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2008 Fit AC Problem

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  #1  
Old 08-09-2018, 09:47 PM
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2008 Fit AC Problem

A bit of back story... I have a 2008 Fit Sport with almost 110k miles. Around the end of 2015 the AC cut out on the drive home from work. I dropped it off at the mechanic and he said the compressor was bad, $700 later and a new compressor, and the AC was back in business.

Fast forward to about 2 months ago and in similar fashion my AC died after driving for about 20 minutes. I left it off for around 20 minutes then tried again and it worked for a little while before dying again. I initially thought the AC clutch relay was bad, so after seeing the fan and clutch relays were the same I swapped them, but the clutch still failed to pull in.

Thinking there may be a small leak from when the compressor was changed a few years back I bought one of the recharge kits. The gauge on the recharge kit showed it low, so I added about 3/4 of a can worth of refrigerant. The AC ran great for about 3 weeks. After about 3 weeks I was having the same issues, where it would run when first started, then stop running after the car had been running for a few minutes. Thinking I had a leak, I dropped it off with my mechanic.

He put a real gauge set on it and said that the pressures looked good, if anything a bit overcharged. I explained what I had done to that point, and he still suspected the relays, so he ordered a set. After swapping them with no luck he next thought it was the pressure sensor. After waiting a few weeks for the part to come in, he changed it, but the AC still won't run. He was next thinking it could be the compressor again, but not wanting to spend $700 again I declined to go further.

Based on the AC running, then dying, then running again when I added more refrigerant, then dying once more I really don't believe there is any problem with the compressor. I think it is a sensor or something similar keeping the compressor from running. Any thoughts? I do like and trust my mechanic, but I felt this troubleshooting was a bit over his head and he was just resorting to throwing parts at it. I will add for all the time he spent on it he only charged me for the pressure sensor (around $60).

Any help is greatly appreciated!
Cheers!
 
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Old 08-10-2018, 03:44 AM
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When the AC stops working does the clutch disengage?
 
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Old 08-10-2018, 08:37 AM
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Sorry, that was an important bit of information I left out. When the AC quits (and right now it won't run at all) the clutch is not engaging at all. I was planning on jumpering the relay outputs this weekend to see if that picks up the clutch, and I'll let you know if that works or not.
 
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Old 08-10-2018, 11:14 AM
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There is a shim behind the clutch and I am wondering if you remove that if it will help. As the clutch wears the gap gets to big and the clutch won’t stay engaged. If you pull the clutch pulley off you should see the shim.
 
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Old 08-10-2018, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by GolNat View Post
There is a shim behind the clutch and I am wondering if you remove that if it will help. As the clutch wears the gap gets to big and the clutch won’t stay engaged. If you pull the clutch pulley off you should see the shim.
Agree! Back before all mechanics were just parts changers, they used to re-shim clutches as they wore. They also used to change out just the clutch assembly and not replace entire compressors.

I'd try to find a dedicated A/C repair shop and ask them to diagnose and let them know you have a suspension that the issue is compressor clutch related. I'd probably even call ahead and ask them if they will change the compressor clutch if that is the part that is bad.

As you can tell, I am truly disappointing in modern mechanics. Modern cars have them spoiled to the point that all they know how to do is get codes and follow step by step instructions to replace parts.
 
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:24 PM
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See my post

I posted this in the GE forum since I fixed a 2009 Honda Fit with a similar problem. 15 minutes to remove the shim and no cost to the Fit owner my daughter.

https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/2nd-...ml#post1409244
 
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Old 08-10-2018, 06:20 PM
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I appreciate the responses, but don't feel it is the clutch. I don't hear the click associated with it pulling in. I think there is a sensor or something otherwise preventing it from ever being sent voltage... I do plan to check it this weekend, and plan to jumper the relay output contact and see if it picks up and if it will spin the compressor. I'll report back when after I give it a shot. Also the new compressor (around 3ish years old) only has somewhere around 10-15k miles on it, so I don't think it should have worn that far down yet...
 
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Old 08-10-2018, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by bobvila View Post
I appreciate the responses, but don't feel it is the clutch. I don't hear the click associated with it pulling in. I think there is a sensor or something otherwise preventing it from ever being sent voltage... I do plan to check it this weekend, and plan to jumper the relay output contact and see if it picks up and if it will spin the compressor. I'll report back when after I give it a shot. Also the new compressor (around 3ish years old) only has somewhere around 10-15k miles on it, so I don't think it should have worn that far down yet...
You may be right, but are you sure it was a new compressor and not a reman with a used clutch?
 
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  #9  
Old 08-10-2018, 07:50 PM
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Here's a link to the electrical diagram for the AC system for our Fit. Click on page 18 (for the AC diagram).

http://www.hondafitjazz.com/manual/A...000ZDAT00.HTML

The ac clutch relay is energized by the ECM/PCM and send power to the magnetic coil to pull the clutch plate into the pulley. There's a fuse that you can check to verify that it is not blown. Fuse No. 11 is a 30 amp that power the condenser fan and ac clutch coil. If the condenser fan is spinning when you push the ac switch on, the fuse is ok. That leaves the ac clutch relay. Ac clutch relay is located below the battery in a plastic box.

Even though you don't think the air gap is the problem, I fix our daughter Fit by removing the shim and I link you to a video in which removing the shim fix the problem. You think/feel it's a sensor, but you can't tell us what sensor it is. You thought it was low on refrigerant so you just haphazardly added additional refrigerant to the point that you mechanic informed you that the system is slightly overcharged. The shim removal is just a 15 minutes repair, less if you have access to a lift since it took me 10 minutes to jack up the front of the car to remove the wheel.
 

Last edited by upallnight; 08-10-2018 at 08:05 PM.
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Old 08-11-2018, 08:53 AM
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Are cooling fans tuning on (or momentary pulsing on) when a/c is turned on?
Is compressor hard too spin by hand (with ignition off place 14 mm socket on the nut on the shaft and rotate clockwise)
 
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Old 08-11-2018, 11:35 AM
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Thanks for all the tips. I just got a chance to take a peek at it (don't have a good spot to work on it at the moment). Here's what I did/found:
- With the car off I pulled both relays (AC fan and compressor clutch), and jumpered the output. When I jumpered the fan relay output the fans came on, and when I jumpered the compressor clutch relay output I heard the click of the clutch.
- I started the car and turned the AC on. Nothing come on (no AC fan and didn't hear the clutch click).
- I jumpered the compressor clutch relay output again and heard the clutch pick up and the engine load down a bit as I would expect when the AC cycles on at idle.
- I connected the gauge from the Arctic Freeze refill kit I used before (I know, it isn't a real gauge but it gives me some idea) and hooked it up to the low pressure port. The pressure was reading in the 60-150 PSI range (around 80ish if I had to estimate) with the compressor off, and dropped to around 20 when I jumpered the compressor clutch, which the gauge labels as "low".
- The fact the pressure dropped when the compressor clutch was jumpered is what still makes me think the compressor / compressor clutch / etc is good and it is a sensor holding it out, but I'm not sure how to troubleshoot it further...

I know in order to change the pressure switch my mechanic would have had to evacuate and refill the system. Is it possible he didn't refill it enough? Does the pressure switch also cut the system off for low pressure?
 
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Old 08-11-2018, 12:43 PM
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Did you verify that you have power to the relay on the control side? If you look at the diagram that I posted, fuse No.22 which is a 7.5 amp fuse is the control side for the relay which controls the condenser fan relay and compressor clutch relay.
 

Last edited by upallnight; 08-11-2018 at 12:47 PM.
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Old 08-11-2018, 04:18 PM
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I would verify like said above.

Also a few weeks ago I used one of those kits to charge my AC. The "Rtic" gauge read nothing and my compressor still engaged. It didn't take much but at idle with the AC full blast I set the low pressure to 50 (with trigger not pressed on can).
 

Last edited by GolNat; 08-11-2018 at 05:18 PM.
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Old 08-12-2018, 12:24 PM
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So my fuse 22 is labeled "Small Light" and is a 10A. It was good. I also check all the 7.5A fuses in the interior fuse box and all were good. They were: 10 - "IG HAC", 18 - "TPMS", 25 - "ABS", 26 - "Radio", and 31 - "LAF". I didn't see any that referenced the AC system. Again thanks for the help!

 
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Old 08-14-2018, 09:43 AM
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Since you know where the AC relay is located and know how to jumper the AC output to provide power to the compressor magnetic clutch, you can take a test light (AKA Scope on a Rope) or ohm/volt meter and test the other relay contacts. One should have 12 volts constant since that is the power for the control side of the relay. The other contact will be the ground side of the relay.
 
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Old 08-22-2018, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by GolNat View Post
There is a shim behind the clutch and I am wondering if you remove that if it will help. As the clutch wears the gap gets to big and the clutch won’t stay engaged. If you pull the clutch pulley off you should see the shim.
The clutch plate may develop grooves and waves as well as wearing at the angle. In this case only replacement of both components will help
 
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Old 11-12-2018, 11:10 PM
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I replaced the AC compressor in my 2008 Fit Sport at the Honda dealer in Los Angeles for $1,400, and a month later it was blowing hot air. Now they tell me the AC condenser is leaking and I need to replace that too, plus recharge the freon (again) for an additional $985 parts & labor. Am I right in thinking they are crooks? Car has 81,000 miles on it btw.
 

Last edited by Heliophile; 11-12-2018 at 11:11 PM. Reason: addtl details
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Heliophile View Post
I replaced the AC compressor in my 2008 Fit Sport at the Honda dealer in Los Angeles for $1,400, and a month later it was blowing hot air. Now they tell me the AC condenser is leaking and I need to replace that too, plus recharge the freon (again) for an additional $985 parts & labor. Am I right in thinking they are crooks? Car has 81,000 miles on it btw.
I would not jump to the conclusion of crooks, but I'd say maybe not so good at their job. Compressors typically fail from being run without lubrication. So, it's likely that you had a leak prior to the first service. I'm guessing that they didn't do a real good leak test after installing the first compressor.

Make sure you do not run the A/C or defrost until you get the leak repaired and freon/lubricant back in the system. Running the compressor at all could lead to needing that part again.
 
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