2nd Generation (GE 08-present)The New Fit... Generation specific talk and questions here.
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What is in bold is what made your post confusing. Jumping from the topic of CVT's to making a Fit hybrid without any further explanation made it seem like you were inferring CVT = hybrid. I am not trying to put words in your mouth, It just took me a little while to see exactly what you meant to say and I thought that your post could use some clarification for future reference.
No worries.
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Oh - and as to the Fit being the priciest in the B-segment, wouldn't that justify trying to keep costs down?
Not really. As I stated before, people are paying up the wazoo for cars here. Dealers are not having problems moving cars with mark-ups so I honestly wouldn't be surprised if prices go up. Now, I don't mean that it's giong to go from $17K to $22K and work...but I don't think it's too hard to sell cars to a populous that is addicted to them much as are heroin addicts.
I completely disagree with this assumption. Look at all the idiots paying well into the mid to upper $20K's for a VW GTI...who in their right mind would ever have thought a freaking VW GTI would be priced at $29K loaded and people would be pay $27K for it after negotiations?? Automakers are boiling customers in warm water like frogs...very slowly and without you realizing it.
I would not be surprised at all if people pay well above $19K if not $20K for a fit...already a Fit Sport with HRH upgrade will run you $19K or close to that will it not??
The VW GTI is in a completely different market than the Honda Fit. The GTI is not the lowest level car in Volkswagen's lineup. It is a fast car offering advanced performance-based technology. It is not made for reliability or maximization of interior volume. It is made as a small, cheap performance car. The Honda Fit is made as a small, cheap economy car.
You speak as if everyone buys a $29,000/$27,000 GTI. When I was looking at the GTI I was quoted $20,500 for manual without DSG. I turned it down due to VW's awful reliability.
Our economy is entering a recession. Anyone with an education in economics knows that the first type of goods stop selling when a recession is coming are durable goods (vehicles, refrigerators), capital goods and luxury goods. The Honda fit is a vehicle, so it will be easily affected by our poor economy. So, to get around this, Honda will make sure that people don't think of it as a luxury good. They will definitely focus on keeping the price very low. This, coupled with price cannibalism, is a guarantee that the price will be kept low.
And by the way, I am a financial analyst. You have to look at the majority of people when you're predicting where the market for products is heading. Don't look at the uncommon cases. Also, Honda's business decisions are very easily predicted. Honda closely watches the cannibalism effect with their products.
I don't care if you don't agree with me. But I do care if you're giving away totally mislead advice to all those out there who are considering the Honda Fit.
And when I claimed that the Honda Fit may not be "that much better," I was trying to make the poster who I was responding to not feel bad that he has a 2008 Fit. I was making a point that whether he has the '08 or the '09 he should feel good about his car because it's a great one.
Not really. As I stated before, people are paying up the wazoo for cars here. Dealers are not having problems moving cars with mark-ups so I honestly wouldn't be surprised if prices go up. Now, I don't mean that it's giong to go from $17K to $22K and work...but I don't think it's too hard to sell cars to a populous that is addicted to them much as are heroin addicts.
No, some people will be willing to pay "wazoo" for cars here. Those odd cases are nearly negligible in the aggregate market. Especially with the direction our economy is heading. CVT probably won't make it unless Honda makes it more reliable in the long run because Americans associate reliability with Japanese car companies. Reliability is a must have in the United States market. Do you follow the stock market? Have you seen what happened to Apple's stock when they released a new, expensive laptop instead of the cheap one that would better suit our economy? Things have changed.
The VW GTI is in a completely different market than the Honda Fit. The GTI is not the lowest level car in Volkswagen's lineup. It is a fast car offering advanced performance-based technology. It is not made for reliability or maximization of interior volume. It is made as a small, cheap performance car. The Honda Fit is made as a small, cheap economy car.
You speak as if everyone buys a $29,000/$27,000 GTI. When I was looking at the GTI I was quoted $20,500 for manual without DSG. I turned it down due to VW's awful reliability.
It's irrelevant...the point is the relative difference between cars in the same class. And what people are willing to pay. There is nothing in the GTI that warrants it being $29K sticker price. That is ludicrous. The price you quoted is a GTI with nothing in it other than a souped up engine and slightly better dampers over the stock Rabbit. The stock Rabbit can be had for about $16K. A big difference. Add some rims, a sunroof, DSG, and NAV...and now you are almost $30K. For an econohatch...and people are parting with their money for it with no problem whatsoever..crap service and reliability notwithstanding. Compare that to the previous GTI's even with a a VR6 engine and you see how much more people are willing to pay.
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Our economy is entering a recession. Anyone with an education in economics knows that the first type of goods stop selling when a recession is coming are durable goods (vehicles, refrigerators), capital goods and luxury goods. The Honda fit is a vehicle, so it will be easily affected by our poor economy. So, to get around this, Honda will make sure that people don't think of it as a luxury good. They will definitely focus on keeping the price very low. This, coupled with price cannibalism, is a guarantee that the price will be kept low.
Given the stupidity, arrogance, and greed of the general public most clearly seen through the last few years of real estate and over-indulgence with buying toys left and right (just come to LA...it's just amazing how many new cars are around here...where are people getting their money from????), I'm not sure if I agree. It hasn't seemed to curbed the idiots still driving around in living rooms on 4 wheels justified by having a few kids...so I don't know if people really care much about the future of their states...since now that is being clearly shown by even bigger fools just walking away from their mortgages on a regular basis. I'm sure Honda isn't going to completely jack up the price of their Fit BUT I have no doubt there will be people lining up out the door paying over MSRP for it.
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And by the way, I am a financial analyst. You have to look at the majority of people when you're predicting where the market for products is heading. Don't look at the uncommon cases. Also, Honda's business decisions are very easily predicted. Honda closely watches the cannibalism effect with their products.
I don't care if you don't agree with me. But I do care if you're giving away totally mislead advice to all those out there who are considering the Honda Fit.
I appreciate that you are a financial expert but these same experts were also telling us a different story a few years about housing, about the economy, and the whole state of affairs...whether they were lying or just plain wrong, I don't know...but they were way off the mark. I'm not giving away any misleading information. I am basing my assumptions on how much people love to buy cars in this country and how willing they are to part with their money for one. I see Camry's, Accords, Altimas left and right around here...someone is obviously STILL paying $400-500 per month for a mid-$20k vehicle. Given the demand for the Fits and for smaller cars right now (and then add the attitude of the dealers to mark-up), I doubt the prices will be as low as you think...but I do sincerely hope I am wrong.
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And when I claimed that the Honda Fit may not be "that much better," I was trying to make the poster who I was responding to not feel bad that he has a 2008 Fit. I was making a point that whether he has the '08 or the '09 he should feel good about his car because it's a great one.
That's cool...I don't think the current car is bad at all. I like it...and I'd honestly have to see the new one to compare. So we'll see I guess.
while my current intent is to buy the 2nd generation fit, i absolutely refuse to pay over msrp for it (whatever msrp might be). i'll be happy to come back on the 30th of each month until a dealer blinks.
I visit LA often and agree that in the city many more people than average would be willing to pay well over MSRP for almost any car. Sorry about the attitude in the earlier post. I had a long day at work and was being a jerk.
Why are we even speculating so deeply about the 2009 Fit? Haha we should really just wait and see.
Also, does anyone know if the '09 is going to come directly to America unchanged? I haven't seen the interior in person but in photos it doesn't seem as attractive as the current one. Although, the new chassis and engine would be worth the tradeoff for me. Either way, if I decide to purchase a more efficient vehicle it will definitely be the Fit!
I visit LA often and agree that in the city many more people than average would be willing to pay well over MSRP for almost any car. Sorry about the attitude in the earlier post. I had a long day at work and was being a jerk.
Why are we even speculating so deeply about the 2009 Fit? Haha we should really just wait and see.
Ahh...no worries man...everyone has a shitty day.
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Also, does anyone know if the '09 is going to come directly to America unchanged? I haven't seen the interior in person but in photos it doesn't seem as attractive as the current one. Although, the new chassis and engine would be worth the tradeoff for me. Either way, if I decide to purchase a more efficient vehicle it will definitely be the Fit!
Yeah it's hard to tell what the real changes will be..hopefully none OR if changes do happen, they may make the car more aggressive looking?
I'm torn too with what to do...I have a 2001 Ford Focus right now that gets around 28 MPG overall but of course isn't as clean emission-wise as a Fit...plus it ain't a quality car by a long shot. But it works and has rather low miles and is PAID OFF...something I've had the pleasure of saying for the past 2 and a 1/2 years...no car payments.
So what do to...what to do
I'm in no rush to buy a car so that's a good thing...but I wouldn't mind a nice, small efficient car like a Fit. Old or new? That's the question.
Plus..let's keep mind the other options that may be coming our way....Suzuki Swift, Mazda 2, Fiat 500 (oh man that would be sweet), new Ford Fiesta, etc...
One of the links I found said the new engine was getting up to 46mpg, but I find that hard to believe. The U.S. numbers will be different from the Japanese numbers of course, but does anyone have the Japanese fuel economy of the 118hp 1.5l engine converted to miles per gallon?
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Previous ride: '02 Subaru WRX Wagon (#)_(#)
Current ride: '09 Matrix S
I did the conversion and I think the 1.5 was rated 42MPG with the CVT and a few less with the 5MT. Kinda sucks since I refuse to drive any form of automatic. I actually like the looks ALOT better than the current version so I'm trying to hold off for a few months even if it means paying a little more. Currently the Fit isn't rated any higher than the Civic (5MT anyhow), which is a 1.8L iVTEC, so it makes sense to me that a smaller car and smaller engine with the same iVTEC technology would have to be more efficient, although that leaves out the gear-ratio.
The new Fit actually reminds me of a cross between the previous-generation European Honda Civic hatchback (especially the nose design) and the Edix/FR-V multi-activity vehicle sold in Japan and Europe.
im not feeling the looks of the 09, in my opinion i think the 08 and earlier look a lot better. as for the 09's rumored fuel economy of 40 mpgs, thats probably the only thing that would make me want an 09.
I think Honda will offer the CVT automatic on the 2009 North American market Fit. The reason is simple: if you've read the releases from Honda's corporate web site, they extensively redesigned the CVT's operation so it has a stronger acceleration "feel" to minimize the "slipping clutch" effect some drivers don't like. This change is designed to better suit the driving styles of American drivers.
I sure hope so. Maybe I'm getting old , but I'm tired of driving manuals! The only reason I've stuck with them is because they usually get significantly better fuel economy.
The new CVT looks very promising!! It would be a huge mistake not to bring it to NA. I'm not going to get my hopes up for the 1.3, but CVT definitely. In case anyone is interested in the numerous advancements in the 2nd gen, check this out:
Linear Mode
