Polis,

Currently having the rear bumper painted on my 97 Civic. Same damage as
you describe, no dent just scratches through the paint. I took my
vehicle to the local Ford dealer, they are actually the cheapest place
in town. To repaint the bumper, the charge was $311. Since I was
paying out of my pocket, they are only charging me $250. Her $500
estimate seems high for a bumper repaint. I would get a copy of the
estimate and take a look at her car again to verify what's being fixed.
Otherwise, let the insurance company battle it out with her. I've had
a couple minor fender benders (under $1000) and have never been charged
the deductible that's on my policy.

Mike

 

Have her present you 3 estimates from reputable shops. If you still can't
agree, let a judge decide. Small claims court almost always awards the
amount of the smallest estimate.

 

SoCalMike wrote:
> y_p_w wrote:
>
>> jmat...@attglobal.net wrote:
>>
>>> IMO:
>>>
>>> You caused the damage, and the reasonable repair is the one that
>>> puts her exactly where she was before. That's a full repaint, at
>>> least, not a touch up. And yes, it costs a lot of money. Don't
>>> hit anyone again.
>>
>>
>>
>> In the vast majority of cases, "exactly where she was before" is a
>> bumper that isn't new and has likely been scratched several times
>> depending on age of the car. If it happened to me and I didn't think
>> it was severe, I'd likely take an offer to pay for touchup paint and
>> leave it at that. I certainly don't want the inconvenience of leaving
>> a car at a body shop for a minor cosmetic scratch.
>
>
> same here. the only reason id take it to a dealer would be if the thing
> was a lease through them and the bumper was otherwise pristine. $300
> could buy my piece of mind, easily.
>
>>
>> It takes a bit more than a minor paint scratching bump to damage the
>> foam energy absorbers. I'm not going to seek out everyone who has
>> made a 1/2" nick to the paint of my bumper, and I've been fortunate
>> that on the occasions I've made bumper contact, the owners have let
>> it go since it didn't make much of a difference with an older bumper.
>
>
> and the styrofoam underneath isnt that expensive, either. its the cross
> beam under *that* that costs money.

I don't know about that. When my Integra suffered rear end damage
in 1996, each of those foam absorbers were maybe $40-50 each, and
there were about four of them. I'm not sure why they don't use
expanded polyproprylene, which can absorb as much shock without
permanent deformation. Some of those styrofoam absorbers were
split apart after getting rear-ended.

 

jmattis@attglobal.net wrote:
> On top of that, repainting will never be as good as the original
> factory paint. She still has a "wrecked" car and the resale value is

are any door dings wrecking her car, too?

> diminished. Be grateful if she doesn't make a demand for "diminished
> value" to boot. Say, 5% of the pre-wrecked value of the car. Also,

riiiight. youre a lawyer by trade, arent you? she lost upwards of 15%
the day she drove off the lot.

> the repair may not be done right and she will have to hassle with the
> shop. Will you be there worrying with it? No.

for $500? thats on the body shop. the OP shouldnt HAVE to worry about
anything. and if they fuck up and forget to use plastic primer, and all
the paint peels off it 6 months later, ill bet she wishes shed gotten a
paint pen at autozone.
>
> And, she has a claim for loss of use. She needs a rental car for the 3
> days that it is going to take to do the job. Your problem.

insurance companies problem.
>
> You also have no idea how much damage can potentially take place to the
> underside of the car without denting the plastic bumper cover. I
> assume this is not an issue, but it sure can be.

yeah. she could have frame damage, too. damn fragile hondas!
>
> $500? Very reasonable. If you can shove the money into her hands, do
> it fast and get a full release from all claims. Or else let your
> insurance company handle it. Who knows when her neck, etc. is going to
> start hurting??

or the OP could do what the jackhole that rearended my girlfriends
tacoma did, and deny, deny, deny!

they "got pushed into" her by a third car driven by an illegal
unlicenced/uninsured alien. but they denied it was their fault, and the
insurance company wouldnt pay the $25 for the new bumper bracket it
needed. took me all of 15 minutes to replace.

karma works in strange ways, though. the raghead broad that hit her was
in a brand new sienna. she drove from the scene after the report was
done, even though her radiator was gored by the receiver on the tacoma.
bet she didnt get far, and hopefully her insurance company denied her
the $4000 engine replacement.

i give the OP credit for not just leaving the scene. hopefully they dont
get screwed over because of it. mebbe they wont bother to leave a note
in the future?

 

y_p_w wrote:
> jmat...@attglobal.net wrote:
>
>>IMO:
>>
>>You caused the damage, and the reasonable repair is the one that
>>puts her exactly where she was before. That's a full repaint, at
>>least, not a touch up. And yes, it costs a lot of money. Don't
>>hit anyone again.
>
>
> In the vast majority of cases, "exactly where she was before" is a
> bumper that isn't new and has likely been scratched several times
> depending on age of the car. If it happened to me and I didn't think
> it was severe, I'd likely take an offer to pay for touchup paint and
> leave it at that. I certainly don't want the inconvenience of leaving
> a car at a body shop for a minor cosmetic scratch.

same here. the only reason id take it to a dealer would be if the thing
was a lease through them and the bumper was otherwise pristine. $300
could buy my piece of mind, easily.
>
> It takes a bit more than a minor paint scratching bump to damage the
> foam energy absorbers. I'm not going to seek out everyone who has
> made a 1/2" nick to the paint of my bumper, and I've been fortunate
> that on the occasions I've made bumper contact, the owners have let
> it go since it didn't make much of a difference with an older bumper.

and the styrofoam underneath isnt that expensive, either. its the cross
beam under *that* that costs money.

 

jmat...@attglobal.net wrote:
> IMO:
>
> You caused the damage, and the reasonable repair is the one that
> puts her exactly where she was before. That's a full repaint, at
> least, not a touch up. And yes, it costs a lot of money. Don't
> hit anyone again.

In the vast majority of cases, "exactly where she was before" is a
bumper that isn't new and has likely been scratched several times
depending on age of the car. If it happened to me and I didn't think
it was severe, I'd likely take an offer to pay for touchup paint and
leave it at that. I certainly don't want the inconvenience of leaving
a car at a body shop for a minor cosmetic scratch.

It takes a bit more than a minor paint scratching bump to damage the
foam energy absorbers. I'm not going to seek out everyone who has
made a 1/2" nick to the paint of my bumper, and I've been fortunate
that on the occasions I've made bumper contact, the owners have let
it go since it didn't make much of a difference with an older bumper.

 

IMO:

You caused the damage, and the reasonable repair is the one that puts
her exactly where she was before. That's a full repaint, at least, not
a touch up. And yes, it costs a lot of money. Don't hit anyone again.

On top of that, repainting will never be as good as the original
factory paint. She still has a "wrecked" car and the resale value is
diminished. Be grateful if she doesn't make a demand for "diminished
value" to boot. Say, 5% of the pre-wrecked value of the car. Also,
the repair may not be done right and she will have to hassle with the
shop. Will you be there worrying with it? No.

And, she has a claim for loss of use. She needs a rental car for the 3
days that it is going to take to do the job. Your problem.

You also have no idea how much damage can potentially take place to the
underside of the car without denting the plastic bumper cover. I
assume this is not an issue, but it sure can be.

$500? Very reasonable. If you can shove the money into her hands, do
it fast and get a full release from all claims. Or else let your
insurance company handle it. Who knows when her neck, etc. is going to
start hurting??

And to the other poster regarding not being charged your deductible
when claims are made against you: of course not, the deductible has
nothing to do with your liability coverage.

 

polis wrote:
> How much can it really cost to repair this? She wants $500. Is it too
> much?

It's on the high end, but definitely possible. The victim is not going
to try to save the other party money. She went to the dealer rather
than an independent body shop. Also, instead of just getting the
scratch repainted, she's going to want the entire bumper repainted. So
I don't think she's making up a number.

But you can certainly try to negotiate it down like other people
suggested by having her get additional quotes, threatening to bring in
the insurance adjuster, etc.

> I have
> full coverage but i think the disclaimer (if this is the correct
term)
> is more than $500.

You're referring to the deductible.

 

On 2 May 2005 20:04:55 -0700, "polis" <polimnia_sanchez@hotmail.com> wrote:

>I would appreciate your comments on this. I never had this problem
>before. While parking I hit someone's back bumper. no dent, just a
>scratch. I gave her my info & she called today. It happenned a couple
>of weekes ago. She said she had an estimate of $500. She went to Honda.
>How much can it really cost to repair this? She wants $500. Is it too
>much? . Should I tell her she can take me to small claims court?.I have
>full coverage but i think the disclaimer (if this is the correct term)
>is more than $500. Your comments and thoughts are appreciated.

IME an insurance estimator will easily get that down to exactly $298. and
the body shop will accept. Offer her the option: $300. in hand or a visit
from an insurance estimator.

--
Rgds, George Macdonald

 

On Tue, 03 May 2005 04:03:00 GMT, y_p_w <y_p_w@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
>
>polis wrote:
>
>> I would appreciate your comments on this. I never had this problem
>> before. While parking I hit someone's back bumper. no dent, just a
>> scratch. I gave her my info & she called today. It happenned a couple
>> of weekes ago. She said she had an estimate of $500. She went to Honda.
>> How much can it really cost to repair this? She wants $500. Is it too
>> much? . Should I tell her she can take me to small claims court?.I have
>> full coverage but i think the disclaimer (if this is the correct term)
>> is more than $500. Your comments and thoughts are appreciated.
>
>Honestly? Scratch w/ no dent could be anywhere around the cost of
>touchup paint to full repaint. My mom scraped the paint off the
>corner of an already scratched up bumber. The driver of the car
>was a nun and didn't really ask for more than a small repair cost.
>
>$500 would be unreasonable unless there's a noticeable gouge in
>the bumber.

We just had this situation with our '03 Accord. A lady behind us in
line at a car wash bumped into us. The bolts on her license plate
holder put two, small holes in the paint. Not into the plastic, just
down to the white undercoating. Also pushed the top paint back into
wrinkles. Got two estimates from the top body shops in town. One was
$500 and the other $350. Took the $350 as they do all the body work
for the local Honda dealer. The entire bumper had to come off.
Basically, that's the entire back of the car except for the trunk lid.
After the repair, the bumper had to be completely repainted, followed
by clear seal. I was told by both shops that you can't just touch up
places like that because it would show afterward. So I would say
somewhere between $350 and $500 would be reasonable if we are
discussing a late model Honda.

 

Tell her to get 3 estimates of which you will pay the bill of the
lowest. Don't give her cash if you can help it. Go to the body shop
with her and pay her bill.

 

polis wrote:
>
> I would appreciate your comments on this. I never had this problem
> before. While parking I hit someone's back bumper. no dent, just a
> scratch. I gave her my info & she called today. It happenned a couple
> of weekes ago. She said she had an estimate of $500. She went to Honda.
> How much can it really cost to repair this? She wants $500. Is it too
> much? . Should I tell her she can take me to small claims court?.I have
> full coverage but i think the disclaimer (if this is the correct term)
> is more than $500. Your comments and thoughts are appreciated.
>
> Thank you,
> Polis

I think the lady with the scratched bumper wants to pocket the money and
not repair the scratch. Clearly this is a legitimate choice for her to
make, but if I were you I would insist on 3 quotes and only pay her the
lowest. If she is not amenable to this, I would hand it over to the
insurance company. They are quite professional at low balling...


--
================================================== =====
A very modest collection of Honda tech info can be found at:
http://www.geocities.com/ng_randolph

 

polis wrote:

> I would appreciate your comments on this. I never had this problem
> before. While parking I hit someone's back bumper. no dent, just a
> scratch. I gave her my info & she called today. It happenned a couple
> of weekes ago. She said she had an estimate of $500. She went to Honda.
> How much can it really cost to repair this? She wants $500. Is it too
> much? . Should I tell her she can take me to small claims court?.I have
> full coverage but i think the disclaimer (if this is the correct term)
> is more than $500. Your comments and thoughts are appreciated.

Honestly? Scratch w/ no dent could be anywhere around the cost of
touchup paint to full repaint. My mom scraped the paint off the
corner of an already scratched up bumber. The driver of the car
was a nun and didn't really ask for more than a small repair cost.

$500 would be unreasonable unless there's a noticeable gouge in
the bumber.

 

can you tell if the scratch is just paint surface or if it litterally went
through the paint. Cause if paint is missing that would be worst, but again,
it might be solved with just a paint pen. Depends on the severity. Also one
thing to consider is her point of view. If her car is a 4 year rental, it
might cause her a lot of problems if she returns a scratched car and maybe
just covering up might not be wise on her side. Many factors to consider
here. You could also go yourself to a bodyshop and see how much it would
cost to repair a scratch.
good luck

"polis" <polimnia_sanchez@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1115089495.442405.226680@l41g2000cwc.googlegr oups.com...
>I would appreciate your comments on this. I never had this problem
> before. While parking I hit someone's back bumper. no dent, just a
> scratch. I gave her my info & she called today. It happenned a couple
> of weekes ago. She said she had an estimate of $500. She went to Honda.
> How much can it really cost to repair this? She wants $500. Is it too
> much? . Should I tell her she can take me to small claims court?.I have
> full coverage but i think the disclaimer (if this is the correct term)
> is more than $500. Your comments and thoughts are appreciated.
>
> Thank you,
> Polis
>

 

I would appreciate your comments on this. I never had this problem
before. While parking I hit someone's back bumper. no dent, just a
scratch. I gave her my info & she called today. It happenned a couple
of weekes ago. She said she had an estimate of $500. She went to Honda.
How much can it really cost to repair this? She wants $500. Is it too
much? . Should I tell her she can take me to small claims court?.I have
full coverage but i think the disclaimer (if this is the correct term)
is more than $500. Your comments and thoughts are appreciated.

Thank you,
Polis

 

>
> are any door dings wrecking her car, too?
>

Your sarcasm is funny. Yes, if you can catch someone putting a ding in
your car, they have the same responsibility for the damage. Bumper,
door, doesn't matter.

Why is it that many people think they can whack someone else's car and
it's no big deal? Because they aren't the ones making the payments
every month. And probably never owned anything nice in their lives,
either.

 

In article <jQ8ee.38203$h6.37736@tornado.texas.rr.com>, Nobody@nospam.com
says...

>Have her present you 3 estimates from reputable shops. If you still can't
>agree, let a judge decide. Small claims court almost always awards the
>amount of the smallest estimate.

So this innocent women gets hit by someone elses careless actions and now
she has to run around to 3 different shops to get her car fixed? That hardly
makes sense to me.
--------------
Alex

 

Alex Rodriguez wrote:
> In article <jQ8ee.38203$h6.37736@tornado.texas.rr.com>,
Nobody@nospam.com
> says...
>
> >Have her present you 3 estimates from reputable shops. If you still
> >can't agree, let a judge decide. Small claims court almost always
> >awards the amount of the smallest estimate.
>
> So this innocent women gets hit by someone elses careless actions and
> now she has to run around to 3 different shops to get her car fixed?
> That hardly makes sense to me.

Here's a story. I'm exiting a parking spot at a supermarket in my
brand new '89 Integra. There's a car waiting behind me, but I have
enough room to back up and move out. Then an old woman (80ish)
backs out of the spot to my left, hits my car in the left fender,
and keeps on gassing it when she stopped moving. We exchange info.

It was pretty obvious who was at fault. The son-in-law of the driver
offers to pay for the damage with two estimates. I'm a college
student with plenty of time and I got somewhere around 5 estimates.
I present the two from the places with better reputations. The son-
in-law writes a check made out to myself and the auto body shop. I
did run into a problem that they didn't accept personal checks, but
I gave them a credit card number as a backup.

I think two estimates should be reasonable given that it's a private
transaction. Then offer to pay the shop directly. I think it's a
judgement call as to whether or not minor cosmetic damage demands a
complete repainting of a bumper.

I'd also recommend carrying a disposable camera.

 

<< So this innocent women gets hit by someone elses careless actions and now
she has to run around to 3 different shops to get her car fixed? That
hardly
makes sense to me. >>

I agree with your sentiment, but if the person responsible has a problem
with the estimate and it has to go to court, most judges will ask for more
than one estimate. No doubt the driver should take responsibility for his
error in judgment, but I don't see how not wanting to fork over the first
amount presented to him is shirking that responsibility.

 

> Try that line of reasoning in a New York City parking lot.........


Sorry, NYC is more like a third-world country. Trash cars, and it cost
twice as much for monthly parking than payments on a new car. I know
all about it.

It's a bleak picture, and shows what happens when theft and negligence
get completely out of hand. Exactly what I'm complaining about.

I've been all over the U.S., and there's nothing else like it I've seen.