I have owned this car for 3 months now and during that period I think I have learned quite a bit about it. After upgrading the tires, wheels and exhaust the car is almost as good as I would expect from a worry-free, fun daily driver on a budget.
One last area that could use help is suspension.
In a nutshell, I think that the front is actually pretty decent, but the rear could be much better.
I did some reading on this and from an engineering point of view this is a tricky one.
The car is supposed to be able to handle 4, maybe 5 occupants plus some cargo - so the springs and dampers have to account for that.

Now, when I drive this car all by myself (which is 99% of the time) obviously there’s very little weight placed on the back axle and this is why the car feels bouncy and hops around a lot – the rear is unloaded and thus easily unsettled. I can safely sacrifice the rear-passenger capability for some improvement in drive quality in single-occupant scenario.
So my question is – would this be as simple as upgrading rear dampers or do I need anything else?
Softer springs? Sway bar? All of the above?

And if so, where do I look? Koni? KYB? Or…?
So I guess , basically, has anyone tried upgrading rear suspension only?I am so tempted to get the HFP kit and be done with it, but I’m thinking that simply upgrading the rear dampers could do wonders to minimize the pitch and dive this chassis suffers from.
Like I said, this is supposed to be fun on a budget after all.
Any thoughts on this?

 

I've done both koni's with lowering springs and coilovers, and the rear still hops

I'll be doing a rear sway soon, I'll report back!

 

I remember watching a video from Japan where they tested the "race-prepped" GK5 (Spoon or J's racing, can't remember) that was stiffened and lowered - you know, the usual setup - and the driver complained how bouncy the car was and he thought they need to make it way softer to allow for tires to actually get more traction and generally handle in a more predictable manner.

 

this one?

 

Yes, @11:16

 

i dont know if the rear swaybar will cure your situation...but on my second gen, the rear sway bar made a very apparent and positive change in my cars handling. very much flatter when cornering.

i dont drive very aggressive, but if i have a nice medium speed turn like a freeway on or off ramp ill push my car a bit and it feels great. id say the improvement is contributed 50/50 between the sway bar and it being lowered, not so much the rear dampers and spring rates, as my tein street basis have similar values to stock in the rear.

long story short, for street applications i seriously doubt you guys will regret trying a rear sway bar.

 

Driver mod.

Go to your local autocross school or attend an SCCA event. Ask for an instructor. Someone will be happy to rid along with you and give you pointers. Do a track day, get an instructor. You'll get more out of that, than the car modifications.

Everyone wants to mod their car first. My guess is everyone thinks they're an above average driver? Besides it's much better to talk about car mods to your buddies or on the forum than talk about going to a driving school?

In regard to the modifications. What's your budget? Are you looking for $12K worth of Penske racing shocks or $600 worth of Koni? For sake of discussion do you know how to adjust 5 way adjustable shocks? Again back to drivers school. When I took my first autocross drivers school at the local SCCA region. My instructor was a national caliber racer and competes at the SCCA Solo nations regularly. I started to ask him about setup and other technical questions. His response was "put it in second and drive" meaning that I would become faster by focusing on my driving more than modifying my car.

Good luck

 

I was going to create a clever and witty response to what you suggested, but all I will say instead is: I agree with you about everything you wrote...... but did you read my post?

 

Yes, I read your post.

I'm not sure if you're referring to "fun on a budget"? or something else? Anyway, my point is; if you're referring to the car being bouncy during cornering it could be your driving style? That might change if with some autocross or track day experience? I myself think the front end is too soft for autocross in stock form. But, I only autocross the stock or street classes such as HS or H-Steet that the Fit, fits into so I have to live with the stock springs. If you're referring to it bouncing in a straight line that could be worn/blown shock/struts. Maybe not since you said you have had the car a short time? It also could be your tires? I normally run Firestone Firehawk Indy 500's in a 205/50R16 for spring, summer, and fall daily driving. If I autocross the fit I run Bridgestone RE-71R in the same 205/50R16. The car is a whole lot bouncier on the RE-71R than it is on the Indy 500's. My guess is the sidewall on the RE71R is a whole lot stiffer? Best ride is actually on my General Altimax 195/60/15 snow tires.

In regard to budget, my WRX which I race in DS or D-Street was built to the max of the rules. Basically any two way adjustable shock/strut, stock springs, any sway bar front or rear, but not both, any 200TW tire, Cat back exhaust and alignment. Between wheels, tires, Koni yellow, 3 different rear sway back, brake pads, end links, three different alignments and Cat back exhaust I have $4K+ over the original purchase price of the car. Lets just say $5K when you add helmet, shoes and some other junk to make my day more enjoyable. All this for the street class which is designed to keep costs down.

Myself, I wouldn't change the car until you autocross or take it to a track day. There's a world of difference pushing the car to its limits and driving around on the street. Pushing the car to its limits on the street is endangering someones life, yours or the soccer mom in the mini van who didn't consent to it. When you race, you sign a waiver. Basically connecting to you might get hurt by your or someone else actions.

So what wheels and tires did you buy? Tires like the Bridgestone RE-71R or BF Goodrich Rival S 1.5 will do more for the car than changing car parts? What specific pars have you bought? That's necessary for any real help

 

Look at the video from Tanabe. Skip to 0:50 Observe how the rear bounces when the driver shifts from 1st to 2nd.
This is clearly visible at 0:52 and again at 1:05
The rear lifts first, than squats while the front lifts - can you hear the front tires chirp? Play it in slow-mo.
This ain't no autocross driving at the limit, just a spirited take off.
Now imagine the road that is more bumpy and uneven. I mean an average road. You own the car - doesn't yours to that?
Mine does it all the time.
To me it looks like inadequate rear dampers, both compression and rebound
Can this be fixed and how?
That was my original question, in a nutshell.

 

VE, No offense to you or Rob, you both seem to have some basic knowledge about this stuff. But if you want real answers, we have an awesome resource available to us here on FFn. I recommend you take this question to Ken, the official blogger here on FFn. Be advised he will not sugar coat his thoughts about cars, but know that Ken has over 30 years experience modding sport compacts for street use, and he puts that knowledge at our disposal. If he does not weigh in with the right way to go here in this thread, maybe you can reach out to him on his blog (he accepts no PMs). Hope this helps.

 

It's simple physics.....when the car's accelerating, the front rises, when off load, weight transfer goes back to front and then back again to the rear when shifted. Honda did a pretty good job, I think, in providing a pretty good all around ride. You can't have "boulevard cruiser comfort" and decently fun-to-drive in the same package, really. Buy a Progress RSB and call it a day. Or wait until you can afford a car with on-the-fly suspension adjustment. It's a huge tradeoff, especially in a car this small/light, but....the suspension needs to be able to safely accommodate the max passenger/luggage rating. Sure, solo driving is easy on the suspension, but, given 4 "full-sized" Americans, there's very little left in capacity for luggage/load. I'd prefer the "stiff" rear to bottoming out the sus on bumps. It's up to you

 

Bang for the buck, try the rear sway bar first. It delivers immediate, responsive improvement in steering output. That is, it changes how the rear of the car reacts under spring load, which changes how much you have to input on the steering wheel. I think it increases contact area of the rear tires. For $200 and 10 minute install, pretty nice... after this, I did Konis and teins. Those made the car jumpier. The teins are much softer, although progressive, springs, versus stock. I could compress them with my hand a lot...

 

It's the live axle that really limits the rear suspension. On the back road loop for my commute there's a turn with a bump running through the whole thing. The rear end has this pronounced hop as it goes over the bump and a shimmy as the rear comes back down. I've driven the same road on my 4Runner and it just soaks up the bump and doesn't even flinch.

 

I'm picking nits here but on the Fit it's a dead rear axle. Live axles transmit power whereas dead ones don't. In both cases though it's a beam axle, which means the two wheels are physically connected.

 

the front can actually use a tad more sway bar too along with the rear, the car rolls too much imo during aggressive cornering, but even with the roll the car is still controllable. ive had to make an evasive maneuver going over 65mph on da expressway to avoid an accident but the car handled it well. at no time did the car feel like it was out of my control. different dampers can control the rebound a lot better, but as u noted, being a utility type car unless ure going to dedicate it for driving im not sure if spending a lot of money is worth it.

id look up wat the factory spring rate is, find coil overs that offer similar rates with damper adjustability. most standalone dampers in this price range are fixed (no adjustability) so will be a hit or miss. while most cheap coilovers only offer simultaneous damp adjustment for bound and rebound, itll probably get it closer to where u want the car to behave.

 

yah, considering how well the GK's stock suspension handled the maneuver i mentioned above, unless specifically wanting to change the damping characteristics for comfort id leave it alone too. the car is overall soft but with the limited grip the stock tires provide, its good dat the suspension has the travel to absorb a lot of the energy too.

 

If the car is bouncing in the corners, you're driving in upstate NY, where road maintenance is all in your imagination.

 

I don't have any unreasonable expectations. I agree that Fit is pretty amazing in terms of ride comfort given the price point and its limitations as a "japanese universal car"
Great fun, very lively, handles best of all similar cars I tried IMO and most importantly has tons of personality.
I am absolutely ready to accept its flaws in exchange for overall level of enjoyment I get driving this thing daily.

The idea about getting those rear shocks upgraded is based on my experience with the Abarth - front shocks on that car were Koni FSD (dual-flow setup that offered some mechanical-type self-adjustability on-the-go) and for all the weight that car carried upfront they did an admirable job. Rears in the meantime were just plain cheap OEM off-the shelf shock that were easily compressed by hand without any effort whatsoever.
Something as simple as a matching size KYB monotube damper made a great deal of difference in the way rear of the car behaved on bumps and in turns. It was actually astonishing how much improvement you would get for $70 bucks.
I guess I was hoping someone might have tried something similar with the FIT and can confirm my suspicion that a set of decent quality rear shock would indeed offer a great return for a little money.
I've only had the car for 3 months so I still have lots to learn...

 

That's weight transfer. You can fix that with a set of wheelie bars. https://www.dragzine.com/news/wheeli...p-tuning-tips/

Instead of trying to "fix" your car, learn to use weight transfer to you advantage while driving or racing your car. Again go to your local SCCA regions autocross event. People will be nice and help you. Tell them at registration you're new and would like an instructor. They will find someone to ride along with you. You can also ask people for rides. Most will be happy to let you ride along. There are exceptions like their last run and they need more speed to move up a spot. Most will welcome ride alongs especially for first timers. EVERYONE wants you to have a good time and come back. Without new people the hobby will eventually die. I already said it, but learn to drive your car before modifying it.

Someone suggested a rear sway bar. Yes that will help the car rotate but at the expense of tying more of the rear suspension together. Both FWD and AWD cars have the tendency to lift the rear wheel during hard cornering. Yes, if in a stock autocross class some have to go that route. I had to go that route with my WRX, but it's not really the proper way to fix things.

You should read this:

http://farnorthracing.com/autocross_secrets6.html
and this:
http://farnorthracing.com/autocross_secrets18.html
and this:
http://farnorthracing.com/autocross_secrets18.html







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