I am wandering into unknown territory here. We swapped my daughter's wheels and tires for snow tire on new wheels on her 2011 Fit Sport few weeks back. After she left I noticed that the removed tires were scuffed badly on the inside of both rear tires. The passenger side was much worse than the driver's side. My experience says that this is a rear toe out problem. So I got the service manual and while it gives specs on rear alignment, they simply say to look for damage to the rear suspension if the alignment does not meet specs.

So I had her bring the car back and we went at it with a tape measure. Sure enough the rear tires are toed out 15/16" when measuring the front to rear edges of the tires. The spec says the toe should be .1" toe in + or - .1" . I also measured the camber and the left side is -1.25 degrees while the right side is - 3.0 degrees. We are looking for 0 degrees. The final measure measurement I took was ride height. The fronts were equal while the right rear is.5" low compared to the left rear.

I have experience on much heavier frame built vehicles and if it was a on a frame I would get out a porta-power and bend the supports back into spec using the frame as a straight ahead reference. Also past experience tells me that tire were is seldom a camber problem, but 3 degrees out is a lot of camber. I did some digging and Moog sells some shims that go behind the spindle mount to correct these problems but the shims are only offered in 1/4, 1/2, and 1 degree sizes. If my calculation are correct I will need around 5 degrees on the right side toe. And I need 3 degrees on the right side camber.

So here are the questions.

1. How to I determine when the wheels are parallel to the body. I cad easily determine when they are parallel to each other but not to the body.

2. Being these are way off would you try jacking them back into or near spec and then fine tune the adjustment with the shims?

3. If I were to take a porta-power to it, what part of the vehicle do I brace the porta-power on so I can jack against it without damaging something or forcing the other wheel farther out of line? On previous vehicles I have worked on, I used the frame and a reenforcement plate to jack against.

I m looking for any ideas you might have on Honda's, Fits, or uni-body cars.

Thanks

 

she must have hit something. You be better off buying a whole new rear beam assembly, have alignment checked, then shim based on those readings. 5 degrees is WAY too much camber/toe change for a shim.

 

your camber ismore serious than toe. your springs weak or dropped? wheels with less offset ? weak springs would be accentuated by toe out. addusting the shock mount won't help as the rear axle and hubs are locked and adjusted only by shimming the hub mounting place, not easy but changing just camber with shims isn'l ridiculous.
15/16" of an inch !!!! thats not toe out, that OMG TOE OUT !!!
PS FORGET THE PORTAPOWER FUX.

 

There is no obvious damage that I can find on the wheels or beam assembly, but you are correct. Something must have hit it.

Thanks both of you for the advice. I haven't priced a new rear beam assembly yet. It does not look that difficult to change.

Thanks again.

 

I wouldn't want 0* of camber if I were you.

 

Agreed. I believe stock is -1.6 degrees camber And up to .24 degrees tolerance for toe.

 

Now I'm going to go look up the Camber spec again. If you are correct the the left side is OK and I'll concentrate on the right side. I was worried about and concentrating on the toe while taking the measurements. I pretty much ignored the camber at the time.

UPDATE:

You are close onthe camber number. I just found it in the 2009-2010 Honda Fit service manual. It says rear camber is -1.0 degrees plus or minus 1 degree. So my left side of -1.25 would be OK. The right side camber of -3.0 is out, but I could take care of it with a 1 degree shim and just be in spec.

That leaves me with the right side toe problem. I priced a new beam tonight and it is $500 plus shipping and tax. I think I'm going to price having a frame shop straighten the beam first. I probably could get it off of there in less than an hour. Then the shop could mount it on a frame table and try straighten it somewhere close to specs.

Thanks for making me look up the rear camber again. For some reason I thought it was suppose to be 0 degrees camber.

As far a the toe measurement I was just using a tape measure so it was not as accurate as the camber which I used a caster/ camber gauge. I took several measurements with car on the ground and with it up in the air and the wheels hanging down. All of the measurements showed 3/4" to 15/16" toe out. The spec is .1" toe in. So there is a major problem with toe. So if I can get it back close, then I'll pay to put it on an alignment rack and fine tune it.

 

A shim cannot be installed in a 2011. The stub axles are not removable from the rear beam. I doubt it can be fixed by bending.


Clifton

 

Correction...yes they can. Ive done this myself, on my 2008 and 2011. I do agree that trying to bend it straight is not likely. Most likely would be better off replacing the entire rear beam.

 

"Correction...yes they can. Ive done this myself, on my 2008 and 2011."


Please me how on a 2011?


Clifton

 

I no longer have my 2011 as I got the new 2015. The axles are held in by 4 bolts. You buy an EZ shim kit, set it to the amount of correction for toe and camber, cut out the pieces for the bolts, place the shim behind the brake drum assembly, bolt back in, realign, done.

 

Here is a link for a 2011 rear axle beam. The stub axle is fixed to the main beam. To change the camber with a shim the axle needs to be removable. Since it isn't removable a shim cannot be installed.


The link fo0r a 2008 rear axle beam is shown below the 2011 link. Note the axle stub can be removed. So camber shims can be added.


Perhaps you can install shims under the 2011 brake backing plate, but they would not change wheel camber. The shims may tilt the brake assembly
though.


Clifton

 

Actually yes. Its exactly what I did To change toe and camber. Its the exact procedure for the 2008 and my 2015. Thankfully I do not need it on my 2015. The shim goes behind the drum backing plate. The axle goes on top of it which sits inside the brake drum bolted to 4 bolts. Most certainly toe and camber can be adjusted. I checked my 2015 and confirmed the same procedure would apply. Check my albums for some pictures for my 2015. Cant post while on my phone.

 

I see the difference you are talking about now. The shims I have coming in the mail from Moog say they are for a 2011 but it appears from the pictures that you posted that the shims will not work. I'll see what happens when the shims arrive. If they will not fit then I'll take it to the local frame shop and have them bend it back into position. I have done several of these with a porta-power on GMC motorhomes. They are front wheel drive with arm type rear suspension (no axles). Frequently they get bent by people turning too sharply and hitting the curb on the right side.

Unfortunately I do not have anything to brace the porta-power against (no frame) on a Fit. We have also corrected camber on these motorhomes with a steel wheel and log bar welded to it. We put it on a hoist, mount the wheel / bar assembly and start pulling on the long bar to twist the beam.

Thanks for the info and the incite on how these are built. I'll fix it. I'm just not sure how yet.

Thank you

 

Several years ago I had a very good alignment shop use a porta-power to reduce the camber on the rear of a Nissan Sentra. He made a adapter
with a long arm to fit the wheel studs He used the inner wheels to support the porta-power. I don't recall what he used to under the porta-power
base to prevent damage. A block of wood perhaps.

It corrected the camber. However, it damaged the wheel bearings.

Clifton

 

Here is the picture of my 2015. Its the same appearance of the 2008 and 2011 models I've had. Think of the setup as a sandwich.


Axle---drum backing plate---shim---beam mounting surface.

 

You seem to not understand that the spindle is built into the rear axle assembly of 2009-2013 fits, meaning it cannot be
removed by bolt. Get a cutting torch if you want to remove it.

As clearly shown in the lower drawing for a 2008 I attached the spindle is removable because it's attached with bolts.

If you look up the rear brakes in the following link you will find the parts list shows spindle bolts for the 2008. No spindle
bolts are to be found in the parts list for brakes in the 2009-2013 rear brakes. Check for details here.

Honda Fit Parts and Accessories at hondapartsnow.com

This will be my last post on this thread.

Clifton

 

My apologies everyone.

I've confirmed that the GE axle has welded spindles. It helps to have a tech friend at a Honda dealership who can verify these things. I also feel like a complete idiot even shimming my 2011 at all. It seems that when I shimmed the drum backing plate on my '11 it only changed the brake assembly but not the spindle axle as you pointed out Flash75. My alignment wasnt terribly out of spec originally, but I can only imagine what the alignment tech did to get my rear to appear in spec.

Again, please accept my apologies for the misinformation. In a way im glad I dont have my '11 anymore. Replacing an entire rear beam instead of fixing the axle spindle...well...poor design in my eyes.

 

Clifton,

Do not go away unhappy. I really appreciate your input on this problem. It has helped my tremendously. Thank you

Ken

 

Thank you for the information and helping me. I especially thank you for the correction to the information that you supplied. It take a good person (especially on the internet) to correct an erroneous statement. Most people these days would not do it.

I now know what I have to do. I'll let you know what happens.

Ken