I was reading the new thread about " Mileage-Real Life Regular vs. Premium".
Krimson Cardnal, Texas Cyote, Silver Bullet and others brought up The Special Interest Goups that are in controll of Our Nation. They are not about strengthing Our Nation just making Money...
How can We The People let "the goverment" break the county's finacial back with giving money away without jobs being created? Do you agree that the interstructer of the the country needs work , a lot of work. So why are we as the people letting this happen? In the Great Depression of the 20's and 30's The New Deal put us back in paychecks and developed the interstructer of the Nation. Giving a person money for no work over time will depress the person and nation.
Prices are UP and pay if you have a job stays the same.
I am just a simple family man, blue collar worker and wonder where are we headed?

 

Where are we headed? To a special interests groups controlled world... in essence, the same as today.

You think "we, the people" really have much say in it? I refer you to how Bush won two consecutive terms. BOTH times he called for a re-vote in states he lost, which "magically" turned to his favor. Look at the recent past presidents... have ANY of them been a blue collar worker that won the presidency without being some multi-millionaire?

There's no way to really effect the government. That, even if you have a president that wants to do right by the people, he has to fight congress tooth and nail for everything. And all you need is a few people in congress to corrupt anything.

A simple bill to restore money to Social Security suddenly gets little unrelated things tacked on and then on top of it all, you get people "skimming" a little here and there "for their trouble." You end up needing so-so billion dollars to effect just the few millions you need.

We are a capitalistic nation... and unfortunately, so are members of the government (read: too many are greedy little bastards), even though they shouldn't be.

 

The problem is that the president set up czars that dont answer to congress. We have no control any more. Just hope for the best.

 

This is great! more, thoughts from FF's
I feel we have given up on our country and the principle of the vote. One vote will not change the situation the country is in but 169 million will.

Answers.com
169 million registered - 86 million democrat - 55 million republican - 28 million others registered.


what percentage of these actually voted in 2008 presidential election?

During the 2008 presidential election, there were 132,645,504 total voters out of an eligible voting age population of 212,702,354, which gives you a 62.4% participation rate.

 

Well don't really quote those figures to heart, especially with the scandal of having voters registered in multiple states in the mid-west region by that group, ohhh what was their name...ACORN.

Our, well I don't even know if we can say our anymore since the US is so far from what the US was, country is in a complete mess. I'm just waiting for the day when my taxes are at 60% of my income to pay for all the special programs of keeping people down. Slavery, it is alive and well and it is called GOVERNMENT HANDOUTS. Think about it, I mean really think about it and maybe you can grasp at what I am saying. All the handouts do are buying votes and keeping people under control, hence a form of slavery in my opinion.

Both parties need to be blown up, Republicans are not the Republicans that this once great nation had in office. Democrats, they say they are not socialists, but everything they have been doing since the swearing in of Obama and the rise of Pelosi to the head of Congress screams "GET ON LINE FOR BREAD". Yet you don't see any of these people living a suffered life like the good many that are in the US. I really want to ask Californians that supported and voted in Pelosi, WHAT THE HELL WERE THEY THINKING?

I'm not going to go on any further, this is one reason why I live outside the US, because it is a real toilet right now and I don't feel like wearing a Ty-D-Bowl outfit everyday to wade through the shit.

 

The country is changing and not everyone is happy with it. Blue Collar is becoming a thing of the past as we become less and less of a manufacturing nation and more of a service nation. Companies cannot afford to pay wages that are being "demanded" by the insanely low prices we are paying. We either have to move many of our blue collar manufacturing workers to be more "white collar" employees with higher levels of knowledge or we have to lower wages. This new class of employment would have to have the ability to provide the services that are necessary.

As we consume more and more, we want prices to go down so we can consume more, but yet we want these products made in the USA by American workers. We want companies to pay great salaries to these American workers but produce products at an ever shrinking price. This is just not possible and the end result is companies like Wal-mart that profit from this unrest.

My Evil-Mart thoughts: Walmart essentially tout's itself as the all American business because prices are so low that any American can benefit from shopping there. What they don't advertise is the fact that you cant find practically any products that are made in the USA by American Workers. It's gotten so bad and walmart has gotten so big that they have actually used this leverage to force other manufacturers to move their production overseas in order to produce lower priced products so that we as Americans can consume more. Wal-mart also has a nasty habbit of supporting themsleves by lowering the standard of living where they move into; for example, mansfield PA, where I went to college both PRE & Post Walmart - the local jobs paid about $7-$8/hour. Walmart moved in and while it created "hundreds" of new jobs, it also put Hundreds of employees at these other small businesses out of business. wal-mart then hired them (out of the goodness of their hearts) and paid them $6.50/hour. This lowered the average family salary by $2k-$3k per year... forcing people (it's own employees) to shop at walmart.

It's cyclical and until someone breaks the cycle (makes manufacturing more expensive ouside of the US) or we as an american Public decide that we don't want to consume as much but want the products we do purchase to be made in the US, it's not going to change.

Personally, we don't shop at walmart and haven't for more than 7 years. we also buy local and shop when possible at our local Co-Op. Most importantly, my wife and I do without; we try not to be the huge consumers that we could be if we purchased everything we wanted.

~SB

 

specboy- you hit the nail on the head. It is very popular & much easier to blame the politicians--we all need to look more closely at our own role in our crazed materialistic society.
For example- just look at this forum--all the money spent on cars, parts accessories. An expensive hobby. People no longer have just one car, they have one for every mood. I am part of this, too. I bought a new Fit before I ran my 1995 Subaru into the ground. Granted this is my first new car since 1972, but hopefully I will keep it at least 15 year before getting another.

I remember the day when a family car purchase was a really big event and you made that car last for 15 years or longer. Also our values about family homes have changed. The majority want bigger homes & are always wanting to "upscale". Tastes have gotten more sophisticated--everyone wants their own little villa with granite & marble. Places like Home Depot have made many a local hardware store history.

Technology has had both negative & positive effects & that is a whole other topic fro discussion.

I do not undersatnd the Walmart mentality--if you really look at their prices they are literally only pennies less than other stores--yet the mindset is everything is a great bargain there. We have a small semi- organic grocery chain which consistently has better prices than Walmart for groceries.
We want things dirt cheap, yet we want that "made in the USA label".

I admire those who can truly simplify their lives and be less dependent on society in every way. We are all to blame. The self-sufficiency movement is a start and the buy local is a path in the right direction.

 

Thanks for your input 555 this what this post is here for , to hear what the people are thinking.
Thanks again,
Mike

 

The country is changing and not everyone is happy with it. Blue Collar is becoming a thing of the past as we become less and less of a manufacturing nation and more of a service nation. Companies cannot afford to pay wages that are being "demanded" by the insanely low prices we are paying. We either have to move many of our blue collar manufacturing workers to be more "white collar" employees with higher levels of knowledge or we have to lower wages. This new class of employment would have to have the ability to provide the services that are necessary.

Thanks Specboy,
good insight


I do not undersatnd the Walmart mentality--if you really look at their prices they are literally only pennies less than other stores--yet the mindset is everything is a great bargain there. We have a small semi- organic grocery chain which consistently has better prices than Walmart for groceries.
We want things dirt cheap, yet we want that "made in the USA label".

I admire those who can truly simplify their lives and be less dependent on society in every way. We are all to blame. The self-sufficiency movement is a start and the buy local is a path in the right direction.
__________________
Thanks Susan
bigger and more is not healthy,
Mike

More input FF's voice your thoughts here ....

 

What about the paradox of frugality?

 

Well, if you like the direction the country is going in, vote for the current party that's been in charge of Congress for 4 years now, the Democrats. If not, look for other candidates who truly believe in what made this country great, not in the last 8 years, but before we became an entitlement society, back when everyone pulled his or her own weight and working for our own future was our duty and our joy. I think we are standing on a very sharp divide of what we want and don't want as a nation - no matter what party you affiliate yourself with, you have to admit that having a president who goes around apologizing to the rest of the world for US is pretty damn shocking. No matter what shit-hole of a country you look at, the president stands up for the country and tells the people how great they are, but not in this case. The best education given to someone who ought to be grateful and we get spit upon and our allies get offended?

The main duty all of us have is to study our Constitution, to realize how far from the intentions of the Founders we've strayed, and recognize our DUTY to vote, and not for "hope and change" but for real principles. THINK and reason before you pull that lever (or turn that dial, nowdays) and for God's sake, decide what you hold dear before you invest in someone with a shady background and no real experience.

And please REJECT the idea that we are a nation so divided! That is the press telling you what THEY believe. Do you really think about skin color on a daily basis? I know I do not, and my kids even less so. That is a world that is so OVER we all need to just leave it in the history books and lock arms to go forward. There is not one party that's any skin color, there are liberals and conservatives of all shades of skin, pick your position and let's get on with it.

p.s. Sam Walton was a true American genius but by the time his kids got ahold of his legacy, it all changed. Greed changed his vision in less than a generation. He really did try to stock Made in America goods but the next generation was all about Made in China, etc. Don't attack corporations, they are not evil by design. Capitalism is 150% better than anything else, especially communism.

 

A point little known to many, thank you for remembering.

More to follow - right now it's Labor Day weekend..

 

Sam Walton was a true American genius but by the time his kids got ahold of his legacy, it all changed. Greed changed his vision in less than a generation. He really did try to stock Made in America goods but the next generation was all about Made in China, etc. Don't attack corporations, they are not evil by design. Capitalism is 150% better than anything else, especially communism.[/QUOTE]

I agree with most of it but feel corporation have to much power. Its the new world order. Corporations are the new religion. They took God out and our money went to corporate big shots which control you lively hood. I hope people realize they dont need what there selling and return back to God.

 

Want to know where we're headed? Google- "The Long Emergency" . I just finished reading this book and it's a real eye opener. I felt proud (and responsible) to own a Fit. To some it may seem 'off topic' (it's about the worlds peak oil production) but if you think about it the GLOBAL economy is dependant on CHEAP OIL. Our economy is now tied directly to politics, STIMULUS BILL anyone? (to the tune of an additional 780 million +/- of national debt that our elected officials voted for). If most people knew the truth about alternative energies they would crap! Such as bio-fuels, pure BS, low energy return for energy invested. Unfortunately, the future of politics for us and every nation will be shaped by our fight for resources. Predominantly OIL, and WATER...

 

The planet is controlled by international banking and investment interest that meet in secrecy behind closed doors. These are the people that decides who will be elected and the party of the candidate elected is of no matter since they both are just different sides of the same coin... Thomas Jefferson spoke quite a bit about what had to be done when changes needed to be made but we have been pretty much screwed since 1913 when the Federal Reserve system was implemented here so we are 97 years late in undoing what shouldn't have been done... The liberal, conservative name calling and resulting division of the citizens just makes what has been going on move in the direction TPTB want it to in order to more openly control and govern as a single international entity.... These people have been at it for centuries and unless you are one of them you are a pawn unless you are willing to see blood flowing in the streets, but that won't work because of the political identities that have been assumed so I guess with that kind of mindset so ingrained we should all just kill ourselves in order to not be more enslaved.

 

TC, you always provide insightful input (more so the one time I remember you were drinking, lol), no seriously, what are your thoughts on our oil addiction and where we are headed. How much do we import now, 75%? From countries overflowing with Islamic Fundamentalists that have chosen the 'West" as their greatest enemy.

 

Recently I read that the U.S. has been importing the majority of its oil from Canada and Mexico but Pemex is lowering their production due to the inability to refine the heavier oil that is being pumped now by their off shore rigs... There is some concern that the prices there are going to jumped and that prices here could jump to like $5.00 a gallon... It is possible that oil in many states that aren't producing very much will be tapped in the futurebut there is just so much speculation, deception and misinformation out there right now and with my mind trying to shut down more and more everyday I can't put things into any perspective that make sense to me... As to religious fundamentalist, they all scare the hell out of me regardless of what faith they follow and I am not sure who as chosen who as their greatest enemy but no one has a fleet of ships and troops off of our shores or patrolling on U.S.soil... Have you ever noticed who makes out financially in times of war?... google Smedley D. Butler and you will see that we have been involved militarily in other parts of the world for a long time when there were profits to be made for the corporate elitist and there has been efforts by them to pull off military coups right here on more than one time in the last 75 years when we didn't have troops fighting elsewhere... In the eyes of TPTB we are chattel and cannon fodder they can exploit at will and that isn't enough for them.... Maybe I need to cool it because once again sleep deprivation is winning out and making me loose lipped and crazy... I see what I see and when I express it to those that are of a different point of view I represent whatever it is that they see as the problem... I need a beer and no I haven't had one in days and I drink very little, six beers last month and never more than 2 at a time.... Alcohol and morphine are a dangerous combination.

 

Please do not call our use of petroleum products an "addiction to oil." Oil is the fuel we have used to industrialize our world, it is NOT an addiction! This sensationalizes our use of resources and makes us feel guilty and shameful for using the planet's natural supplies of combustible fuel. There are lots of things we as humans can be addicted to - oil is not one of them!

the main problem is that radical environmentalists have gained so much power over the last 35 years or so, that even though the oil business is one of the cleanest, safest, and most careful, we still haven't got the ability to extract what we need from where we can get to it.

There are many geo-political factors influencing our relationship with the Middle East. Things could be better in balance if we weren't currently in a very weakened, passive position.

 

I do not think we are "addicted to oil", but corporate interests are indeed "addicted to money". I'd like to see more small businesses make a come back and less corporate power.

 

Anti-capitalism = Communism. Just know who is behind all this anti-corporate rhetoric. Capitalism is value-neutral. It may not seem so, but it is people who run corporations, and it there is no profit, there is no power. The anti-capitalism people want to have even more regulation through government coercive power. Is that really what you want? Who is it who decides how much money is too much? People like Al Gore? John Kerry? Obama? Do you have as much money as they do? Are they going to donate all their millions to less fortunate people? Not on your life, they will be happy to restrict other people whom they consider "rich." Who gets to decide how much is too much? What about Bill Gates, does he have too much money? Tiger Woods?

Capitalism needs our values to inform it. If we have no values except the cultural fads and the media, of course it's going to look greedy. But also pay attention to what media is saying and why. Most businesses in this country ARE small business, even very successful ones. Or, like Wal-Mart, they start out small and grow. Anti-capitalism coming through the media amounts to support for communism. Which is what journalism schools have been teaching for decades now. To the point where people don't even understand what they are hearing or know what communism really is.