Manual Transmission: expect less to be made in 2016
 

Hey Guys and Gals,

So I wanted to share some information with you in regards to 6 speed Fits. We are unofficially expecting a lower production of Fits with the manual option for the following reasons:

1. The majority of 2015 Fits still in dealer lots, specifically in my region, have the 6 Speed.

2. Only 4% of all vehicles sold last year had a manual transmission

3. While it may not show in the Honda website, we have heard that not every color in the LX and EX will be made with available with the 6 Speed. It will follow a similar pattern to the Honda Accord, where manuals will only be available in a few colors (Modern Steel and Black in the Accord's case)

As we all know too well, while the majority of us prefer a manual, the yield rate just keeps decreasing each year. Im glad Honda still offer so many models with a manual, but I can understand, from a business stand point, why the change.

Its like the Civic. 99% of customers who come in looking for a Civic with a manual are specifically looking for an Si. Civic LX and EX are produced in very small numbers.

This is just an FYI if you find it difficult finding any 2016s with a manual transmission.

Thanks for the heads up.

Here in Canada my wait for a 2016 6MT is up to 8 weeks for one "on rail", and Jan 2016 (up to 4 months) for an order.

It need not be this way. Merge the US and Canadian options to be the same, making manufacturing so much easier. Do this for enough countries. The Fit is an international car, so be more international.

FYI If you could ship your unwanted 2015 6MTs north, Canada will take them. While the FFs here love the 6MT, the reality is that for Canada/US, the manual shift will be a quaint footnote of automotive history. I'm moving to Uruguay.

I just posted in another thread that autotrader search shows 0 manual 2016 fits right now. the few 2016 fits I've seen have been ex-l autos. this sucks. a 2015 purple manual fit that I had money down on got sold by another dealer that had agreed to trade it to my dealer, so now I'm waiting for a 2016. doesn't sound good.

About time for a Fit Si, don't you think?


Looking like I may have bought my last new car then. I DO NOT buy automatic transmissions. Not now, not ever.

The color limitations are sad, IMO. Honda should AT LEAST change the available (limited colors on MT cars) each year.

And HondaGeek, dealers should take at least partial blame for Honda's perception that "Manuals Don't Sell". While purchasing our last three Hondas, the pressure to 'buy automatic' was intense.

The 6MT ratio fitment is interesting also. I higher-ratio top gear would have benefited both our CR-V and the '15 Fit. The highway mileage would have been better. (Some folks have added a 6th OD ratio to their CR-V just by adding the gear from an Acura TSX, the highway mileage goes up 3 - 5 MPG.) Was there a desire by the Honda marketing folks to enhance the apparent fuel savings of hybrids? We'll never know. I'm sure that the CAFE numbers would have been better with more optimal top ratios.


(Let the flames begin) HeeHee.

Bunch of lazy Americans with their automatics. Who drives the market, Honda or the consumer? One could argue both sides. I agree if Honda offered the same trims for both Canada and US there would be a market shift. If the only color I can get in a manual is a black or dark blue I'll be happy.

It really comes down to the ability to sway consumers from one option to the other. Every stick driver can handle a auto, but most auto drivers can't drive stick. Honda's choice of a short 6th gear holds mileage down on the manual which also makes it less attractive to the populace.

It's a passive-aggressive way to steer the market, but it appears that the stick shift will disappear, probably about five years before the steering wheel disappears too!

I've said this on other threads but the FIT never needed a 6th gear, it needed a taller 5th gear. Granted yes its a way to steer the market, and believe it or not I can easily get 40 MPG with my 6MT if I work at it.

When the steering wheel disappears and were all forced to travel that way, I hope to not be around to see that day. haha!

In the past 6 years I have worked for Acura, Lexus and Honda. It may sound quite unbelievable, but I could probably count on both hands how many customers have specifically asked for a manual.

I agree with GeorgeL that it comes down to the manufacturers swaying consumers from manuals to automatic, which in turn was motivated by the fact that automatics are simply more efficient now and faster.

I love manual transmissions, to the point that I have had two 240sx,two Evo Xs, an RX8, Acura TSX, three Civic Sis and a Honda Fit. They were all manuals.

But there is a reason why Ferrari does not offer manuals anymore. New automatics are simply faster and open up a new buying audience.

If you only knew how many people say," I wish the Civic Si came in automatic".

Dealers sell what the manufacturers make available. Lexus does not offer a single manual car anymore and, even though the sales staff would love for one to be available, its just not. We accepted that fact and moved on to sell what was made available. Similar to how your company may have made changes that perhaps you don't agree with, but you still stayed working for them or looked for a different employer.

While I knew that no one would be happy with this post, my purpose was just to give members a heads up, if a 6 speed Fit was in the plans.

While I don't agree with every decision Honda makes, I still believe they make the best non-luxury car. I mean, isn't this the reason why we are all on FitFreak to begin?

Wordwide use of Manual Transmission
 

I know most of this forum is Canada/US-based, but there are others from other parts of the world.

Canada/US: automatic 90%
South America: manual 99%
Australia: automatic 90%
Europe/Britain: manual 70%
Asia: manual
China: 50-50%
Japan: ?
Russia: 50-50%

Worldwide, is the manual transmission in the future really dead when more than half the world's population still prefer manual?

It is in America, unfortunately. Just like the NA engine. Sooner rather than later, cars will mainly have small turbo engines and some type of automatic transmission.

Another main contributor is the geography of each region. Having lived in South America, with the high number of mountain roads, manuals make a lot of sense due to the use of engine braking. This simple fact is one reason why in those parts of the world manuals are more available.

The greater majority of America is flat.

When I went to Japan two years ago and drove several rental cars, I noticed that almost every car on the road was automatic. Even all the little kei cars; all automatic. The only manuals I noticed, while glancing by parked cars, were small cars built until the early 2000's. I consider Japan to 95% automatic.

I was in South Africa earlier this year for work, and 95% of the cars on the road are manual. Even the Mercedes C250 chauffeur that picked me up at the airport was a manual. All of the rental cars that I rented were, and while walking and glancing in parked cars, all were manual. When I asked some South African work colleagues about this, they said everyone drives a manual. Automatics are solely for the disabled, or the elderly. That gave me a chuckle

I agree. My old 510 did fine with four, and the cruise RPM was the same as a Fit in 6th. Modern engines have wider powerbands, so why does it need 6? Marketing!

Well, it will be interesting, not controlling the car. I hate to lose that feeling, but at the same time the increased efficiency, speed and safety is attractive.

Driving might end up like sailing, something done for recreation, unencumbered by modern technology (except for GPS, radar, chartplotter, weatherfax, autohelm, etc.).

Like a vintage motorcycle. You can shift gears. Many older ones are not even FI. No accurate fuel gauge, may not have a clock much less a GPS or other niceties. You can add a windshield if you want more comfort.

Not likely. Non self-driving vehicles won't be allowed on most roads due to safety concerns.


For that matter, parts for my 22 year old Harley-Davidson are becoming more scarce every year as well. Of course, running it into a ditch last week didn't help, I suppose.

The majority of America is nothing like New Jersey.

For that matter lots of New Jersey is mountainous.

Our 1990 Honda Civic Si was a 5sp
Our 2000 Honda Civic SI is a 5 sp
Our 2004 Honda CR-V EX was a 5sp
I went looking for a 2016 Honda HR-V M/T and could not find one ...
the dealers I talked to swore there was very little demand for them.
I drove a loaded HR-V EX-L (CVT) and hated the ride - very numb,
but maybe the M/T would be better ...

Since I needed something pronto, I wound up buying a 2012 Honda Fit Sport 5 sp -
I figure I'll look for a replacement in a couple years, at MY pace ...
maybe I'll order something new ... but the Fit 5sp is a blast to drive ...

Compared to Florida, anyway. (Says an ex-Coloradoan.)

You are a die hard Big "H" Honda fan.

It is hard to say how long you'd need to wait for an MT, but probably 4-6 weeks if you could not find one on the lot. There have been pockets of the US that have new 2015 6MTs, but no CVTs.

Only one dealership here in Toronto had a Fit 6MT that I could test drive. I found the 6MT buttery smooth and bought then and there. The difference between the 6MT and the CVT is very negatively significant for me. Dropping $20k on a 6MT without a test drive is more risk than I want to take.

I don't think so, at first anyway. The only way to transition to self-driving vehicles is for them to co-exist with driven vehicles, as the current prototypes do.

However, I eventually see the point at which driven vehicles will be prohibited on some or all roads. The advantages of being able to allow higher speeds and eliminate traffic lights will eventually lead to driven vehicles being allowed on closed courses only.

Bob Lindsey Honda in Peoria, IL still shows three 2015 EX / 6MT Fits left.

I honestly *really* would have preferred the 6MT, but the gearing is horrible for my use case, and I got the CVT instead (first automatic I've ever had for my DD). It's perfectly fine for the highway trips I make, but I really long for the MT when I'm carving one of the few curvy spots out here in the Middle West.

es

Completely agree with you - thus - I bought the Fit to tide me over til inventories are larger ...
and avoid any HR-V 1st year production jitters ...

hecho en mexico

When I asked to test drive a manual the salesman looked shocked and said he had never had someone as young as me ask for a manual. I'm 33.

This is pretty shocking to me. While it is difficult to find a manual to test drive at a dealership, I know that many other people here in Toronto have asked. I did eventually find a 2016 6MT to test drive. There are also quite a number of older used Fits, usually Gen1s, that are available in 5MT, here in Toronto.

Well I ended up getting a manual and got a good deal on it since they complained they couldn't sell them

yeah i got my 2012 GE8 last year for a steal. think i paid 7k for it. i saw it listed at 9k, then 8, then 7 went and snatched it up. when i got there they said it was going to auction the next day if i hadn't come. apparently you can't sell manuals. what can i say people are dumb, lazy, or disabled, sometimes all three... my father insisted (rightly) that i learn to drive standard -- i fought tooth and nail against it, but now, i only drive manuals, and he only drives autos lol. go figure. what are you going to do? just think of manual as a privilege that you will eventually lose.. so make the most of it now!

When I was shopping for my Fit, I went to Toyota to compare the Yaris, Scion XD, and Corolla, but the entire dealer did not have manuals for these or other models (except for some sport car around 30K). The salesman was also surprised that I wanted a manual - I'm 33 now, but was 32 then.
In general, I had a hard time finding manuals when cross-shopping, whether it was a new or used car........I'm glad that the majority of the world is still into manuals. I've even met people in other countries who have never driven an automatic.

There was a 2008 Fit base 5MT GD8 in a dealer's used lot in June, so we test drove it. 120k km/75k mi, dash was damaged, 14" tires, not in great shape, going for $10k. Still, it was pretty smooth. It sat for a couple of months, dropping to $8k. We decided that, for a 7 year old car that was 2 generations old, we'd rather buy new. If it dropped to $7k or less we would have considered it. It eventually did disappear, but I'm unsure what happened. The sales guy could not move the car because he could not drive stick. Second gen Fit 5MTs are hard to find and relatively expensive here, almost close to the new 2016 base price.

Manual cars do sell here. I guess we have more immigrants from so many other countries that drive stick, so they do sell here in Toronto.

Your Dad did you a great favour by insisting on manual. Good for both of you.

News: Globe and Mail, The shift from manual: Why the demise of stick shift is accelerating: This is very sad, but I'll guarantee that my kids will have the privilege of learning stick.

I don't understand the "I can't drive a manual" mentality. You know how I learned? I bought one, then I HAD to learn.


Truth be known, I already knew how to drive a dirt bike, so I understood the concept, and I'd driven my Dad's old Corvair on the driveway once or twice. Still, the first manual I drove on the street was my first new car I ever bought. That was back in '79, and I've never owned an automatic since.


But then, I'm just a stubborn old man. What do I know?

Thank God for that. Hondageek may have been to South America, but never in the Great Smokeys of N.C., KY, TN or the Trail of the Snake. Much less the Rockies.

As for driverless cars, fheh. Even without all the computers required for that, remember how a pair of hackers drove a Chrysler product into a ditch. And Tesla just upgraded customers software from the cloud without permission or warning last night?

That's what I did with my first car

OK that's the SECOND time this has been mentioned.

Don't you mean, Tail of the Dragon?


The only references to Trail of the Snake that Google comes up with are roads in Baja Mexico...

You're right. CRS, Senior Moment, Old Timer's Disease ... whatever I'll be 75 on Bruce Lee's birthday. No slow shifting or some van, pickup truck, or motorcycle will run you down.

Yes, the hackers will be after them, and there will be bozos in manually-driven cars that will try to screw them up by driving oddly nearby. It's to be expected, but there are ways to harden the systems. The reason that Chrysler was hacked is because they did absolutely nothing to safeguard their system.

Thousands of elevators are computer-controlled and they are attractive targets, but we haven't heard of an elevator being hacked.

Same here, I would definitely prefer the MT, but the gearing and noise at 75 highway speeds is not pleasant to converse with the family without raising voices beyond comfort levels. I've already got interior loudness from road and engine noise in the Integra.

Hey KentFinn,


Thanks for being a part of the thread. I've actually lived on both coasts of the country, including many drives from CA to FL and FL to NY. While the country's western physiographics are definitely more mountainous, you have plenty of flat, desert areas for long distances of travel. Once you leave the Rockies going east, you have the Great Plains and a greater majority of flat lands. Not saying there are no mountains in other states, but if you take out Alaska and Hawaii and focus on the continental United States, the average height above sea level is way under 1000ft for the majority of States.


This is even more so in the most densely populated parts of the country, which automakers look at.


That being said, I would love the majority of the cars sold in America to be manual. The reality is that us enthusiasts and others who prefer a manual make up the smallest percentages of buyers.

Our dealership in St. Catharines (Henley Honda) had a LX-CVT and a EX-6MT available for us to test drive back in July. We went with the 6MT and ordered one in late August. Supposed to arrive by this Saturday, so after getting windows tinted Monday hope to have it sitting in the driveway Tuesday next to our 2013 Ridgeline. Yup, we drank the Honda Kool-Aid!

BTW, anyone from Toronto, HH is a great dealership, we've been very happy with the service.

Ridgelines are in hot demand near me. Its a very nice trunk, no matter what the rest of Merica says.

My car was still listed as available on my dealer's website for weeks after they sold the car. And later, quite by accident, I came across a 2-minute video made in the dealer's back lot (right where I first saw the Fit) ... It was almost like finding a movie of your girl friend on a porn site.