I installed a new set of winter tires last week on my spare set of wheels. I bought four new TPMS sensors and had them installed in the wheels. NTB (National Tire and Battery) installed the sensors and put the tires on the wheel. They used the TPMS tool to read all four sensors and programmed them into the computer.

Normally the warning light goes off after the car has driven for a little bit. I have driven over 300 miles at highway speeds and lower and the light is still blinking. Not the TPMS light, which is what used to light up when I didn't have sensors installed. It is the picture of the tire with an exclamation point that is blinking.

What is wrong? I had the reprogramming done twice, at different NTBs and I have the same result.

Thanks for you help.

-- Paul

 

When "TPMS" light is on, the sensors themselves are bad (dead battery) or not programmed for your car to get the signal.

The "tire cross-section with exclamation point in middle" warning light indicates the the air pressure in one or more tires is too low. Mine seem to set off the low pressure alert (tire cross-section light) when the pressure is down around 25 psi or lower. You should add some air to all four tires.

Do you have an owner's manual? What does it say?

 

The tire pressure was checked in all of the tires when they installed it. The TPMS programmer showed each sensor and the pressures were mid 30's.


The manual only mentions the low pressure warning light being turned on steady, which I have had happen before when a tire was low. It doesn't mention what it means when it is blinking. That is why I posted this.

 

Blinking light could mean low battery in one or more of the TPMS sensors....or maybe a sensor isn't transmitting while the wheel is spinning (but will respond to the handheld scanner).

A good TPMS tool can do more than just read pressures: The status of the lithium battery in each sensor can be read, along with temperature and sensor ID too.

Some can even plug into the car and read fault codes from the TPMS system.

Have the fault codes read from the TPMS system and see what it has to say.

 

iss407: I just reviewed the TPMS section of the big service manual and didn't see anything about "blinking" low tire pressure light. Only mentioned that either light was "on" or "off".

Apparently the system does put out fault codes (Diagnostic Trouble Codes) that can be read.

Maybe you are at that stage.

PS: Under "Memorizing the Tire Pressure Sensor ID" it states after step 9 - disconnect the HDS (Honda's programming tool) from the OBDII plug, step 10 says to test drive at least 28 mph for 1 minute, and step 11 states, "Make sure the low tire pressure indicator does not blink." That is the only reference to "blinking" anything.

 

The sensor batteries are good, they are brand new.

I'm not sure what could be different from the last time I installed new sensors.

Is there an issue that the sensors from the summer wheels are still in the system?

 

New doesn't necessarily mean good.

NEW stands for Never Ever Worked. If the sensors were not registered to the car, I think the TPMS warning would have turned on within about 20 miles.

Have the fault codes read from the TPMS system and see what it has to say.

Any faults other than low tire pressures will be meaningful, but without knowing what code(s) were present prior to the current issue the codes may need to be erased so you can start from scratch.

If the tire store can't read the fault codes, your Honda dealership can.

 

Do you use any electronics in the car while driving? Cellphone, phone or battery charger, laptop, inverter, ANYthing at all?
Drive without anything else electronic in the car for a while, see if the problems disappear.

RF emissions can interfere with the control unit receiving the tire pressure sensor signals

 

The dealer wants $125 before they even look at the car. I only paid $110 to buy the sensors. I hate going to the dealers because I feel like they only see me as a bag of money and they want to see how much they can get out.

I do have a lot of electronics in the car. I'll try turning it all off for a while.

What about the trick with the tire pressure? I think it was dropping the tire pressure down 10 psi and then back up in 10 seconds. What would that do?

Thanks for the help.

 

I've only ever done that with brand new cars, and that was before we got a speedy and efficient tool to read and activate the sensors.

It was done to 'wake up' sensors in brand new cars from a shipping/storage state.
In that state, the sensors won't become active (start transmitting) by centrifugal force as the wheel spins while driving.
Once a sensor is activated it shouldn't ever need done again.

Waking up a new sensor does not automatically register it to the car, however.
That should have been done with the scanner, as you said in your first post. That registration process included waking up the sensors and force them to transmit, to register them electronically in the control unit.



Kill all of your electronics and see what happens. Leave them at home if you have to.

 

What about going back to NTB and tell them that it isn't working?

The dealer might feel that they are getting dropped into the middle of a dog fight and jacked up their price to participate. I hate going there too. I always ask the rep when is it time to change my power steering fluid and they'll spout off 60K miles - problem is a FIT has electric steering / no fluids. I always get a laugh out of "my" joke. Our dealer charges $60 for diagnostics but they may be making their money a different way.

Again, why not involve NTB?

 

I have gone back to NTB. My stepson works there. They've programmed it three times, and two different branches. The last time my stepson did it himself and everything on their programmer says it is all fine.

But I bought the sensors myself and had them install them. I could force them to do more if I bought them there, but that is not the case.

The link to the sensors I bought is in the first post. They are genuine honda sensors and correct for my Fit, according to the seller.

 

42753-TR3-A81


Fits 09-13 Fit, plus several other models and years

 

That's the exact sensor I bought. Just wondering why it won't program correctly.

 

Ok, didn't know the back story: Genuine Honda sensors and that you have been back to NTB several times.

Has NTB tried to read any codes thru the OBDII port? The big Honda service manual only references the use of the Honda spec scanner, so don't know if a scanner from Snap-On, etc can go that "deep" into Honda's ECM system. My only experience was using a scan tool was with the CEL coming on.

In our area, almost all of the car parts places like Advance Auto, NAPA, AutoZone, have $100 scan tools and will do it for free. They won't erase error codes that might allow you to slip thru the state mandated annual safety inspections (Pennsylvania). That might be a quick / cheap way to check before going to a dealer.

If you still have your summer tires / rims and they still have viable TPMS sensors, you could go back to NTB and have them try to reprogram the car to recognize them. If the process is successful and the low pressure light goes off and/or doesn't blink anymore, then you are one step closer to figuring this out: verifies that the NTB scanner equipment / reprogram process / TPMS sensors in summer tires / the in-vehicle TPMS system accepting & translating the tire TPMS signals is working.

Sometimes you have to go back to what / when it was working, break down your "big" change into smaller steps, verify functionality after each small step until you find that one thing that isn't working.

The one thing that was sort of scaring me in the service manual was their notes about needing to use wheels / rims specifically designed for TPMS. I took it to mean that there was a counter-weight built into the wheel, so when a technican goes to balance the finished product, they don't have to use two layers of weights to offset the TMPS on the other side. Best of luck

 

We know there's a problem, but I'm not convinced it's a programming problem.

Drive it around with all extra electronics powered down/disconnected first, see if that's causing the problems.


If not....
Knowing the fault codes would help a lot, but the OBD2 code readers at the parts stores generally only read engine and trans codes. When you return to NTB, make sure their equipment can read the fault codes in the TPMS system and find out what they are.


Also......check if any of the tires are inflated over 50 PSI. Seems like I remember once finding that causing something weird to happen.

 

Sensors are quite light, it's not a balance issue.

I believe, because of the type of sensors used, the valve stem area on the wheel has to be machined nice and flat so the thin rubber gasket on the metal stem of the sensor can seal, and positioned/angled so the sensor can lay sort of flat against the inside of the wheel and won't stick up to be easily broken while mounting/dismounting a tire.

 

Had another NTP try it, no luck. They could not read any codes, TPMS or anything else. The tires are inflated properly and all of the sensors are read by the programming tool just fine.

I'm at a loss.

 

I specialize in solving problems (for a fee, of course).
You'd have to bring the car to me though.....and I'm certainly not local to you.

 

I'm willing to pay a reasonable amount for someone who knows what to do and is able to fix it. It is when the local dealer want's $125 before they even open the door that I draw the line.