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Warning: 2016 Honda Fit Catalytic Converter Failure

  #1  
Old 02-22-2018, 05:19 PM
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fuel bashing thread

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Last edited by 2015honda; 02-27-2018 at 09:19 AM. Reason: thread caused too much hostility between members.
  #2  
Old 02-22-2018, 05:59 PM
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The cost of an RV6 downpipe with cat is $429, and the catless version is $100 less. Not sure on labor, put it in myself, but even the catless version doesn't throw any codes. Both versions retain the EGR pipe.

Edit- not suggesting people avoid using their warranty, but if you're out of warranty and don't want to pay the cost of factory parts, there's an option available that even keeps the cat.
 
  #3  
Old 02-22-2018, 09:49 PM
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The catalytic converter is part of the vehicle's emission control system.
Under Federal Law, its warranty goes far beyond the standard 36,000 miles or three years. If the cat is bad, the dealership should replace it under warranty.
If they argue with you, just call Honda Corporate, 800-999-1009
 
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Old 02-22-2018, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by 2015honda View Post
Hey all,

Have a 2016 Honda Fit. Owned since new. Always put in 87 octane.
Had check engine light come on around 25,000 miles. Dealer said it showed Catalytic Converter and said they cleared the code and that I probably put in 85 ethanol fuel and I need to stop doing that. (which I have never mistakenly put in the wrong fuel. E85 is not that common in Oklahoma and Texas. Besides, even if I had a vehicle that would take it, I wouldn't use it due to the poor fuel economy of E85 over regular)
Several thousand miles later, the check engine light came on again. Took it to dealer and asked for a difference service advisor. Technician said Catalytic Converter failure code. They called Honda and Honda told the dealer they have been having to replace Catalytic Converters on the Honda Fits. The Part was replaced under warranty.

So if this happens to you, be aware that Honda knows there is an issue and don't let the dealer push you off if you are getting close to warranty expiring. The cost of a new Catalytic Converter is over $900 installed by dealer.
thanks for the heads up. my GK is also right around 25k..
 
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Old 02-22-2018, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Gregg View Post
The catalytic converter is part of the vehicle's emission control system. Under Federal Law, its warranty goes far beyond the standard 36,000 miles or three years. If the cat is bad, the dealership should replace it under warranty. If they argue with you, just call Honda Corporate, 800-999-1009
According to my Canadian 2018 warranty manual the catalytic converter (and a few other emissions components) are covered for 8 years or 130,000 KM (80,000 miles). I would imagine the US warranty is comparable.
 

Last edited by woof; 02-22-2018 at 10:18 PM.
  #6  
Old 02-23-2018, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by woof View Post
According to my Canadian 2018 warranty manual the catalytic converter (and a few other emissions components) are covered for 8 years or 130,000 KM (80,000 miles). I would imagine the US warranty is comparable.
Without looking it up, I believe the US emissions warranty is similar.
 
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Old 02-23-2018, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by 2015honda View Post
Hey all,

Have a 2016 Honda Fit. Owned since new. Always put in 87 octane.
Had check engine light come on around 25,000 miles. Dealer said it showed Catalytic Converter and said they cleared the code and that I probably put in 85 ethanol fuel and I need to stop doing that. (which I have never mistakenly put in the wrong fuel. E85 is not that common in Oklahoma and Texas. Besides, even if I had a vehicle that would take it, I wouldn't use it due to the poor fuel economy of E85 over regular)
Several thousand miles later, the check engine light came on again. Took it to dealer and asked for a difference service advisor. Technician said Catalytic Converter failure code. They called Honda and Honda told the dealer they have been having to replace Catalytic Converters on the Honda Fits. The Part was replaced under warranty.

So if this happens to you, be aware that Honda knows there is an issue and don't let the dealer push you off if you are getting close to warranty expiring. The cost of a new Catalytic Converter is over $900 installed by dealer.
Thanks for the heads up on this. Cat converters ain't cheap. Very glad Honda warrantied that for you.
 
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Old 02-23-2018, 11:36 AM
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In Ontario here, came here to say cat died at 59540km, so did one of the spark plug causing misfire.

Dealer replaced everything including fuel injector
 
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Old 02-23-2018, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by justanewbie View Post
In Ontario here, came here to say cat died at 59540km, so did one of the spark plug causing misfire.

Dealer replaced everything including fuel injector
My bet is that an injector failed which took out a plug and catalytic converter.

Cat's last a long time under good circumstances, but can fail very quickly with a misfire or faulty injector.

I would not be surprised if we hear that the OP ends up with a problem again. Generally speaking, a failed catalytic converter is the symptom of a different problem.
 
  #10  
Old 02-23-2018, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by GAFIT View Post
My bet is that an injector failed which took out a plug and catalytic converter.

Cat's last a long time under good circumstances, but can fail very quickly with a misfire or faulty injector.

I would not be surprised if we hear that the OP ends up with a problem again. Generally speaking, a failed catalytic converter is the symptom of a different problem.
You are most likely right. Raw fuel into a CAT will kill it in short order. Although it is interesting that the dealer said they are seeing dead cats on those Fit's.
 
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Old 02-23-2018, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by ashchuckton View Post
You are most likely right. Raw fuel into a CAT will kill it in short order. Although it is interesting that the dealer said they are seeing dead cats on those Fit's.
Probably all Direct Injection related. Compounded if not using Top Tier fuel as recommended in the manual.

Here's how it goes...

Carbon deposits build up on backside of valves which restricts air flow. Car runs rich. Plugs foul and catalytic converter fails. If the fuel is especially bad or the car isn't run hard enough, the carbon fouling can even extend into the combustion chamber and foul the plugs or cause injector failure.

Hence, the dealer seeing more catalytic converter failures. I'm sure it all began with 2015 models due to DI. Cars that aren't run hard, are used for short trips, or get low quality fuel will fail faster than others.
 
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Old 02-24-2018, 08:08 AM
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yah, ive not read about cat failures on the GD and GE..
 
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Old 02-24-2018, 08:45 AM
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Is this really a systemic problem or a way for the dealership to save face for trying to deny a replacement under warranty? I haven't really heard of cat failures on numerous GK. I've seen more reported issues with the starter.
 
  #14  
Old 02-24-2018, 10:43 AM
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On these engines that use direct injection, fault codes related to the cat at unusually low mileage have been most commonly caused by fuel injector problems....likely at least one of the injectors is overfueling.

Replace injectors and the cat code usually stays gone, without replacing the cat.


Not all techs understand this, even in dealership shops.
Many just read codes and toss parts without digging deeper.
 
  #15  
Old 02-24-2018, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by 2Rismo2 View Post
Is this really a systemic problem or a way for the dealership to save face for trying to deny a replacement under warranty? I haven't really heard of cat failures on numerous GK. I've seen more reported issues with the starter.
On these engines that use direct injection, fault codes related to the cat at unusually low mileage have been most commonly caused by fuel injector problems....likely at least one of the injectors is overfueling.

Replace injectors and the cat code usually stays gone, without replacing the cat.


Not all techs understand this, even in dealership shops.
Many just read codes and toss parts without digging deeper.
Unfortunately many times they just throw parts at it to see what sticks. This is OK when it's a warranty repair. It really can hurt if it's on your dime.
 
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Old 02-24-2018, 12:08 PM
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For warranty repairs, it's even worse because the manufacturer often won't authorize what is actually needed for the repair. They would rather apply a band aid and hope it goes out of warranty before having to fix the actual (more expensive) problem.

The OP's car probably needed at least one injector, possibly a carbon deposit cleaning, and a catalytic converter. Since the cat itself is causing the check engine light, it got just the cat. They will now hope it makes it out of warranty without the light coming back on.
 
  #17  
Old 02-24-2018, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by GAFIT View Post
Probably all Direct Injection related.
I disagree. These cat failures are occurring on low mileage cars where carbon build up will not yet be a problem - if it ever is. Even on high mileage cars there have been virtually no reports of carbon causing any problem on the Fits.

On the other hand there have been many injector problems and if memory serves me right the early GK injectors were redesigned at some point in time and replaced with a new part number(?). It may very well be that these early injectors by themselves are in some cases causing the eventual cat failures. Nothing to do with carbon build up.
 
  #18  
Old 02-24-2018, 06:27 PM
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The manufacturer really does want the cars fixed, fixed correctly, and fixed in a timely manner.

A low cat efficiency code (P0420) does not always automatically mean the cat has failed.
The fault code is simply the result how the PCM has interpreted sensor inputs during self tests.

One (or more) injector squirting too much fuel is all it takes to cause a cat code on these (and other) DI engines.
The same cat may pass the PCM's self tests again after the overfueling injector problem has been corrected.
 
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Old 02-24-2018, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by woof View Post
I disagree. These cat failures are occurring on low mileage cars where carbon build up will not yet be a problem - if it ever is. Even on high mileage cars there have been virtually no reports of carbon causing any problem on the Fits.

On the other hand there have been many injector problems and if memory serves me right the early GK injectors were redesigned at some point in time and replaced with a new part number(?). It may very well be that these early injectors by themselves are in some cases causing the eventual cat failures. Nothing to do with carbon build up.
I agree about the injectors, but there have been carbon build up issues as well. Here's just one example, but we've seen a few on these boards...

https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/3rd-...-too-lean.html

Regardless of if it's injectors and/or carbon build up, I see it as a DI problem. It's the DI type injectors that are failing.
 
  #20  
Old 02-25-2018, 01:35 AM
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Stop putting 87 octane in an 11.5 to 1 compression ratio engine, especially if it isnt up to par on detergency. If you insist on putting 87, make sure its chevron, shell, 76, or mobil. Fuck everything else, these cars are so economical you cant afford NOT to use quality gas.

Early (1/15) mexican lx 6mt, 91 chevron almost exclusively, 44k HARD miles (lots of redline, lots of rev match/heeltoe downshifts). Not a single part replaced except air filter and headlight bulbs. Idemitsu zeppro 0w20 with moly, and hamp small filters exclusively. I average 36.3 mpg per tank of mixed freeway/mountain roads, i dont drive conservatively.


Maybe im just lucky, or maybe quality gasoline and strict maintenance really make a difference in these apparently highly sensitive engines.

I am noticing a HUGE correlation between people who use crap gas, and injector failure on these cars. These are not your typical injectors, they operate at extremely high pressures (500 psi at the fuel rail) and have multiple tiny ports for high atomization (essential for direct injection). Shit gas will clog these ports, and/or make the injector stick open in a hurry.
 

Last edited by Cichlid_visuals; 02-25-2018 at 02:00 AM.

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