Here's my one argument, and it sounds funny but I think it's legit.

A businessman who drives his prius from SF to San Jose (50 miles one way) every day pollutes more than a housewife who drives the hummer 1 mile to the grocery

I know this sounds like an unfair comparison, but my point is most people assume green is what car you drive. They never consider the amount of driving that car does. A green car can still spit out a lot of CO2 if you drive a lot.

The reason I say this is because when an environmentalist sees a prius, they automatically assume that person is green. While if they see a Hummer, they want to kill that car. My mom drives an acura RDX which I consider a gas guzzler. But she only drives 10 miles round trip a day to work. My fit I drive 70 miles round trip.

I know you might think "well, your long commute is better with a fit/prius than a truck". That's true, long distance drivers are better off with high mileage cars. But you can't say that for people who commute short distances. For them, it makes negligible difference (to themselves or the world) whether to drive a hybrid or a truck to work so they're more likely to drive a car they like.

The lesson: Don't judge a book by it's cover.

 

Depends on the environmentalist. I consider myself one. Everytime I see a Prius, to be honest the first thing I think is there goes someone that doesn't know any better, had extra change in their pockets to pay the premium price for one. But at least they are trying, which to me is better than not which is where the Hummer comes in.

When I see a Hummer, I think, there goes someone who just doesn't give a rats ass because they have the money to blow and could care less what other think. They have money, and its more inportant to look cool than to worry about the environment.

 

Good argument, but if you must drive 50 miles everyday then using a Prius to do it is probably going to be a greener option than the Hummer.

Just like if that housewife decided to take the Prius to the store instead of the Hummer it would be a greener option.

 

You are comparing Apples and Oranges, unless you are suggesting everyone should just drive less? Driving less is a different item that using less fuel for the same work. I'd have to say for most, that's a way larger issue to change that what you drive in. Changing houses is an expensive deal.

Anything that gets less than 15mpg, not including trucks needed to work, is far from green for one reason, the same work could be done using way less fuel and less pollution.

Sorry to say, but in the USA it will take gas going to $5/ to make that change. I think even at close to $4, we are seeing the change start.

 

Sadly, my husband read an article some time back that actually spelled out how a hummer IS greener than a prius IN THE LONG RUN. The article was stating that if you consider the whole life of the vehicle from the making of it (which includes energy spent on the making of the parts), fuel, emissions clear to the end of it's life including the recycling of parts, and the energy to deal with reusing the parts, the hummer wins out. The hummer's body is metal where the prius atleast in part is made of composites which may not all be reusable, and dealing with old batteries at the end of their life is a big problem and uses energy to safely dispose of them.

Does this mean a hummer is better? No. Ultimately it only means we have a long way to go to figure this whole thing out. Personally I think it means eliminating gas altogether. Peak oil, wars, let's get out of this mess!

(Hubby just told me he doesn't believe it - I don't think he WANTS to believe it) whatever.

 

Green or not. With gas prices higher I'd have to pay $5000 more for a hybrid like Civic or Prius just to drive one and similar premium for used versions.

If I don't drive more than about 5000-7000 miles per year then that extra $5000 isn't a good use of funds although the resale value on the hybrid is strong.

I don't qualify for rebate on hybrid so that doesn't help.

Now I hate Hummers but since they are big, if you take a huge bunch of people around and save on two cars driving or haul a lot of stuff for recycling then it's no worse. Just avoid the long trips with one or two people.

If you take your Hummer camping and avoid all the expensive tourist places and live out of a tent or similar that's pretty green too.

 

...because it IS unfair comparison. Of course there will be exception in any extreme condition.

However, using extreme condition to justify for general driving is pretty useless and do not prove/solve a thing. We talking about world wide environment impact here.

Of course I can say that for people who commute short distance using Hummer (even though it's really stupid to do so). Using the same analogy, the person who use Hummer to drive 1 mile to grocery store is still pollute much more than if he/she use the Prius to drive the same distance.


...at the same time, the cover reveals quite good information about the content inside.

 

Drive a Prius one mile to go grocery shopping?!?

Probably the gas engine doesn't even turn on, do the whole trip on electric!
You couldn't tell if the gas engine was on anyway.

Probably wear out the starter and battery and rust out the exhaust with enough of those short trips.

Just get a bike for a one mile trip, add a basket and wear a backpack. Put a soft foldable coldpack in the basket for frozen goods. Bet the bike ride would only take about 3-4 minutes longer to travel than the car given the stoplights.

 

1/ I have no comment on the harmful part on the Prius, since i have not tried it

2/ I just use the same analogy for the sake of argument. Of course, very few people would do that in real life.
And NO, those who buy Hummer just to drive 1 mile to glossary store (if there's any) is definitely not green, because either they:

* Consider the look over the function & much less..the environment

or

* Truly clueless in their decision...<- have no comment on this also

 

Im sorry to say thats terrible reasoning and far off.
the Prius is the one of the few right now that can be called (AT-PZEV) Advanced Technology Partial Zero Emission Vehicle.
The startup alone on a hummer would emit almost as much as half the prius's trip would. considering the prius if kept at or below 40 doesnt engage the engine and runs sheerly off the battery. And when the hybrid drive is engaged past 40 it emits something like 70% less emissions than most other vehicles in its class.
Lets compare the H3, its straight-5 engine requires alot more fuel to power the car, with that more air is drawn for a correct mixture of the two, relative to the amount initially drawn in, a staggering amount is released.
The thing is Hummer's are pure luxury, unless your going on an african safari adventure, or have to climb over rocks to get to work, its a worthless buy. And one that only hurts your pocket, and the environment.
Purely speculation I know this was hypothetical.

 

My arguements are somewhat different. If you think about it, a prius is a DOHC, which pretty much pollutes. Also, 11 years from now, you're going to have a bunch of priuses with dead batteries when the warranty runs out. What are they planning to do with all those NI-CD batteries when most car companies will probably use Lithium Ion by then?

I'm surprise Honda pulled out SOHC for 2008 Civics / Fits. At they have a less chance of spewing polution in the long run. It seems as though California Emission Control don't look at the comparision on pollution per gallon of gas because they're probably afraid of what they might find with the Prius.

 

SOHC to DOHC isnt a large change. xD about 15% more fuel injection only at the highest rpm's. Those prius batteries actually recharge to almost a full extent; and NIMH batteries are the successor to Lithium ions(going from NIMH to L-Ion would be backwards) NIMH have no charge points, they never recharge with less power than when originally manufactured
and California did a REDICULOUS amount of studying with the Prius before allowing it the AT-PZEV rating. theres a reason its called practically zero.

if you go on main roads at a steady 40, the engine never engages, and on the highway you can expect ATLEAST 50+ mpg, with a serious lack of emission.
that car is the closest thing to zero emissions until the new Honda FCX Clarity is released this summer in SoCal.

 

1 mile? Why didn't they walk/bike/public transit?!?!

 

I can't seem to find test results of a 50% battery charged prius going 80mph. There's been speculations that the prius only gets 35 mpg @ 80mph, but that's on probably full batteries which is stored by energy from the previous gallon of gasoline. I rarely seen anyone mention battery charge% within the tests.

 

"Honda FCX Clarity" Is this a hybrid?

 

That's kind of like saying "a person who uses his gun to shoot and kill squirrels is a better person than one who uses it to shoot and kill people" - it's entirely obvious and has no point.

 

the reason you cant find it is because the prius doesnt use the battery for power after 40mph. 35 is way under the estimated/proven ammount. you can go to cleanmpg.com to see what most prius owners are getting with or without hypermiling. its rediculous. I also fail to see where a 80mph speed limit would be posted. I've seen 75 on desert stretches but never 80.
the battery charges can be seen on any speculation website, and common knowledge in electronics will show that NiMH are fully rechargeable, though not very eco friendly :33

and the FCX Clarity isnt a hybrid, its the first ZERO emissions vehicle, being produced by Honda this summer, but only for SoCal and only for Lease. It will combine hydrogen and oxygen in a combustion like chamber and emit pure wator vapor. I still dont completely understand it and im sure what I just said was totally off, so go to Honda's website, their upcoming projects are quite nice. especially the rennaisance concept.

ps. atleast they arent releasing the WOW anymore

 

hahaha that is awesome!

for the long commuter, get a motorcycle. you will get 75 miles to the gallon. and the dumb grocery getter housewife should be driving a prius.

think about the food chain. the larger animals die off, and the smaller animals flourish.

 

Ok, I have some experience in the environmental field, so here's what I have to say:

Part of the argument is the idea of stationary energy consumers (buildings) versus mobile energy consumers (vehicles). From an engineering standpoint finding alternative energy is somewhat easier for stationary consumers. Solar energy works well for buildings but is not practical for a car, etc. In other words all the energy required to make the hybrid batteries, etc., would be a moot point if that energy came from eco-friendly sources. So go to that hybrid battery factory and put solar panels on the roof, etc.

Also there's the idea of plug-in hybrids, where you can plug the car into the power outlet at home and "top off" the battery. IIUC, powering up off your local power grid is more eco-friendly than having the gas engine recharge the batt.

 

its a logical idea. here in AZ, theres tons of solar panels. but most people dont see the correlation between, long term pay off and initial cost of panels. its true the prius does use the engine when needing a recharge of battery, but it also uses kinetic energy from motion when in both modes. there are many points of refinement to be had in hybrids now, but I think we are progressing as well as we can.