Unofficial Honda FIT Forums

Unofficial Honda FIT Forums (https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/)
-   Fit Engine Modifications, Motor Swaps, ECU Tuning (https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/fit-engine-modifications-motor-swaps-ecu-tuning/)
-   -   need VERY high boost kwsc!! (https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/fit-engine-modifications-motor-swaps-ecu-tuning/53772-need-very-high-boost-kwsc.html)

THEproFIT 03-10-2010 08:19 PM

need VERY high boost kwsc!!
 
any chances of a 10+ psi extra high boost pulley?
even a 12 psi pulley would be fantastic
how about a kit with a new pulley and an oil cooler and/or a front mount intercooler or whatever?

keepitpg 03-10-2010 08:33 PM

dont need two threads.

THEproFIT 03-14-2010 09:31 PM

can u tell me where this other thread is please (link)?
i think u r confused.
10+ means MORE THAN 10PSI

MNfit 03-15-2010 12:39 PM

IM pretty sure if you are looking to get 10+ psi your going to need to start doing custom work.

jexeffectz 03-15-2010 02:44 PM

^+1

I also think you're going to need to re-sleeve your bottom end, forged pistons and rods, etc etc. That much boost is just asking for a hole in the motor (that may be debatable, but I've seen a blown motor running 6-7 psi of boost).

What are your hp goals (crank or wheels)? Plans for the car (drag, track, canyons, beastly daily driver)? Budget?

THEproFIT 03-21-2010 11:06 PM


Originally Posted by jexeffectz (Post 826227)
^+1

I also think you're going to need to re-sleeve your bottom end, forged pistons and rods, etc etc. That much boost is just asking for a hole in the motor (that may be debatable, but I've seen a blown motor running 6-7 psi of boost).

What are your hp goals (crank or wheels)? Plans for the car (drag, track, canyons, beastly daily driver)? Budget?

all of the above except drag

lets see all suggestions from free to unlimited

"just get forged pistons, rods, crank etc" as an answer without specific examples is less than useless

Texas Coyote 03-21-2010 11:32 PM

Do you have the base kit or the 10 PSI kit yet?...... I am planning to go for the High Boost upgrade and tuning for water methanol injection with an AEM F/IC .... !2 PSI with the stock compression ratio is asking for a very costly melt down even with methanol/water injection unless you have a very large trust fund and /or a lot of engine building and tuning knowledge and experience..... I have confidence in the KWSC kits but would still like the extra security of methanol/water injection.

dewthedew 03-22-2010 12:03 AM


Originally Posted by THEproFIT (Post 824163)
any chances of a 10+ psi extra high boost pulley?
even a 12 psi pulley would be fantastic
how about a kit with a new pulley and an oil cooler and/or a front mount intercooler or whatever?

How about just get the kw highboost:rolleyes: that will up the rev limit (which is the only way to do that) and that will give you full 12lbs. If you want more power/boost after that its rather simple but you arent going to be pushing much more than kw hiboost with full bolt ons.

jexeffectz 03-22-2010 04:22 AM


Originally Posted by THEproFIT (Post 829355)

lets see all suggestions from free to unlimited

"just get forged pistons, rods, crank etc" as an answer without specific examples is less than useless

I'm not sure I'm understanding your response.

Just for clarity, if I'm not clear already, I'm saying if you're going to run high boost on a stock motor, you're going to need a built motor to protect your "investment". Just trying to look out for your stock motor is all.

Like I said, I've seen a motor blow at 6-7 psi (again, debatable as every car is different). Hell, with a built motor, I'd say you can probably hit 14 psi without worrying about blowing a ring land, twisting a rod, etc. That's also assuming that you get lower compression pistons and you up your stroke. If that doesn't suit your fancy, then I'd suggest at LEAST re-sleeving your bottom end (if it's aluminum).

As far as your goals are concerned, I recommend you look into suspension mods in addition to your SC kit. Also, look into an LSD after you get your kit. Trust me when I say this, the LSD helps a lot, especially in the canyons.

jexeffectz 03-22-2010 04:40 AM


Originally Posted by THEproFIT (Post 824163)
how about a kit with a new pulley and an oil cooler and/or a front mount intercooler or whatever?


Originally Posted by Texas Coyote (Post 829367)
Do you have the base kit or the 10 PSI kit yet?...... I am planning to go for the High Boost upgrade and tuning for water methanol injection with an AEM F/IC .... !2 PSI with the stock compression ratio is asking for a very costly melt down even with methanol/water injection unless you have a very large trust fund and /or a lot of engine building and tuning knowledge and experience..... I have confidence in the KWSC kits but would still like the extra security of methanol/water injection.

^This is probably the route you should take to up your boost past even 12 psi. But again, if you have a stock block, it won't do you any good because replacing it isn't a matter of IF anymore, it's a matter of WHEN.

If money is no issue to you, then you might also want to look into a k-swap along with the kit as well. It might net you around the same amount of $$$$ as a built motor.

JamesBizzle 03-22-2010 06:04 AM

I would highly recomend sleeving and building your block as well. Our stock blocks can eaisly withstand 5psi, but when you're are talking about even just doubling that pressure, you're going to need to reinforce it cause it's gonna blow on you sooner or later.

And that goes for any type of FI for our cars.

OJRKraftWerks 03-22-2010 08:20 PM

You have a couple of issues here:

The stock MAP sensor is limited to about 10.5-11psi. You would need a 3 or 4 bar MAP sensor. then you will need to re-program for the 3 or 4 bar map sensor. I do not think this should be your first concern.

You have to get FLOW. The L15 needs to breathe better to make more power. Everything on the L-series head is extremely small. The valves are small. The ports are small. It is all small. And you cannot port the head open much more because you will break through. Add on that cams are not readily available and you would still need a standalone of some type to tune for all this.

As you can see, there is more to just "throw more boost at it."

-Oscar Jr.

Texas Coyote 03-22-2010 08:53 PM

There has been one turbo'd engine that came apart running to much boost and a stand alone tuning device..... A person has to have realistic goals or put trust in those with experience and knowledge...... I am one that has created a few messes in my time and have had to learn to recognize my limitations.

jdmspoonfit 03-26-2010 02:43 PM


Originally Posted by OJRKraftWerks (Post 829823)
You have a couple of issues here:

The stock MAP sensor is limited to about 10.5-11psi. You would need a 3 or 4 bar MAP sensor. then you will need to re-program for the 3 or 4 bar map sensor. I do not think this should be your first concern.

You have to get FLOW. The L15 needs to breathe better to make more power. Everything on the L-series head is extremely small. The valves are small. The ports are small. It is all small. And you cannot port the head open much more because you will break through. Add on that cams are not readily available and you would still need a standalone of some type to tune for all this.

As you can see, there is more to just "throw more boost at it."

-Oscar Jr.


so will the high boost SS kit be putting too much stress on a stock L15A engine? let say i want to get this kit, i need to sleeve the block before installing the kit?

JDMchris.com 03-26-2010 03:40 PM


Originally Posted by jdmspoonfit (Post 832216)
so will the high boost SS kit be putting too much stress on a stock L15A engine? let say i want to get this kit, i need to sleeve the block before installing the kit?


no the KW highboost kit can be put on a stock engine just fine.

Texas Coyote 03-26-2010 05:02 PM

Hey JDMchris....... Are you still using the Megan exhaust stuff???? Even though with the high boost and the power gain in the upper end of the power band, do you think there is a different header that might work better at the higher revs without hurting the bottom end and mid range????

THEproFIT 03-27-2010 11:50 PM


Originally Posted by OJRKraftWerks (Post 829823)
You have a couple of issues here:

The stock MAP sensor is limited to about 10.5-11psi. You would need a 3 or 4 bar MAP sensor. then you will need to re-program for the 3 or 4 bar map sensor. I do not think this should be your first concern.

You have to get FLOW. The L15 needs to breathe better to make more power. Everything on the L-series head is extremely small. The valves are small. The ports are small. It is all small. And you cannot port the head open much more because you will break through. Add on that cams are not readily available and you would still need a standalone of some type to tune for all this.

As you can see, there is more to just "throw more boost at it."

-Oscar Jr.

what exactly does the high boost kit make?

if it is 10 psi at the revised redline, i'd consider a 11psi pulley if u would make one



to all the other people.... please dont waste everybody's time with uneducated responses

like i said, just "re-sleeve this" and "bore out that" are not acceptable answers

suspension related answers WTF?!

i will list obviously bad responses
bore out...
aem.....
emanage.....
forged pistons....
less compression...
blah blah blah

theoretical answers r painfully obvious

SPECIFIC 10+ psi kwsc high boost only please

jexeffectz 03-28-2010 12:37 AM

^Why aren't those acceptable answers? Did you mention that those were going to be done on ANY of your previous posts? No. So how in the good Lord's name is it uneducated? We work with what you give us, and by building your block, or swapping it because of flow and durability/reliability, that is THE FIRST STEP anyone should take when looking into forced induction on an N/A motor THIS small. To SOME it may be obvious, others not so...you're not the only one that looks through this thread, even though YOU created it.

In OTHER WORDS, though it may be obvious to YOU, it's NOT obvious to others. Unless you mentioned it previously, I hardly think anything that was brought to the table was a waste of time.

dewthedew 03-28-2010 12:55 AM

less comp is a bad idea imo.. you'd lose power.

jexeffectz 03-28-2010 02:57 AM


Originally Posted by THEproFIT (Post 832761)
what exactly does the high boost kit make?

if it is 10 psi at the revised redline, i'd consider a 11psi pulley if u would make one



to all the other people.... please dont waste everybody's time with uneducated responses

like i said, just "re-sleeve this" and "bore out that" are not acceptable answers

suspension related answers WTF?!

i will list obviously bad responses
bore out...
aem.....
emanage.....
forged pistons....
less compression...
blah blah blah

theoretical answers r painfully obvious

SPECIFIC 10+ psi kwsc high boost only please

In case I'm reading your post wrong, allow me to ask what makes the responses you listed as BAD, bad?

Also the theoretical answers aren't necessarily, obviously bad, but should definitely be considered. If you don't like the answers we give you as a community who is only trying to look out for you...then look elsewhere for your answers. Wouldn't you rather do something right the first time rather then spending $xxxx.xx because you skimped on important parts of the diagram? If not...then I have nothing more to say.

JDMchris.com 03-28-2010 11:31 AM


Originally Posted by Texas Coyote (Post 832283)
Hey JDMchris....... Are you still using the Megan exhaust stuff???? Even though with the high boost and the power gain in the upper end of the power band, do you think there is a different header that might work better at the higher revs without hurting the bottom end and mid range????

the best header to use is going to be the weapon r race header... the megan stuff is just fine tho. it has held up for 30k boosted miles with no problems.

dewthedew 03-28-2010 12:35 PM

the weapon r street header is really nice as well

jexeffectz 03-29-2010 03:15 AM


Originally Posted by dewthedew (Post 832782)
less comp is a bad idea imo.. you'd lose power.

For high boost applications, I think it would be a safer move. Though high compression is good, it's only good up to a certain point. And considering how the L15A's compression is already high, you'd be more prone to detonation.

From what I could gather, lowering the compression a bit will help keep the reliability in tact.

Please correct me if I'm wrong...I kind of rushed my thoughts on this one because it's late.

dewthedew 03-29-2010 11:58 AM


Originally Posted by jexeffectz (Post 833195)
For high boost applications, I think it would be a safer move. Though high compression is good, it's only good up to a certain point. And considering how the L15A's compression is already high, you'd be more prone to detonation.

From what I could gather, lowering the compression a bit will help keep the reliability in tact.

Please correct me if I'm wrong...I kind of rushed my thoughts on this one because it's late.

yes but with such a small engine lowering the comp with require much more boost or nitrous to get it going. If you run golden eagle sleeves, forged rods, and 11:1 pistons you make tons of power on 10lbs kwsc.

jexeffectz 03-31-2010 03:08 AM

^I understand that, but I wouldn't want to risk detonation for power, unless the car is going to be a fully built race car. Also, given the "spool" characteristics of a super charger, my opinion is that you'll be able to add more boost and get the car going just fine. Again, just my opinion...so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Texas Coyote 03-31-2010 12:21 PM

With the Rotrax supercharger that uses a traction drive constant velocity transmission the boost is consistent from the time it starts up throughout red line..... Lowering the compression and adding boost would require more power to produce higher revs or larger supercharger and would be counter productive..... With a turbocharger the higher the engine revs under power the more the boost increases until the waste gate opens usual at the peak of the power band.... An engine that is tuned with rational air to fuel ratio and ignition timing should be fine with a high compression ratio provided too much boost isn't used causing over stress of the moving parts..... Methanol/water injection raises the octane rating of the fuel and lowers combustion chamber temperatures allowing for leaner A/F ratios, more timing advance, higher compression ratio and (or) an extended combustion chamber life..... I think a lowered compression ratio when using boost is a thing of the past, though that was a common practice on turbocharged engines for a long time.

jdmspoonfit 05-08-2010 01:18 PM

i also have a question, with the high boost kit, would i need to have a custom tune after installation?

or it can be just simply all plug and play?

Texas Coyote 05-08-2010 01:50 PM

My High Boost upgrade arrived yesterday.... The main reason I got it instead of trying to get the same results from a stand alone tuner is the Hondata reflash that is part of the package..... The Hondata tuning is only available on the KWSC High Boost package and was researched and tested for a very long time before it was made available to the public..... After having the Base Kit on my car for a year with the only maintenance required being a single belt adjustment shortly after installation and the fun I have had with my car since getting it.... I went without spending money for things I could do without and it didn't hurt me at all and now I will soon be driving with an additional trouble free 40 horsepower.

JDMchris.com 05-08-2010 06:18 PM


Originally Posted by jdmspoonfit (Post 852680)
i also have a question, with the high boost kit, would i need to have a custom tune after installation?

or it can be just simply all plug and play?

Highboost comes with Hondata... PLUG AND PLAY.

Vash 05-09-2010 05:08 PM

i love how everyone here always throws around the word PSI as if it was exact... 10PSI.. 12PSI why not? it should be that simple right?

I had a supercharged car for 3 years, and on the forums i was on you would get chewed out saying stuff like that. because each car has different boost even with the same or simular setups.

if you had EXACT same setups the difference can be between if it was dyno tuned or using a tuner kit. I remember i had mine dyno tuned and everyone always PMed me telling me how lucky i was that i was dyno tuned and thats why i had so much power for the modifications i had.

i changed my pulley 3 times to get my ideal boost i wanted which was 10~PSI, i ended up going with a 3.2 pulley which generally gives a 8 PSI for the kit i used, but i had 10PSI with it.

i kinda wanna see someone try and max out these honda fit motors.. i curious to see what it can hold maximum before motor's and transmissions need rebuilding.. good luck on your journey


sorry for the long lecture.. its just hard for me to read something like this with my experience being boosted for a while.

Texas Coyote 05-09-2010 07:54 PM

Did you have a Rotrex with constant variable ratio traction drive?

THEproFIT 05-23-2010 06:35 PM


Originally Posted by Texas Coyote (Post 834421)
With the Rotrax supercharger that uses a traction drive constant velocity transmission the boost is consistent from the time it starts up throughout red line..... Lowering the compression and adding boost would require more power to produce higher revs or larger supercharger and would be counter productive..... With a turbocharger the higher the engine revs under power the more the boost increases until the waste gate opens usual at the peak of the power band.... An engine that is tuned with rational air to fuel ratio and ignition timing should be fine with a high compression ratio provided too much boost isn't used causing over stress of the moving parts..... Methanol/water injection raises the octane rating of the fuel and lowers combustion chamber temperatures allowing for leaner A/F ratios, more timing advance, higher compression ratio and (or) an extended combustion chamber life..... I think a lowered compression ratio when using boost is a thing of the past, though that was a common practice on turbocharged engines for a long time.

funny how my boost gauge readings increase with higher rpm (full throttle)

1990hondahf 06-01-2010 01:05 AM

Several people above said to get the block sleeved....I did a search and didn't find anything out there for the L15a...I hope since it being recommended that it indeed exists....

Texas Coyote 06-01-2010 01:14 AM


Originally Posted by THEproFIT (Post 860546)
funny how my boost gauge readings increase with higher rpm (full throttle)

How much of an increase in boost at higher RPM at WOT??? Base Kit or high boost???

Lyon[Nightroad] 06-10-2010 04:52 AM

Corky Bell 'taught' me that tensile stress on a stock piston/rod/crank is much much greater (up to 3x) than compressive stress. The man says poor air/fuel/heat (ping of death) is more likely to kill an engine than too much boost. But if there is no way to tune at higher than 10 psi then indeed there is no hope.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:46 AM.


© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands