I see your using The EA011 oil filter, The fit is supposed to take the EA013 filter, what is the difference?

 

Just the 1. It was a typo, it is the 13, and has been corrected.

 

Not all Honda filters are junk. Honda has at two oil filter suppliers in NA for the Fit. One is Fram and the other is Filtec.

Filtech

Filtecs are hard to get unless you know the Honda parts number.

 

Do we know that number for the FIT?

 

I found these links that help with the theory of filtering and synthetics.


Aviation Oil Facts

Myth #1

 

I believe the part number is 15400-PLM-A01. It comes up as a Filtech filter at the two Honda parts sites I checked.

I found this oil filter survey with some interesting results... their opinion was that the Filtech filter was the best: Comprehensive Oil Filter Survey - Honda Element Owners Club Forum

 

Has anyone tried using a filter for an S2000?

 

I found a good oil filter Baldwin Filters | Lube Filters Go to online training for good info.

 

[quote=nikita;884306]mahout,

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How long ago was that jelled-up oil found, do you have any idea what type/grade it was and how long it was really in there? 20 or more years ago 5W-30 and 10W-40, made with napthenics could produce "black death" sludge. I also suspect there were, and are today, a few that never change the oil, but just add as necessary.

Even today, napthene based crude is not a favorite of formulators due to the branching and shorter chain lengths not being as good lubricant and because they are more susceptible to breakdown under heat and corrosive acids that naturally show up.
Jelly oil occurred several times from many years ago to last year. One of the 'tricks' used by used car trade-in appraisers is to remove the oil cap and run a finger around the upper side of the valve cover around the cap. If the finger came back with a sticky jelly-like sustance that was always a cause for reducing the value by a thousand dollars or more regardless of how nice otherwise.
And no analyses were done. The purpose was served in finding out the maintenance followed and hence our risk on reselling the car. Likewise mods as well such as fender-rolling, bulging, dropped, etc.

 

How do you know that filter is good?
1. Pass upper pressure limits of minimum 150 psig for five minutes without bursting or leaking? And pressure drop over 100 hours less than 4 psig (see terst 3).
2. Pass filtration tests at 5 gallons per minute at 80 psig for particulate contents of up to 3% for over 20 micron ?
3. Pass test 2 for a period not less than 100 hours? Thats with fresh mix containg 3% particulate, only .1% less than 20 micron.
4. Pass the test in 3 for harm to filter material, seals, etc

There's a lot more to evaluating filters than looking at it or being low cost.
And yes, prices of filters are related to their sales. higher priced ones are nearly always low volume sellers and sometimes not very good either Thats why its best to stay with those sellers who sell a lot.
As for honda changing from Filtec to Fram undoubtably cost was involved but my bet is both passed those mentioned tests equally well.

 

So, if you have a micron rating of 15, is that better than a micron rating of 21,or 23 ?

 

You do realize your source for filtering theory advocates never changing the oil ("it doesn't degrade") and using toilet paper for filters, don't you?

 

Interesting, there are no oil minder lights on the JDM model and recommended oil change is every 5000km (3100miles) in severe conditions and 10000km routine, which traffic in and around Tokyo is on the severe side with the bumper to bumper daily grind.

This was a quote from 555SEXYDRIVE on the oil analysis thread.

 

Yes, it does. It is considered the diameter of the largest particle can pass thru the filter media with a 90 % probablity that 90 % of those size particles will be captured when the pressure drop across the filter has increased 10% greater than the newly installed filter.
Not every one uses the exact samespecs but the variation won't be great. And in most cases the limits apply to what is considered the 'end life' of the filter; a point which the pressure drop increases significantly, indicating the filtered contaminants are approaching the maximum the filter can hold. In a great many cases thats well before the filter has seen 7500 miles. Thats why we recommend 3000 miles for good conventional hydrocarbon oils and 6000 for good synthertics between oil changes.
Some years back CR did a well performed test where they found most oil filters loaded up before the manufacturers schedule and it got a lot of flak. thats particularly true in our expeience where the smaller the filter the more often it should be changed. We are adamant that Fram's 6607, a popular size and very good filter, be changed with oil changes at 5000 miles. It may be good to get oil pressure quickly but precious little room to storte filtered contaminants. can't prove it but suspect that filter goes bypass very quickly after 5000 miles based on pressure drop readings.
One other point: not all contaminants are filterable, especially those acis that contaminate the oil and attack gaskets, seals, and metal engine parts. They need to be flushed out with the 'dirty' oil. They just keep building up in the engine til flushed.

 

Way back when we had a customer who insisted on toilet paper filters. Actually did filter pretty well but had too high a pressure drop then.
PS oil does degradeand just adding fresh oil doesn't make the liquid, non-filterable, contaminants like acids, go away, means they etc just eat your engine away.

 

Keep in mind that Honda A1 oil change is oil only. That is because there filters are full flow that filter 30 microns at 98 percent, as the oil filter gets filled it filters down to lower numbers. There is less sulpher in gas so there is less acid in the oil. I just was putting info out there so you can be better informed. The only way to be sure of the oil is to have it analyzed and the cost is about the same as too changing it. A good bypass filter will extend oil changes and the Frantz filter has been around for a while. The aviation oil thing is to explain the differences between oils, Also noted is that synthetics get just as dirty as regular oil and uses the additives just as fast unless you have a bypass filter to get the water,and 1-5 mircon dirt out before they grow and use up all the additives.

Ive seen that black sludge jelly and I relate that to using regular and leave the oil in to long. There is a new problem with gas coming soon with white sludge with ethanol going to 15-20 percent, that is why there are coming out with gf5 oils to solve that problem.

I dont think personal put downs advance the learning that this debate is for.

 

[quote=SilverBullet;885666]Keep in mind that Honda A1 oil change is oil only. That is because there filters are full flow that filter 30 microns at 98 percent, as the oil filter gets filled it filters down to lower numbers. There is less sulpher in gas so there is less acid in the oil. I just was putting info out there so you can be better informed. The only way to be sure of the oil is to have it analyzed and the cost is about the same as too changing it. A good bypass filter will extend oil changes and the Frantz filter has been around for a while. The aviation oil thing is to explain the differences between oils, Also noted is that synthetics get just as dirty as regular oil and uses the additives just as fast unless you have a bypass filter to get the water,and 1-5 mircon dirt out before they grow and use up all the additives.

Ive seen that black sludge jelly and I relate that to using regular and leave the oil in to long. There is a new problem with gas coming soon with white sludge with ethanol going to 15-20 percent, that is why there are coming out with gf5 oils to solve that problem.

I dont think personal put downs advance the learning that this debate is for.[/quote

A1 is oil only ? Not here.

Synthetics pick up contaminants just as quickly but viscosity change is far less hence lubrication is better for longer. The additives, such as antioxidants 'wear' out the same in an equalk service.

Bypass filter to get water? No filter I know of filters oil and not water unless an absorber is incorporated which then is not filtering.

Filters go on bypass because the pressure drop across the filter is too high to let enough oil pass to lubricate the engine.

More ethanol in gasoline is a really bad move not just because ethanol may introduce different contaminants into oil. More a problem is the reduction in energy of gasoline which will drop mpg by at least 8%. And worse, may cars have gaskets that are attacked by ethanol.
I doubt seriously that even our dumb politicians would make that manatory. It is a loser economically.

 

A1 service is oil change only according to Honda.

You're right on the by-pass. Never understood why you would want to have that happen. It's like no filter at all. One would need to put a huge amount of miles on a FIT oil filter to trip the by-pass.

Our politicians in US Congress are the ones who would certainly love to have corn in our fuel - don't think they're about to put the environment or our concerns before their profit, seriously. They made it mandatory all ready at 10% to get every one up to 'speed'.

Ethanol is the worst choice from an environmental/energy stand point.

 

Mahout, Thanks for clarifying that for me, The Beta ratings are what confused me,, That is what the Mann ML1008 filters have, just as good as the Amsoil Ea103 which they don't make anymore. I know what I will be buying from now on. As for the acid build up, I use Amsoil with a tbn of 12, and change it out around 6000 miles or 6 months which ever comes first.

 

Its not the crude anymore, and thats the great thing about modern refining. No one can use napthenics in ILSAC/API motor oil because of the reasons you stated. Even Group I solvent dewaxed paraffincs wont meet the standards for multigrades. All modern multigrades, which is all you should use in a modern engine, is, at a minimum, all hydroprocessed paraffinic. That gets rid of the aromatics, sulfur, nitrogen and waxes. The result is a naturally high Viscosity Index, requiring less improver, low volatility and high oxidation resistance.

I havent seen one of those toilet paper filters in decades. A guy at the swap meet used to sell them. I always worried that because TP is supposed to come apart in water, that combustion byproducts would break it down and paper fibers would end up circulating in the bearings.