2007 dies when cold
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,371
From: NC USA
Mahout: First, you give a lot of good advice to people here and help many to solve their Fit problems, Thank you for that. Also, I agree 100% on the marketing people getting in the way. In one case a couple of years back Ford wanted their oil supplier to back them on recommending a 25,000 mile oil change interval. The marketing guys thought this would be a big selling point on how good their engines were. The oil company told them they were crazy and would not go along.
Next, many here do not have a deep understanding of some of the fine points of automotive technology that others have spent years learning. So I wanted to point out a few things here so people do not get mislead.
In the Fit manual, the two I have that came with the car, they do not mention a mileage for some services. What they try to do is get people to use the "Maintenance Minder" and follow the letter and numbered symbols as to what service is required. For example, I just did a "B 2" on my '07.
In neither my owner's manual nor my Service History book there anything printed that I can locate that tells the owner to adjust the valves or change the plugs at any certain mileage. In fact, just the opposite. On the each page (at the bottom) of the Service History book it clearly states "Adjust the valves during services A,B,1,2, or 3 only if they are noisy"
The only service that actually calls for plug replacement and valve adjustment is a "4". I am at 87,000 miles and have yet to see a "4" level on the minder. From what I read that number may not show up to around 109,000 miles.
The next thing that got my attention was a reference to valves being noisy being associate with burnt valves. While some may have observed that phenomena the fact is the valves to really worry about are the QUIET one! Valves burn when they can not seat properly. A valve that is "tapping" is seating down against the head. The noise is caused by the excessive gap between the lifter and the camshaft. This reduces power and can even cause wear on the valve stem end or lifter (rocker arm) in some cases. But, the cam is NOT preventing the valve from closing.
The really bad situation is when their is TOO LITTLE gap between the cam and the lifter. In this case the cam and lifter may actually prevent the valve from closing all the way. This is the condition that can result in the valve burning. <Also, as many know, if something like a piece of carbon is stuck between the valve and the seat this can happen also. This is the situation where there will be a larger gap between the cam and the lifter and you will be able to hear a valve tapping noise and have a burnt valve. > Valves need to contact the seat to transfer head they got from the exhaust gases over to the cylinder head. There are only two heat transfer paths for a valve, through the stem up to the guide and from the valve face to the seat. So, when valves are too "tight" (too little clearance) they may not be allowed to fully seat. This results in the face of the valve getting very hot and burning away. The seat will also sometimes burn as the hot gasses leaking past will cut the seat just like a cutting torch cuts steel.
Why does the car stall cold but gets OK when warm? Simple metallurgy. The valves are steel, the head is aluminum. They expand at different rates. When the engine is cold the head is contracted more than the steel valve. The valve may not be able to close fully. This means when cold the combustion gasses leak out resulting in a loss of power on that cylinder. As the head warms up it expands more than the valve and the head actually moves towards the face of the valve allowing it to seat. Now, the miss will suddenly stop. There is still a problem, just the miss that was the symptom the driver noticed most quit. The valve timing is off due to the improper clearances. Engine performance suffers. It is very important that valves be checked, and set if needed, periodically.
My 1999 Accord has never needed a valve setting to be changed. That is highly unusual, I am sure. I checked them periodically to verify this. The problem on my Fit, I am sure, is that they were set wrong from the beginning. This problem is compounded by the fact Honda clearly stated in their manual that owners receive, not to set the valves unless they are noisy until a level 4 service (100,000 miles). This is the issue I took up with Honda.
So, mahout, while you may have a manual somewhere that recommends a 30,000 mile check of the valves, Fit owners do not have privy to that information in the literature that was supplied to them with the vehicle.
My message to fellow Fit owners, and all vehicle owners, is that some vehicles may need certain maintenance sooner than the factory called for in your manual. My other advice given to my many students over the years and based on my professional involvement with the design and building of vehicles is that before you start throwing parts at a car for a performance issue ALWAYS, always make sure all the mechanical systems are working properly. The electronic controls on the engine were programed and tested on dyno and vehicles were the mechanics of the engine were all nominal, that is, perfectly normal. If you have any mechanical system that is not nominal, the computers are at a loss and will make "mistakes". We have a saying, "Garbage in, garbage out". If you give the PCM bad data it will make bad decisions.
I could write a book or two on all the vehicles we have seen over the years where "experienced" techs chased their tails on electronic engine controls only in the end to learn there was some mechanical fault that needed repair. Some common examples were worn cam lobes, non-seating valves, and the weird ones like manifold that were improperly molded and partially restricted inside. I worked in a job where we were involved with the problem vehicles at dealerships. I am talking the cars no one seemed able to fix. There was never a car we didn't get repaired in the end. Along the way you learn a LOT about vehicles and the misinformation techs have about what causes what problem. Many of them don't understand or misunderstand how systems work. So the common practice for some is to throw parts at the vehicle to try to fix it. I can understand their frustration and the position they are in. They get paid to replace parts. If its under warranty they get paid and the customer isn't charged. Due to this all too often parts that are not faulty are replaced when they are not actually causing the problem the owner is experiencing. Working at a car manufacture our studies found the about one third of warranty work involved repairs that did not fix the car. The more telling statistic was that 90% of all the returned "defective" electronic parts had nothing wrong with them.
So, based on many years of dealing with such issues and their solutions I have a perspective that may be different than some. One thing however, my job was to always get to the root of the problem and solve it from there. We needed to know WHY it happened and not just what parts were thrown at it.
So, Fit owners, make sure the mechanicals are perfect before throwing parts at it. And, to mahout, my hats off to you for all your fine work, but sometimes there is another point of view. What you have is not what the typical owner has.
BTW, Honda tells us to "Inspect the idle speed every 160,000 miles". Now, think about this...its computer controlled via an electronic throttle body that you can not adjust. You can clean it....but, the PCM will always attempt to set the idle at the programmed speed. If it can not do this there is an SAE defined trouble code that will set. You PCM is checking your idle speed every time you run the engine, folks.
Next, many here do not have a deep understanding of some of the fine points of automotive technology that others have spent years learning. So I wanted to point out a few things here so people do not get mislead.
In the Fit manual, the two I have that came with the car, they do not mention a mileage for some services. What they try to do is get people to use the "Maintenance Minder" and follow the letter and numbered symbols as to what service is required. For example, I just did a "B 2" on my '07.
In neither my owner's manual nor my Service History book there anything printed that I can locate that tells the owner to adjust the valves or change the plugs at any certain mileage. In fact, just the opposite. On the each page (at the bottom) of the Service History book it clearly states "Adjust the valves during services A,B,1,2, or 3 only if they are noisy"
The only service that actually calls for plug replacement and valve adjustment is a "4". I am at 87,000 miles and have yet to see a "4" level on the minder. From what I read that number may not show up to around 109,000 miles.
The next thing that got my attention was a reference to valves being noisy being associate with burnt valves. While some may have observed that phenomena the fact is the valves to really worry about are the QUIET one! Valves burn when they can not seat properly. A valve that is "tapping" is seating down against the head. The noise is caused by the excessive gap between the lifter and the camshaft. This reduces power and can even cause wear on the valve stem end or lifter (rocker arm) in some cases. But, the cam is NOT preventing the valve from closing.
The really bad situation is when their is TOO LITTLE gap between the cam and the lifter. In this case the cam and lifter may actually prevent the valve from closing all the way. This is the condition that can result in the valve burning. <Also, as many know, if something like a piece of carbon is stuck between the valve and the seat this can happen also. This is the situation where there will be a larger gap between the cam and the lifter and you will be able to hear a valve tapping noise and have a burnt valve. > Valves need to contact the seat to transfer head they got from the exhaust gases over to the cylinder head. There are only two heat transfer paths for a valve, through the stem up to the guide and from the valve face to the seat. So, when valves are too "tight" (too little clearance) they may not be allowed to fully seat. This results in the face of the valve getting very hot and burning away. The seat will also sometimes burn as the hot gasses leaking past will cut the seat just like a cutting torch cuts steel.
Why does the car stall cold but gets OK when warm? Simple metallurgy. The valves are steel, the head is aluminum. They expand at different rates. When the engine is cold the head is contracted more than the steel valve. The valve may not be able to close fully. This means when cold the combustion gasses leak out resulting in a loss of power on that cylinder. As the head warms up it expands more than the valve and the head actually moves towards the face of the valve allowing it to seat. Now, the miss will suddenly stop. There is still a problem, just the miss that was the symptom the driver noticed most quit. The valve timing is off due to the improper clearances. Engine performance suffers. It is very important that valves be checked, and set if needed, periodically.
My 1999 Accord has never needed a valve setting to be changed. That is highly unusual, I am sure. I checked them periodically to verify this. The problem on my Fit, I am sure, is that they were set wrong from the beginning. This problem is compounded by the fact Honda clearly stated in their manual that owners receive, not to set the valves unless they are noisy until a level 4 service (100,000 miles). This is the issue I took up with Honda.
So, mahout, while you may have a manual somewhere that recommends a 30,000 mile check of the valves, Fit owners do not have privy to that information in the literature that was supplied to them with the vehicle.
My message to fellow Fit owners, and all vehicle owners, is that some vehicles may need certain maintenance sooner than the factory called for in your manual. My other advice given to my many students over the years and based on my professional involvement with the design and building of vehicles is that before you start throwing parts at a car for a performance issue ALWAYS, always make sure all the mechanical systems are working properly. The electronic controls on the engine were programed and tested on dyno and vehicles were the mechanics of the engine were all nominal, that is, perfectly normal. If you have any mechanical system that is not nominal, the computers are at a loss and will make "mistakes". We have a saying, "Garbage in, garbage out". If you give the PCM bad data it will make bad decisions.
I could write a book or two on all the vehicles we have seen over the years where "experienced" techs chased their tails on electronic engine controls only in the end to learn there was some mechanical fault that needed repair. Some common examples were worn cam lobes, non-seating valves, and the weird ones like manifold that were improperly molded and partially restricted inside. I worked in a job where we were involved with the problem vehicles at dealerships. I am talking the cars no one seemed able to fix. There was never a car we didn't get repaired in the end. Along the way you learn a LOT about vehicles and the misinformation techs have about what causes what problem. Many of them don't understand or misunderstand how systems work. So the common practice for some is to throw parts at the vehicle to try to fix it. I can understand their frustration and the position they are in. They get paid to replace parts. If its under warranty they get paid and the customer isn't charged. Due to this all too often parts that are not faulty are replaced when they are not actually causing the problem the owner is experiencing. Working at a car manufacture our studies found the about one third of warranty work involved repairs that did not fix the car. The more telling statistic was that 90% of all the returned "defective" electronic parts had nothing wrong with them.
So, based on many years of dealing with such issues and their solutions I have a perspective that may be different than some. One thing however, my job was to always get to the root of the problem and solve it from there. We needed to know WHY it happened and not just what parts were thrown at it.
So, Fit owners, make sure the mechanicals are perfect before throwing parts at it. And, to mahout, my hats off to you for all your fine work, but sometimes there is another point of view. What you have is not what the typical owner has.
BTW, Honda tells us to "Inspect the idle speed every 160,000 miles". Now, think about this...its computer controlled via an electronic throttle body that you can not adjust. You can clean it....but, the PCM will always attempt to set the idle at the programmed speed. If it can not do this there is an SAE defined trouble code that will set. You PCM is checking your idle speed every time you run the engine, folks.
Outstanding post. Especially the comment about too little valve gap clearance. That involves no tapping yet will be the first way valves get burned. And get very expensive to replace.
And yes, the manual I refered to is a directive from Honda to Honda dealerships shop managers. No, I won't share it with you to protect the guilty and the innocent, but as you pointed out good maintenance is not often following marketing.
As you indicate the first job after taking ownership of your Fit is to find a good service point, either dealer or independent.
Like the old oil filter commercial says:
Pay a little often, or a whole lot later.
Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 47
From: Cincinnati, OH
mahout: You put a lot of great info out there to help a lot of people. Your vast experience shows. I know from seeing all your posts you give freely of a lot of your time.Lots of folks owe you for your generosity.
I was a technical guy for a few "large" car manufactures and had to deal with a lot of problems. I also spent several years as a technical adviser to a state Lemon Law program. I got to see a lot of cars that had some way out problems. So, I see car problems from both sides and feel for both the manufactures and the customers.
You mentioned something about having info that consumers don't. Its a shame that the car makers aren't more honest in what really needs to be done. Its hard to find clear references to things like that. If you dig deep enough you can find the info somewhere, but you really have to look hard and many times it will NOT be in the owners manual. Again, the marketing people don't want customers to get scared away by figuring out how much it will cost to properly maintain their vehicle.
I just sold my 2001 Xterra with 127,000 miles. The buyer stated: "To get a vehicle in better shape than this one we would have to go buy a new vehicle". The vehicle was maintained far better than called for in the manual. It looks like new, runs like new and has never had a serious mechanical problem. (Less than $100 spent on repairs in eleven years). The key to its longevity is simple: Service it regularly! Our 1999 Accord was the same. At 200,000 miles its still purring along. It has original brake rotors and hydrolic parts. The most serious repair ever done to it was to replace the valve cover gasket. How is that possible? Change the brake fluid every couple of years. Change the pads BEFORE they wear all the way out. The radiator is like new inside: Flush and fill with new coolant every two to three years. Heck, its got the original hoses on it! Again, flush the fluid and don't let the engine leak oil on them. Replace the timing belt when called for. All just normal stuff.
In my work we did a lot of studies. Using several brands of autos and real world data we analyzed the common failures over 120,000 miles from lack of maintenance compared to the cost of doing the actual required maintenance. (not the skimpy version in the owner's manual). In every vehicle we did the numbers on the results came out the same. It is FAR less expensive to do the service.
Like you said, "you can pay me now or you can pay me later". <I think all of us in the service industry know and support that one> OH, the "later", its going to cost a lot more.
Keep up the good work and maybe we can help save some of these fine folks some headaches and wallet "hits".
I was a technical guy for a few "large" car manufactures and had to deal with a lot of problems. I also spent several years as a technical adviser to a state Lemon Law program. I got to see a lot of cars that had some way out problems. So, I see car problems from both sides and feel for both the manufactures and the customers.
You mentioned something about having info that consumers don't. Its a shame that the car makers aren't more honest in what really needs to be done. Its hard to find clear references to things like that. If you dig deep enough you can find the info somewhere, but you really have to look hard and many times it will NOT be in the owners manual. Again, the marketing people don't want customers to get scared away by figuring out how much it will cost to properly maintain their vehicle.
I just sold my 2001 Xterra with 127,000 miles. The buyer stated: "To get a vehicle in better shape than this one we would have to go buy a new vehicle". The vehicle was maintained far better than called for in the manual. It looks like new, runs like new and has never had a serious mechanical problem. (Less than $100 spent on repairs in eleven years). The key to its longevity is simple: Service it regularly! Our 1999 Accord was the same. At 200,000 miles its still purring along. It has original brake rotors and hydrolic parts. The most serious repair ever done to it was to replace the valve cover gasket. How is that possible? Change the brake fluid every couple of years. Change the pads BEFORE they wear all the way out. The radiator is like new inside: Flush and fill with new coolant every two to three years. Heck, its got the original hoses on it! Again, flush the fluid and don't let the engine leak oil on them. Replace the timing belt when called for. All just normal stuff.
In my work we did a lot of studies. Using several brands of autos and real world data we analyzed the common failures over 120,000 miles from lack of maintenance compared to the cost of doing the actual required maintenance. (not the skimpy version in the owner's manual). In every vehicle we did the numbers on the results came out the same. It is FAR less expensive to do the service.
Like you said, "you can pay me now or you can pay me later". <I think all of us in the service industry know and support that one> OH, the "later", its going to cost a lot more.
Keep up the good work and maybe we can help save some of these fine folks some headaches and wallet "hits".
Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
From: Los Angels
valve adjustment-worth it big time
My fit with 104,000 started to give me a bit of trouble, stunmbling, sometimes to a stall on cold first starts. No CE light. Had read a lot about this on this forum and decided to bite the bullet and pay for the valve adjustments. During the process the tech came outow far off and ask me look at how far off, (3/intakes and 3/exhaust) they valves were by demonstrating the space with a feeler gauge. Something to said for hydraulic valves, which we don't have.
Car runs fantastic, I will do it again at another 50K
Car runs fantastic, I will do it again at another 50K
Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 47
From: Cincinnati, OH
My fit with 104,000 started to give me a bit of trouble, stunmbling, sometimes to a stall on cold first starts. No CE light. Had read a lot about this on this forum and decided to bite the bullet and pay for the valve adjustments. During the process the tech came outow far off and ask me look at how far off, (3/intakes and 3/exhaust) they valves were by demonstrating the space with a feeler gauge. Something to said for hydraulic valves, which we don't have.
Car runs fantastic, I will do it again at another 50K
Car runs fantastic, I will do it again at another 50K
I agree with those who say to check the valves more often, even if it seems to be running OK. Even on a car without the stalling problem the valves can be off and causing performance degradation. It happens slowly and the owner just gets use to it. It doesn't get our attention until its so bad there is an obvious problem like the stalling. Trust me on this, ask anyone who has had this problem, after adjusting the valves the car really runs much better. Wish I had done mine sooner. Looking back I would bet they were off when that engine left the plant. At 87,000 miles my Fit runs better than it ever has. Maybe it just took that long for the engine to break in.
I have 42000 miles on mine right now and can hear a couple of loose intake valves when the engine is cold with a stethoscope... I feel like I should kick myself in the butt for not having adjusted them yet because if the intake valves are loose the exhaust valves are sure to be overly tight.. Since I cannot hear any clicking on the exhaust side of the cam I'm going to have to get that done soon or burn a valve.
Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 47
From: Cincinnati, OH
I have 42000 miles on mine right now and can hear a couple of loose intake valves when the engine is cold with a stethoscope... I feel like I should kick myself in the butt for not having adjusted them yet because if the intake valves are loose the exhaust valves are sure to be overly tight.. Since I cannot hear any clicking on the exhaust side of the cam I'm going to have to get that done soon or burn a valve.
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,371
From: NC USA
Intake at 100F max, 55F min: 006 to .008 inches
Exhaust .010 to .012 inches
When engine is cold you may hear valve tap but it doesn't mean the clearance is bad. Measure.
New Member
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 5
From: Sonoma County, CA
Took a while to read all of this but thank all of you that worked hard on this. I have a 2007 fit with 102k miles on it, and around 90k it started to stall when cold. I always warm my car up (wait till the cold light turns off) just as a habit from previous cars, so I don't experience it all the time. Some times my wife is in a hurry and makes us leave before the car is warm, and while it doesn't happen all the time, once is too many for me. My mileage has gone down a little bit (used to get 35-37, now I am getting 32-34) but I was contributing that to being stuck in traffic more.
I also noticed that my cars engine has been getting a little louder recently, at lower RPM's and is the loudest when I am starting from a stop. At first I thought I was burning oil, or losing it some how, but I am always at the recommended level. So from what I read, the noise and stalling are related or could be related?
So what is the best plan of action that I should follow? Do I just go to Honda and ask for a "valve adjustment" ? I bought the car used at 81k little over a year ago, so I am not sure when or if the valves have been adjusted. Thanks in advanced for any help!
I also noticed that my cars engine has been getting a little louder recently, at lower RPM's and is the loudest when I am starting from a stop. At first I thought I was burning oil, or losing it some how, but I am always at the recommended level. So from what I read, the noise and stalling are related or could be related?
So what is the best plan of action that I should follow? Do I just go to Honda and ask for a "valve adjustment" ? I bought the car used at 81k little over a year ago, so I am not sure when or if the valves have been adjusted. Thanks in advanced for any help!
New Member
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1
From: Lake Zurich, IL
Thanks Everyone!
Thanks to all you guys for posting about this!
My 07 Fit, 66k on it, was idling so rough (when cold) that it would occasionally stall.
I called every dealership in the area, was quoted as high as $490, but then found one that did it for $130.
After the car sat overnight, cold engine this morning, no problems!
My 07 Fit, 66k on it, was idling so rough (when cold) that it would occasionally stall.
I called every dealership in the area, was quoted as high as $490, but then found one that did it for $130.
After the car sat overnight, cold engine this morning, no problems!
New Member
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1
Fantastic thread.
Well described problem, well-explained solution, and follow-up posts from people for whom the solution worked.
Add one more to that list. My '07 Fit started doing the same thing long ago, and we've just worked around it for 2 or 3 or 4 years now. It's been so long, I can't remember when it started. Finally, while doing some of the maintenance things that fall around our 118k mileage, I decided to search for this problem, and found this thread. The shop that did my brake/coolant/AT flush this week had said that checking the valves probably wasn't worth the trouble, but after finding this thread, I had my dealer do it yesterday for $126.
Started it this morning and immediately backed right out of the driveway. No stall, no balk, no shudder... perfect. The mechanic said the exhaust valves clearances were half what they should be. Can't wait to see if the mileage goes up too, but I'm doing the spark plugs today, so I won't know for sure what to credit any improvement to. Doesn't matter though... I'm sure both will help.
So thank you all for starting this thread, and following through. I'll remember to come straight here with my next issue!
Well described problem, well-explained solution, and follow-up posts from people for whom the solution worked.
Add one more to that list. My '07 Fit started doing the same thing long ago, and we've just worked around it for 2 or 3 or 4 years now. It's been so long, I can't remember when it started. Finally, while doing some of the maintenance things that fall around our 118k mileage, I decided to search for this problem, and found this thread. The shop that did my brake/coolant/AT flush this week had said that checking the valves probably wasn't worth the trouble, but after finding this thread, I had my dealer do it yesterday for $126.
Started it this morning and immediately backed right out of the driveway. No stall, no balk, no shudder... perfect.
The mechanic said the exhaust valves clearances were half what they should be. Can't wait to see if the mileage goes up too, but I'm doing the spark plugs today, so I won't know for sure what to credit any improvement to. Doesn't matter though... I'm sure both will help.So thank you all for starting this thread, and following through. I'll remember to come straight here with my next issue!
New Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 9
From: Long Beach, CA
I too am very grateful for this thread! I have a 2008 Fit Sport MT with the same problem! I JUST got this car and I cannot believe that the previous owners/dealer I purchased from never bothered to look into this issue.
Anyway, I was in a hurry to get to class after work today and had to run the engine cold - Every time I pushed in the clutch and went into neutral, the car would die. This happened as I was exiting the freeway! Not ok! I have contacted the dealer to see if I can get this service done for free under my warranty because I should not have to pay for this!
Once the car is warm, the car idles a bit rough, but the problem is essentially gone. I'm hoping I can get those valves adjusted and solve the problem.
Otherwise, I am in love with my little Fit
Thanks again for the informative posts everyone! I hope the mechanics don't try to pull a fast one on me just because I'm a girl
Anyway, I was in a hurry to get to class after work today and had to run the engine cold - Every time I pushed in the clutch and went into neutral, the car would die. This happened as I was exiting the freeway! Not ok! I have contacted the dealer to see if I can get this service done for free under my warranty because I should not have to pay for this!
Once the car is warm, the car idles a bit rough, but the problem is essentially gone. I'm hoping I can get those valves adjusted and solve the problem.
Otherwise, I am in love with my little Fit
Thanks again for the informative posts everyone! I hope the mechanics don't try to pull a fast one on me just because I'm a girl
I adjusted the valves a few months ago but have other things that need to be done so I haven't driven it in awhile.. Even though there are twice as many valves per cylinder as any other 4 banger I've adjusted valves on, it was very easy to do... Back when I was first started wrenching for a living the hourly flat rate for labor was $10... I would have charged less than $20 for the labor to do job back then.. The minimum wage was $2.00 an hour at the time.
New Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 9
From: Long Beach, CA
Hi guys,
Another question - I haven't heard back from the dealer yet, but if I do and he agrees to work on the car, it won't be for a couple of weeks, because I'm at school and he's in my hometown.
Forgive me for my lack of car knowledge, but are there any consequences for continuing to drive the car with this idle problem? I won't be driving much, just to work and back - and I figure if I let the car warm up first, it won't be so bad. I just don't want to cause any worse problems!
Thanks again!
Another question - I haven't heard back from the dealer yet, but if I do and he agrees to work on the car, it won't be for a couple of weeks, because I'm at school and he's in my hometown.
Forgive me for my lack of car knowledge, but are there any consequences for continuing to drive the car with this idle problem? I won't be driving much, just to work and back - and I figure if I let the car warm up first, it won't be so bad. I just don't want to cause any worse problems!
Thanks again!
You could end up spending a lot more for a complete valve job if you let it go too long without having the valves adjusted.. The exhaust valves will in time not be able to close tightly enough and leak hot gases out on the power stroke eroding the valve seats and causing the valves to burn and melt... The loose intake valves stems and the rocker arm will eventually hammer the stem until it is mushroomed and there is a groove in the face of the part of the rocker arm that pushes the valve stem to open the valve, creating a situation where the can't be properly set to the correct clearance... You might see if you can find an independent garage or repair shop to do the job for you.. They don't have the operating overhead and will usually do the job for less... There was a lady posting here awhile back that adjusted her own with help from a male friend that instructed her on how the procedure is done... There is surely a nice you know that would love to help a lady in distress.. I see you are in Long Beach so maybe not.. Joking!! As flat as it is there you should be okay for awhile if you accelerate gently and are light on the throttle pedal.
Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 311
From: Minneapolis, Minnesota
This thread reminded me that I'm due for an adjustment and therefore have a question. For my last two adjustments I removed the entire manifold and didn't replace the metal gasket. Can I get away with just removing the plastic portion in order to gain access and reuse the rubber o rings?
Member
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 62
From: USA
I'm at 63k miles and my car has been stalling cold for a few months now. I'm glad I read this as I might have just kept going until it got worse and then burned a valve (I'm hoping that hasn't happened yet..).
My local dealer is unfortunately charging me $300, which sounds high compared to what others are paying here. I'm told it's at least a 2 hour job.
My local dealer is unfortunately charging me $300, which sounds high compared to what others are paying here. I'm told it's at least a 2 hour job.
New Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 9
From: Long Beach, CA
OMG 
So, I've arranged for the dealer to take a look at my car, but he's getting it a day later than he anticipated, and now he is trying to make me feel guilty that his service guys have to take time out of their day off AFTER Thanksgiving is over.
I told him that they wouldn't have needed to do that at all if they had just taken care of the issue before they sold the car to my not-so-car-savvy mom
I'm beginning to think the arguing isn't worth the trouble though. Should I just take the car in somewhere and send them the bill? haha
Just wanted to share my experience with you guys - what a pain.
So, I've arranged for the dealer to take a look at my car, but he's getting it a day later than he anticipated, and now he is trying to make me feel guilty that his service guys have to take time out of their day off AFTER Thanksgiving is over.
I told him that they wouldn't have needed to do that at all if they had just taken care of the issue before they sold the car to my not-so-car-savvy mom
I'm beginning to think the arguing isn't worth the trouble though. Should I just take the car in somewhere and send them the bill?
hahaJust wanted to share my experience with you guys - what a pain.