How about a hybrid Fit to replace that useless Insight? Engineer it to get 10-15 better mpg than the gas powered Fit without compromising acceleration, be sure to supply an MT version, retain the folding/removable seating options, price it under 20K, don't over-style it, and you'll have a market dominator!

 

why would you want a hybrid fit when the fit get good gas mileage already

 

hybrid cars are still too new... what if, if you have problem, you probably have to spend a lot more money to fix it.

 

if hybrid cost more to buy, how long does it take to actually make your money back?? in states, the hybrid cars cost 2 to 4 thousand dollars more to start.

 

They may not offer a manual transimission in the states as they no longer sell one in the Japanese market. The CVT provides better fuel economy and is half the joy of the vehicle. Sooo much better than a normal auto. The electric power steering saves alot of fuel but has a very different feel and can take some getting use to.

The Jazz/Fit has been a winning formula all over the world for years why do they have to completely redesign it for the US? It thumps any competitor in existance in the US market but pricing is going to be the toughest thing for Honda.

 

Both Honda and Toyota say the battery life of the current hybrids is 10 years before the cells will require replacement. This will improve with future generations but for the moment what is the resale going to be like on these cars close to the 10 year mark. The cost differential is only a few thousand in the US because it is subsidised. The real difference is alot more as evidenced by unsubsidised markets.

Take the Hybrid Civic. Its A$30,000 in Australia but the non-hybrid is A$20,000. Its the real affordable hybrid on the market too. The Prius is 2.5 times the price of a normal Corolla. Its not possible to make back the upfront price difference in fuel savings over the life of the car.

 

I hope the U.S. Fit is not redesigned too significantly. After rising U.S. gas prices, I've been looking at small, efficient cars with decent cargo room (I like room for passengers as well as my bicycle!). While it won't be money smart for me to buy right now (my Taurus has but 70,000 miles), I'm certainly going to look at the fit within a year or two. I've seen one concept design and that didn't look good at all.

As long as the fit doesn't change too much within the next two years, has good cargo room and has a very fuel efficient motor (I'd like to get 35+ mpg), you can't positively chalk one up for me.

 

For one reason: Honda intends to sell the Fit as an entry-level car, which rules out the expensive Integrated Motor Assist hybrid drivetrain. Besides, I don't think the Fit's engine bay could accommodate an IMA drivetrain to start with.

I do think we'll see two transmission types on the US-market car, one with a "normal" CVT automatic and one with the CVT-7 automatic. Because initial shipments of the Fit for Americans will come from Japan, we might not see a manual transmission model, either, given that in Japan they don't sell Fits with manuals now....

 

Heh, what the hell was I thinking? That makes no sense! What I meant to say was: "I'll take one!"

 

Don't know about in the engine bay but there is plenty of space under the rear seats for battery cells. Front seats already have the fuel tank under them.

 

how much you think it's going to cost to replace the batt life?? how would you know if the hybrid is not going to have too much of problems in few years?? i still think it's not safe to buy the hybrid car now.

does the hybrid really cost more to make than the regular?? if the gov. wants the car maker to make cars that will not polute the air, they should sell it cheaper, right?

 

Hybrids are subsidised in the US hence why their price is closer to regular cars. They do cost more to make than conventional cars but that might change in the future.

The batteries / cells are going to be quite a few thousand dollars to replace.

Only time will tell how they will last in a few years time as they approach 10 years. Certainly wouldn't want to buy one 2nd hand close to the 10 year mark.

 

I have to disagree about that. The Fit/Jazz's tight design in terms of space utilization means the engine bay cannot accommodate the full IMA hybrid drivetrain found on the 2006 Civic and I don't see space anywhere to accommodate the IMA battery pack without seriously compromising the interior setup functionality of the car, either. If you look at the 2006 Civic Hybrid saloon (neé sedan) you can't fold down the rear seats like you can with the regular four-door saloon.

 

Yeah obviously once you fill all the space with batteries your going to compromise the interior setup. That is the unfortunate nature of trying to put a lot of gear into a little space. As battery technology improves the size of the cells will reduce making it a more viable / practical proposition. Everything is a trade off just like performance vs economy.

I personally wouldn't buy a hybrid Jazz and it would be a hard sell since it couldn't be produced for much less than a hybrid Civic. Without huge subsidies (like you get in the US) the price difference to fuel saving could never be recouped even if fuel prices increased further than even the analyists worst predictions. Approx A$10,000 and A$25,000 respectively for the Civic hybrid and Prius vs their conventional counterparts in Australia is just too big a gulf. There is not even registration and insurance incentives with insurance actually higher than conventional models due to increased purchase price and cost to repair.

One thing the current 'artificial' Oil price rise might provide is an incentive for the acceleration for fuel cell development and deployment since this is the path most nearly all manufacturers see as the medium term future.

 

Actually, what we'll see first are improvements in petrol-fuelled engine technologies. With the majority of the world soon switching to low-sulfur motor fuels, I can soon see petrol engines with direct fuel injection, much higher compression ratios, very high air-to-fuel ratios (40:1 or higher), better spark plug designs and more extensive use of variable-valve timing; such technologies could improve petrol engine fuel economy as much as 35 percent. Can you imagine a future Honda Fit/Jazz with a reasonably powerful (about 110-115 ps) engine that has 30% better fuel economy than the current Fit/Jazz engines? I'll buy such a car in no time flat!

 

Hybrids are not subsidized in the US. Both Honda and Toyota are making a profit on all the hybrids they sell here. There is a $2000 tax deduction for buying a hybrid but that is due to expire at the end of this year. It only means you can remove $2000 from your declared yearly income before taxes. Only adds up to a couple of hundred dollars depending on your tax bracket. Compare that to the $100k tax deduction for purchasing an SUV with a gross weight over 3 tons.
Also in a couple of states like California you can drive your hybrid on the car pool lane alone if you put 4 ugly stickers on your car.
The reason hybrids are so popular in the US is there is no other alternative for a fuel efficient car. The only diesel cars we can buy are a handful of VW TDIs and a couple of Mercedes models. These are not available in California, New York and Massachusetts because they don't meet emissions standards. Combine that with lots of rich ex hippies that want to save the world and you have a ready market for hybrids.

If the Fit 1.3 is brought to this country it will be the smallest displacement engine available any car in the US (not counting Insight hybrid.)

 

Information on US federal subsidy
http://www.hybridcars.com/tax-deductions.html

Also some US companies are offering incentives
http://www.hybridcars.com/corporate-incentives.html

Additional incentives offered state by state in the US
http://www.hybridcars.com/incentives.html

All these incentives though still not brilliant are certainly additonal to the zero encouragement offered here in Australia even internally by Honda Australia and Toyota Australia.

The price differential is also significantly higher in Australia vs US for Hybrid vs Non Hybrid. Honda no longer sells the insight here which was A$45,000 replacing it with the Hybrid Civic at A$30,000. Still a A$10,000 premium over a regular Civic. Toyota offers the Prius starting at over A$45,000. Toyota's supply is very limited so there is absolutely no discounting. To put it into perspective the Prius costs as much as entry level luxury cars for what amounts to a Hybrid Corolla.

A number of Diesels are starting to come onto the market from Europe but the price of Diesel is notibly higher than even Premium Unleaded in Australia. None of these cars are particularly cheap.

Big Aussie cars the Ford Falcon, Holden Commodore, Mitsubishi Magna & Toyota Camry can be converted to LPG (natural gas). In fact all taxies here run LPG. Conversion cost under A$5,000 and LPG is less than half the price of regular unleaded. Milage per litre is less with LPG wher as milage per litre is higher with Diesel. LPG is readily available as the infrustructure has been put in place for taxis.

Fuel Cell trials are being run in Perth, Western Australia but one of the barriers is the need to establish the infrustucture to support such vehicles (refueling) and the commercial availability of such vehicles.

 

The federal tax credit applies only if you purchase a hybrid in the next 15 months. Also it is being phased out to zero over that period. So those numbers only apply to the first month of sales under the new credit.
A few legislators in California and other states are proposing higher registration fees for hybrids than regular cars because they use less fuel and therefore pay disproportionately low fuel tax for the roads. It would never pass but it shows the mentality in this country. When the government wants to promote something in this country they do tax incentives in a big way. The $100000 SUV tax deduction for example was originally written in the 60s to help farmers pay for equipment. There were no SUVs at that time so congress figured 6000lb would make a good cut off point.
http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/Taxes/P48468.asp
The hybrid tax credit is little more than symbolic. Believe me nobody is buying a hybrid because of the incentives in this country. The situation in Australia just sounds even worse.

 

There might be more chance of incentives coming from large corporates than government. Corporates like to be seen as good corporate citizens. Governments just do things to win votes (at the moment there just musn't be enough votes in it).

It still won't help in Australia with the largest employers being government and more people employed by small business than corporations.

Under Australian tax you can right off business / work related travel on a cents per km basis. You get more cents per km for larger capacity engines. So the tax system also encourages larger cars (bigger than 2.6litre) or at the very least greater than 1.6litre.

 

here in cali you can get in the car pool lane solo if you have a hybrid..
with the traffic around here thats a HUGE plus!!