 05 E46 ZCP with FabSpeed headers and HJS catalytic converter. Ssheee, I cannot sneak home after a night out with the boys or girl in this case.

My seat of the pants evaluation after 50 miles is the torque curve has move up the rpm by couple of thousand rev. Torque now comes above 4500 instead of 2800 rpm. Rev climbs very quickly and freely all the way to 6800 redline. I kind of miss the torque down low. Flow is probably better with 2¼” pipe but IMOHO it might be a tad too much even for a supercharger at ~8 psi. There was noticeable more pull/torque at 8 psi from 2800 with the Weapon-R cat delete pipe, the stock resonator and stock muffler. Eventually, the stock exhaust might be overwhelmed by the supercharger and the Weapon-R cat delete pipes from too much hissing, stumbling and vibration. Hmmm . . . maybe 11 psi would be a better with the 2¼“ pipes. The Mfactory 4.687 final drive gear sitting on the shelf should help to improve torque down low. Motorsport 3.91 ring and pinion installed in the ZCP rear differential did the trick and improved low end torque after header, catalytic converter and exhaust upgrade. Now only if the clutch would wear faster.

So if you want a quiet and stockish setup, this would not be for you. My setup would have be bit louder if Burnes Stainless mufflers were no so expensive compare to the Skunk.

A couple of pictures before rushing home after being beckoned. Car doesn't stink with the catless smell after the bullet CAT. The CAT section can be unbolted and replaced with a straight through without the CAT even though the picture doesn't show it. I will probably replace the stock heat shields with Thermo Tec suppressor acoustical & heat control mats



Resonator and more 2¼“ pipes
 
Attached Thumbnails Exhaust System Overall haul-83044c63-1916-49d8-a706-e1d936911654_zpskrryg87n.jpg   Exhaust System Overall haul-0ccc0588-b50e-4449-a343-3ed2a701ec2f_zpstsdjbxhw.jpg  
  #8  
Old 08-26-2016, 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Steven Hung View Post
the torque curve has moved up the rpm by couple of thousand rev. Torque now comes above 4500 instead of 2800 rpm. Rev climbs very quickly and freely all the way to 6800 redline. I kind of miss the torque down low.

Same thing happened to me when I installed the T1R test pipe, I want that low-end torque back!! I bet your setup sounds really good though.
 

Last edited by rise; 08-26-2016 at 10:31 PM. Reason: a word
  #9  
Old 08-26-2016, 10:39 PM
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Hi Steven,

as you know I had T1R down pipe with stock cat converter,

that goes to 2 1/4" pipe all the way to the back which consist of
Vibrant Bullet Style Resonator,
Previous Generation Civic Si resonator (straight through),
Dynomax mini bullet resonator,
2 Generation back Civic Si resonator (slightly not straight through but well, let's say almost straight through because I can see from inlet to outlet just slight bent)...

This setup works great from down low to up top with stock pulley...

so the main differences between yours and mine is I still use the stock cat while you use the Magnaflow cat...

but I don't think it is the cat that make much different but it is the piping of the stock cat that as you pointed out is only 1 3/4in...

hmmmm.... the HKS CR-Z Metal Catalyzer piping diameter is 51mm or 2in... and so does the T1R...
perhaps if you change your current piping leading to and exiting from you Magnaflow cat to 2 inch, that would get you back the low rpm torque...


As you point out the direct fit Magnaflow second cat system also 2in...
 
  #10  
Old 08-26-2016, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by rise View Post
Same thing happened to me when I installed the T1R test pipe, I want that low-end torque back!! I bet your setup sounds really good though.
Rise,
Please give me the first chance and let me know if you decide to sell your T1R test pipe, (you can PM me here)
I am very interested.
Thanks
 
  #11  
Old 08-27-2016, 07:22 AM
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There was more torque down low with the Weapon-R CAT delete pipes and leaving everything stock: stock pipe size, stock resonator, and stock muffler. That the reason I believe 2” pipes would probably be sufficient for my setup. Weapon-R secondary pipe is 2¼“ mated to ~1¾” stock pipe post secondary has more torque compare to Weapon-R secondary pipe is 2¼“ mated to 2¼” custom pipe post secondary. I like it a lot better than T1R down pipe with everything stock because the engine felt much stronger. There is no need to custom exhaust 2” pipe. T1R already has an off the shelf B-pipe and S51 exhaust muffler that is ~2”. I will leave thing as is. Once the 70mm 11 psi pulley is installed I will dyno it to see where the torque is. There is the 65mm pulley sitting on the shelf as well. But I want to wait for KTuner speed density first before the pulley install.

I might get itchy toward Christmas time and drop the tranny to do the clutch even though I don't need a new one. It will give me an excuse to pop in the MFactory 4.687 final drive gear and limited slip differential.

This morning I went for a short drive with a couple of tripe digit run. Car feels different especially when VTEC kick in at around 5000 RPM. It pulls really strong all the way to redline. The big different that I notice with the 2¼” pipe is RPM climbs faster.

To appease my wife, over the Labor Day weekend I will be installing sound deadening material inside the car from Lowes. I will be using Peel & Seal much cheaper than dynamat and fatmat. Ordered some fatmat rattletrap instead.
 

Last edited by Steven Hung; 08-27-2016 at 12:52 PM.
  #12  
Old 08-29-2016, 06:18 PM
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Last Friday, I got a sales lead for the industrial equipment that I represent,
so today I visit this brand new production facility in Oceanside, CA (near San Diego).
Specifically to the catalytic production building where they are currently coating their ceramic substrate model, obviously I can't take pictures there but I can take pictures of the lobby

 
Attached Thumbnails Exhaust System Overall haul-80-img_1794_copy_ee4952d5273c14521346528274bab83dc33669c7.jpg  
  #13  
Old 08-29-2016, 06:42 PM
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I got more seat time, a couple of hundred miles. This time I put back the silencer. The silencer improved torque a bit by creating more back pressure.
 
  #14  
Old 08-31-2016, 04:21 PM
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is the T1r the one on the right on the first and second picture? What do you use for the EGR line from the "header" to the head, does the cat down the line that far still keep you from having a CEL, not are you using a EMS to correct it? Does it have the Honda Buzz? Have you ran without the cat to see if the buzz comes up without the cat?

looking to run a very similar set up
 
  #15  
Old 08-31-2016, 05:07 PM
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Yes the T1R is the one on the right in the first and second picture. Are you referring to the L elbow from the right side of the T1R, Weapon-R and stock primary CAT in the first picture? That L elbow is connected to the EGR pipe that is bolt to the cylinder head. My secondary O2 sensor has been disconnected and it monitoring has been disable with KTuner. The O2 bung in the Weapon-R secondary pipe is for my wideband 02 sensor. I have never ran the car with a CAT. T1R was always connected to the stock secondary CAT. I use a Magnaflow bullet welded to the pipe after Weapon-R secondary so I am not sure what buzz you are talking about. Although I do heard the heat shield vibration sometimes.

Weapon-R Primary
Weapon-R Secondary
Magnaflow bullet CAT
Magnaflow resonator
Skunk2 Universal muffler with silencer
 
  #16  
Old 08-31-2016, 05:13 PM
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I have the Weapon R cat deletes, a resonator, and a magnaflow muffler and I definitely have the Honda buzz and a highway drone.

I believe it's called a "J-pipe" where you tee off a section of exhaust of a certain length and cap it to eliminate the drone. I'm going to try that eventually.

And yeah, I have to rev the crap out of my car to get any power.
 
  #17  
Old 08-31-2016, 08:21 PM
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When I had the Weapon-R cat deletes, stock resonator and stock muffler, there was quite a bit of droning but I didn't need to rev for power. The droning is gone with the Weapon-R cat delete, 2¼” pipes, Magnaflow bullet cat, Magnaflow resonator and Skunk2 muffler with silencer. There is good improvement in power and torque with the silencer. 2¼” pipes is probably a little too big with the Weapon-R cat delete and the Sprintex supercharger at 8 psi.
 
  #18  
Old 09-14-2016, 06:59 PM
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After about 1 week daily commuting with the new exhaust setup, I started to hear buzzing and metal clinking from the exhaust. It would get louder as RPM climbs and suddenly die off. The buzzing is more often and a bit worst when in the rains. I thought it was a exhaust leak from the gasket and replaced it with a new collector gasket and tightened all the bolts. This made it even worst. It turned out the Weapon R secondary pipe flex section was vibrating because it is not sufficiently secure with hanger. The weight from the Magnaflow was heavy enough to cause it to vibrate against the cross bar underneath the flex section. Adding a Pypes exhaust hanger seem to solve the problem.

 
Attached Thumbnails Exhaust System Overall haul-80-exhausthanger_c6aa331550e2fb3939a90d58a6724c93d8239562.jpg  

Last edited by Steven Hung; 09-14-2016 at 07:21 PM.
  #19  
Old 09-15-2016, 02:01 AM
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Please post videos of how the sound. Good quality videos please you guys are my test monkies ha.
 
  #20  
Old 11-27-2016, 12:41 AM
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Hi Steven,

When your exhaust shop fabricate your custom 2 1/4in B-Pipe,
Did they had the 3 bolts hole flange in stock (the flange that connect the B-Pipe to the Weapon R secondary pipe outlet)?
or Did you buy the 3 bolts hole flange your self and supply it to the exhaust shop?
If you bought it yourself, could you please kindly tell me where you bought it?

I am looking for a 3 bolts hole flange that suitable for 2 1/4in piping and compatible in bolt pattern spacing to Honda's 3 bolts factory bolts hole flange pattern.

Thanks
 

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