Difficulty/Viability of Replacing AC Clutch
#21
07-27-2017, 11:27 AM
Hello,
So, my ac clutch relay went out and hence so did the ac clutch. So, am i reading this thread correctly that it can be a good idea to just replace the ac clutch and not replace the whole compressor?
So, my ac clutch relay went out and hence so did the ac clutch. So, am i reading this thread correctly that it can be a good idea to just replace the ac clutch and not replace the whole compressor?
#22
07-27-2017, 01:50 PM
Ok....
Go underneath and unplug the 3 wire plug from the compressor
(2 outer wires are for the thermal protector circuit--blue/white and white/blue--, the center wire blue/red is for the clutch coil.....the engine harness side has all the different colored wires, but the compressor side has all red wires. I listed the engine harness colors so you know what each red wire should lead to.)
You can ohm test the coil circuit on the center pin (check between pin and ground), a good coil is gonna be roughly 3.1-3.5 ohms cold (68*F), and a little higher if it's hot.
If it's under 3 ohms it's out of spec and resistance may drop even more as temperature rises.
Probably best time to check this is when you KNOW it's blowing fuses. Temperature of the compressor can play a huge part, so plan and test accordingly.
Ohms law can tell you if it's gonna blow a fuse...If it measures 2 ohms it would pull at least 6 amps when powered. If it's 1 ohm it would pull at least 12 amps.....Half ohm would pull over 24 amps....and so on.
If it's not shorted..... You could disconnect the 3 wire connector at the compressor....jumper the 2 outer wires in the engine harness side of the connector
with a THIN paper clip (blue/white and white/blue) ....jumper needs to be installed so the system won't be disabled by the PCM......
Now fire it up with good fuse and all relays in, and see if it blows fuse again.... If so that would conclude the clutch is not the culprit, the wiring is shorted to ground or has excess current load somewhere between the clutch relay and the clutch connector.
SO.....If it still blew that fuse with the clutch disconnected.....there's a noise suppressor in the wiring for the compressor clutch, it's located between the radiator and the panel covering the radiator.....near the hood latch, passengers side of the latch. If any of those wires have rubbed through the insulation, it sure could blow a fuse and is worth checking out. Years of vibration or a harness that wasn't secured, and any hit in the nose of the car could compromise the radiator/condenser and that wiring.....again, I think it's worth a check.
Looks like it should be a 3 wire connector
on one side it has 3 black wires
other side has 2 blue/red and 1 black...
Go underneath and unplug the 3 wire plug from the compressor
(2 outer wires are for the thermal protector circuit--blue/white and white/blue--, the center wire blue/red is for the clutch coil.....the engine harness side has all the different colored wires, but the compressor side has all red wires. I listed the engine harness colors so you know what each red wire should lead to.)
You can ohm test the coil circuit on the center pin (check between pin and ground), a good coil is gonna be roughly 3.1-3.5 ohms cold (68*F), and a little higher if it's hot.
If it's under 3 ohms it's out of spec and resistance may drop even more as temperature rises.
Probably best time to check this is when you KNOW it's blowing fuses. Temperature of the compressor can play a huge part, so plan and test accordingly.
Ohms law can tell you if it's gonna blow a fuse...If it measures 2 ohms it would pull at least 6 amps when powered. If it's 1 ohm it would pull at least 12 amps.....Half ohm would pull over 24 amps....and so on.
If it's not shorted..... You could disconnect the 3 wire connector at the compressor....jumper the 2 outer wires in the engine harness side of the connector
with a THIN paper clip (blue/white and white/blue) ....jumper needs to be installed so the system won't be disabled by the PCM......
Now fire it up with good fuse and all relays in, and see if it blows fuse again.... If so that would conclude the clutch is not the culprit, the wiring is shorted to ground or has excess current load somewhere between the clutch relay and the clutch connector.
SO.....If it still blew that fuse with the clutch disconnected.....there's a noise suppressor in the wiring for the compressor clutch, it's located between the radiator and the panel covering the radiator.....near the hood latch, passengers side of the latch. If any of those wires have rubbed through the insulation, it sure could blow a fuse and is worth checking out. Years of vibration or a harness that wasn't secured, and any hit in the nose of the car could compromise the radiator/condenser and that wiring.....again, I think it's worth a check.
Looks like it should be a 3 wire connector
on one side it has 3 black wires
other side has 2 blue/red and 1 black...
#23
07-27-2017, 02:21 PM
If the relay is bad, just replace the relay.
You said "and hence", but a bad relay can't make the clutch fail, nor can a bad clutch make the relay fail.
They might both become issues around the same time though.
My preference is to keep the original compressor if it is still good.
The clutch/pulley set and field coil can all be replaced without buying the whole compressor. All parts can be purchased at a Honda dealer, because you probably won't be able to get them through your local parts stores.
I can replace the clutch set without removing the compressor from the car and without touching the freon. Less than an hour for me, but I have all the tools to do it efficiently.
Local parts stores will make you buy a complete compressor (of dubious quality). Plus they will make you buy more parts than just a compressor if you expect any sort of warranty on their compressor....plus you have to deal with recovering, evacuating and recharging the freon and oil and all that.
You said "and hence", but a bad relay can't make the clutch fail, nor can a bad clutch make the relay fail.
They might both become issues around the same time though.
So, am i reading this thread correctly that it can be a good idea to just replace the ac clutch and not replace the whole compressor?
The clutch/pulley set and field coil can all be replaced without buying the whole compressor. All parts can be purchased at a Honda dealer, because you probably won't be able to get them through your local parts stores.
I can replace the clutch set without removing the compressor from the car and without touching the freon. Less than an hour for me, but I have all the tools to do it efficiently.
Local parts stores will make you buy a complete compressor (of dubious quality). Plus they will make you buy more parts than just a compressor if you expect any sort of warranty on their compressor....plus you have to deal with recovering, evacuating and recharging the freon and oil and all that.
#24
07-27-2017, 02:26 PM
If the relay is bad, just replace the relay.
You said "and hence", but a bad relay can't make the clutch fail, nor can a bad clutch make the relay fail.
They might both become issues around the same time though.
My preference is to keep the original compressor if it is still good.
The clutch/pulley set and field coil can all be replaced without buying the whole compressor. All parts can be purchased at a Honda dealer, because you probably won't be able to get them through your local parts stores.
I can replace the clutch set without removing the compressor from the car and without touching the freon. Less than an hour for me, but I have all the tools to do it efficiently.
Local parts stores will make you buy a complete compressor (of dubious quality). Plus they will make you buy more parts than just a compressor if you expect any sort of warranty on their compressor....plus you have to deal with recovering, evacuating and recharging the freon and oil and all that.
You said "and hence", but a bad relay can't make the clutch fail, nor can a bad clutch make the relay fail.
They might both become issues around the same time though.
My preference is to keep the original compressor if it is still good.
The clutch/pulley set and field coil can all be replaced without buying the whole compressor. All parts can be purchased at a Honda dealer, because you probably won't be able to get them through your local parts stores.
I can replace the clutch set without removing the compressor from the car and without touching the freon. Less than an hour for me, but I have all the tools to do it efficiently.
Local parts stores will make you buy a complete compressor (of dubious quality). Plus they will make you buy more parts than just a compressor if you expect any sort of warranty on their compressor....plus you have to deal with recovering, evacuating and recharging the freon and oil and all that.
#25
09-19-2017, 12:40 AM
I am 99.99% certain that my ac clutch field coil went out on me. I can disconnect the "banana plug-like" hot wire to the coil, alligator clip to the "relay side", and when I turn on the AC I get 13V. So that tells me that the thermo switch on the compressor is closed and working (actually, don't know if it would open if the compressor got too hot, but not really worried about that right now) and so is the relay (I already knew that though by swapping out relays). Clipping to the compressor field coil male side of the connector I get no continuity to ground (should be 3-4 ohms) and just for kicks I hot wired V+ to it and nothing happens, not a spark. The only other possibility is that the ground connector from the clutch field coil is not making contact with the compressor case, but that wire looks intact from what I can see and feel.
So, I can go to my Honda dealer and order the part, or get it online like I've got a few other parts. It looks like:
Manufacturer: Honda
Part Number: 38924-RLC-014
Part: COIL SET, FIELD
Only $70 online, haven't called the local dealer to get a price.
is what I need. But my question is whether I should also replace the clutch by buying the "clutch set":
Manufacturer: Honda
Part Number: 38900-RLC-024
Part: CLUTCH SET, COMPRESSOR
Replaces: 38900-RLC-014
The clutch set costs $170 and doesn't seem to me that there should be anything wrong with it since everything was working fine until the ac stopped working all of a sudden. The compressor doesn't appear to be locked up as I can rotate the armature plate without any problem.
So my plan is to get the parts and find a mechanic that will just do the clutch job without touching the freon. So far I am 0 for 2.
Just curious, ezone, can you do the job without even loosening up the compressor? Do you remove the right front wheel and the wheel well to get access?
Oh, yeah. I've got an '07 Sport.
So, I can go to my Honda dealer and order the part, or get it online like I've got a few other parts. It looks like:
Manufacturer: Honda
Part Number: 38924-RLC-014
Part: COIL SET, FIELD
Only $70 online, haven't called the local dealer to get a price.
is what I need. But my question is whether I should also replace the clutch by buying the "clutch set":
Manufacturer: Honda
Part Number: 38900-RLC-024
Part: CLUTCH SET, COMPRESSOR
Replaces: 38900-RLC-014
The clutch set costs $170 and doesn't seem to me that there should be anything wrong with it since everything was working fine until the ac stopped working all of a sudden. The compressor doesn't appear to be locked up as I can rotate the armature plate without any problem.
So my plan is to get the parts and find a mechanic that will just do the clutch job without touching the freon. So far I am 0 for 2.
Just curious, ezone, can you do the job without even loosening up the compressor? Do you remove the right front wheel and the wheel well to get access?
Oh, yeah. I've got an '07 Sport.
Last edited by zeeman; 09-19-2017 at 01:41 AM.
#26
09-19-2017, 11:28 PM
Whenever I do one on any Honda, I try to do the complete set: Clutch and pulley kit, and a coil.
Takes care of several possible issues in one shot, and much less risk of a comeback (covers my azz).
If you can see the entire pulley when you take the wheel off and the splash shield down, you can usually change it right there without a lot of fuss. I know I changed the pulley on our 07 in the car but now I can't remember if I did it while the oil pan was off or not (it got a head gasket and fresh piston rings at that time)
Yes I do them "on the car" whenever possible.
That doesn't mean everyone else does (or can).
If you're calling shops about them doing the work for you....you probably won't be able to get what you think you want.
You're calling shops because you can't do the work yourself, therefore you don't get to dictate how someone else gets the work done.
The labor guide says X.x to do the job plus recover/evacuate/recharge the freon, so that's what the estimate is made out for, and that's what you will be billed for. (It doesn't matter how the job is actually completed, the labor guide is for figuring out the labor fees)
Plus, if you supply your own parts that means the shop loses out on parts profit, so labor fees may be jacked up accordingly.
Takes care of several possible issues in one shot, and much less risk of a comeback (covers my azz).
If you can see the entire pulley when you take the wheel off and the splash shield down, you can usually change it right there without a lot of fuss. I know I changed the pulley on our 07 in the car but now I can't remember if I did it while the oil pan was off or not (it got a head gasket and fresh piston rings at that time)
Yes I do them "on the car" whenever possible.
That doesn't mean everyone else does (or can).
If you're calling shops about them doing the work for you....you probably won't be able to get what you think you want.
You're calling shops because you can't do the work yourself, therefore you don't get to dictate how someone else gets the work done.
The labor guide says X.x to do the job plus recover/evacuate/recharge the freon, so that's what the estimate is made out for, and that's what you will be billed for. (It doesn't matter how the job is actually completed, the labor guide is for figuring out the labor fees)
Plus, if you supply your own parts that means the shop loses out on parts profit, so labor fees may be jacked up accordingly.
Last edited by ezone; 09-19-2017 at 11:30 PM.
#27
12-01-2019, 05:09 PM
I do compressor clutch/pulley/coil replacements all the time.
Honda sells them separate from the compressor.
Aftermarket almost always makes you buy an entire compressor.
I really try to avoid replacing Hondas reliable OE compressors that are still good, and really hate installing a junk aftermarket reman compressor that only has a 50/50 chance of lasting longer than one year.
I will always try to find a way to get a clutch set replaced without having to discharge and recharge freon.
I know I've replaced it on 07-08 without having to touch the freon.
If you have all the right tools and know what you are doing, it's doable in an hour IMO.
Honda sells them separate from the compressor.
Aftermarket almost always makes you buy an entire compressor.
I really try to avoid replacing Hondas reliable OE compressors that are still good, and really hate installing a junk aftermarket reman compressor that only has a 50/50 chance of lasting longer than one year.
I will always try to find a way to get a clutch set replaced without having to discharge and recharge freon.
I know I've replaced it on 07-08 without having to touch the freon.
If you have all the right tools and know what you are doing, it's doable in an hour IMO.
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