I don't know much CRZ to comment about but
according to my local dearship, they say there is a limited number of about 500 CRZs available in the entire Canada.

this is the first year launch of the CRZ and I am looking forward to it

and you are not the only one "Klasse Act", I like the CRZ too, its sharp, sporty looking and the interior is very nice!

 

back in the dayz americans weren't as fat either... they were underpowered cars at the time with a 92hp(?) at the crank, imaging wat it would do trying to carry all the fat arses of 2011 + new electronics + new safety feature required by law... it's going to be your next puttputt mobile. :D

 

i like how chazzlee is so misinformed on the topic at hand. he claims "requires tons of special batteries", in fact those "special batteries" are NiMAH batteries, nickel metal hydride. its the same batteries that goes into r/c cars and most common rechargeable household cells. the packs in most hybrid vehicles are grouped AA or sub C cells, they are interlinked and work together as a pack. just imagine the rechargeable pack inside your cordless phone but, 500 of those packs soldered together to output higher voltage (single cell of NiMH = 1.2v) to create 600 some what volts to power the electric motor.

of course a hybrid drivetrain vehicle has lots of batteries but its not special. its not like honda is going to implement a flux capacitor(1.21 jiggawatts!!!a little plutonium or a bolt of lightning) for its power source for the electric motor.

 

Honda just can't get it right with their hybrids, except for the original Insight they're always compromising them or not offering any real competition for the Prius. I loved the original Insight but Honda should have known 2 seaters plus the Insight's Citroen like styling would scare consumers away

 

The lack of nice hybrid honda will probably raise the value of the mk1 insight..

 

What does this mean? Nice as in interior creature comforts? Even the harshest of critics lavishes praise on the CRZ interior.

I am amused by everyone here who is gloating over the 1st gen insight...when it was released it was railed for being ugly and was so far ahead of it's time that consumers weren't ready for it. The same thing now...the CRZ is ahead of it's time and is being criticized here for the very same reasons.

Lastly, I love how everyone quotes the 0-60 time as a "screwy spec.". When was the last time anyone bought a Honda for it's 0-60 times?!? I mean for realz....that's like buying a Hummer for the gas mileage.

 

I have no praise for the 1st gen Insight cause it's an ugly car that only diehards would drive... but I don't understand what your reasoning is calling the CRZ 'ahead of its time.' The Insight was for sure at its time, but in the present in the car market the CRZ is merely an amalgamation of what Honda currently has into a barely competent car. Same engine as the Fit, same IMA system as the new Insight, no real vast improvement over any similar cars that aren't hybrid in power, and none over any hybrids in terms of fuel economy. It's just a weak inefficient car that Honda hopes to sell by using the 'sporty' gimmick. When Honda makes a car that outclasses everything else in a given category (power, economy, price, etc) then you can go ahead and call it ahead of its time (if it doesn't sell well).

 

The interior is the only nice thing about the crz. And even if the plastic feels strong, it's still not really soft. I don't care, but many magazines in Europe only swear by VAG soft plastic, fit and finish and "chic-classic" interior.

 

bout

Forgot about the Matrix already but don't know about the Blacktop 20v, sorry. I probably should've said perf oriented cars in general. Its hard to believe that Toyota produced one of the most iconic cars of all time, the last gen Supra....they really did make that car up till 1998, right?

I sat in the CR-Z this evening and I must say....MOST IMPRESSIVE!

 

They did it until 2002 in Japan I think. And the black top is sport oriented. I don't really know which car had them stock (except jdm corolla) but it's a perfect engine for any mr2 mk1.
But still, Toyota made the elise engine for long time (now I don't know) they provide the V6 for the Evora too, not so sporty but an Evora S should come soon.
And "G's" is supposed to offer some tuned cars.

 

You say it wouldn't need 200kg of extra weight broody, well I say a minimum of 150kg just based on cars from past to now. Just look at the Fit and back to the '86 Civic and look at the weight increase from generation to generation. I choose the Civic, because it is the most closely resembled product offered to the Fit today. Like I said, just look at the CR-X from the '88-89 MY to the
'90-91 MY, just that slight change gained a good amount of weight and it still would not pass safety standards of today. Look at each generation, they kept getting heavier and heavier and today's Civic weighs near 1.35 tonnes and that AT model Civic weighed in at around 1750lbs, HUGE difference of over 1000lbs.

Like I said, they could make the cars lighter, but people wouldn't buy them because the costs would be astronomical if using carbon, aluminum and Ti throughout the chassis. Slowly but surely, the costs are coming down and eventually it will be feasible to produce cars out of these components for a decent price to the consumer. They will not only be lighter, but stronger as well and FE will also increase incredibly due to the weight lost.

It just boggles my mind that people are so quick to spout their opinion without really delving into the facts and call something pointless and a failure because so and so car from 2 decades ago achieved better FE.

Yeah the Citroen was the basis of the Insight, they look all so alike. :) I know you must only be f'n around, because the Insight was based on looks off of the CR-X completely.

 

You might want to say Yamaha provided the engine for the Elise since they designed it for Toyota, hell most of Toyboat's sportier motors are not penned in house and have been designed by Yamaha, all the way back to the famous GT2000. Pretty much the only reason they ended up with the Yamaha powerplant was because Toyboat sold them very cheaply as Lotus first went to Honda for the K series as users in the UK and other parts of Europe were already tossing out the Lotus K powerplant in favor of the Honda K powerplant.

 

Past to now? Echo hatchback vs yaris h/b = 100 extra kilo.
The insight was sold until 2006. Some actual cars we out in 2006 and got almost no changes, like the aveo or accent. The aveo probably isn't great about safety and wa sout in something like 2011 in Korea. A civic 86 (on the end of it's short life) has nothing to do with an insight in terms of safety. Is just the the insight was well engineering and that they actually put money to make the car lighter (I guess so). The mk1 was perfect, the crz is all wrong (except for the interior).

And be prepared, watch this
http://www.cars-directory.net/specs/.../1989_9/12456/
http://www.carfolio.com/specificatio...ar/?car=162547

The 20+ years old civic wagon 4wd death trap, about the same size as a usdm fit, weights only 10kg less than the super safe and nicely eqquiped fit RS 4wd. These cars are truly comparable in terms of power, drivetrain, ride quality, room, size, noise level, etc.
The fit is made to be cheap, is A/T, 4wd, roomy, 5 seater. The insight, even with todays strandard, would not get so much weight (better engines would make up the difference compared to the old one).


And that's true, my 3sgte was made by yamaha (and it blew 2 months ago...) too, but the 20v was Toyota I beleive.
And weather it's yamaha or Toyota it doesn't really matter for me, as long as they don't put an obsolete Subaru powerplant under the hood.

 

Well it's good we are all allowed to spout our opinions, thankfully we're not in NK. :) To me the CR-Z is not wrong and part of me wishes I waited a few extra months before picking up my Fit, but the other part of me is glad I didn't because the Fit already cost me $23.5k to get on the road and the CR-Z would have added in another almost $6.5k.

You pointed out the Echo and Yaris and already there is a 100kg increase, you said it wouldn't take more than 50kg for the 1st gen Insight to meet today's safety requirements. I just don't see that being the case. If they continued on with extensive use of aluminum, maybe, but I doubt even then it would come under 50kg and the cost would go WAY up. The front of the car wouldn't even pass the pedestrian test (which is complete crap to me) and would need to be redesigned.

Now on to the CR-Z and safety, it recently received 5 stars in European testing and was rated the safest hybrid on the road (not many of them so anyways) and also the 2nd safest car tested by the new European tests. Wonder how the first gen Insight would fare in those same tests? :)

 

The difference between the echo and yaris is maybe 100kg, but the yaris has many more features and more sound deadening...
The example of the fit 4wd vs civic 4wd is more apples with apples comparison, sicne that civic had about the same comfort level than the fit.

And I'm not looking for the best car, just a car that will pass the tests.

 

Well pretty much all cars pass the test or they wouldn't be able to be purchased, some do so better than others, where Honda likes to have its full line.

 

The cars are actually pretty nice and the 6 speed I thought was better than my fit. I test drove the ones we had on our lot. If your going to get one the EX model would be best over the base model. I also recommend the bass kit stero upgrade since the car is pretty enclosed it bumps nice

 

i hate cars i haven't driven, food i've never eaten, and movies i've never watched. i reserve the right to pass judgement on anything and everything without prior experience from the comfort of my computer chair.
/sarcasm

the cr-x was a bare bones car even in usdm SI trim. crank windows, no power steering, practically no sound deadening, no air bags, and piss poor crash ratings (by today's standards). the cr-z has power windows (standard), electrically assisted steering, driver/passenger/curtain airbags, impact absorbing crumple zones, and a laundry list of creature comforts you would only find in luxury cars in the late 80's and early 90's. comparing the cr-x to the cr-z is nonsensical, only related by affiliation.

i've owned a standard cr-x (dpfi FTL) and that car was nothing to get all up in arms about. you only found the cr-x's charm till you got coilovers, swapped engines, and upgraded the tires. stock for stock, the Fit was worlds more fun than the cr-x and the more i modded my gd3 according to how i drove it the better it got. if the cr-z is supposed to be sportier than a Fit then i'd imagine a world of improvement as aftermarket companies continue to develop parts for it; although, i'll eat my words and reserve judgement till i've driven one.

 

Drive one there pretty cool.

Lol at dual point. Worst design ever. I remember in my civic hatch 4spd standard that was dual point too and if the hill I was driving up was too steep I had to down shift to 2nd because the MPH would just fall lol

it was worse with a/c on

 

i traded my fit for one after i drove it.