According to three Boston metro Honda dealers (Bernardi, Boch, and Commonwealth) they were not able to order a Fit with MT after I started looking in June 2019. I ended up with a Fit LX CVT with no other options.

 

Have you guys even owned manual Hondas in the past!? Hondas have never had overdrive gears that turn 1000 RPM on the highway. Honda is known for its high revving engines.

I have no issue with how the Fit's 6th gear is on the highway. My 2000 Civic Si only had 5 gears and it turned at 4500 RPM on the highway. My 2015 Si was a bit lower but it didn't have the 8000 RPM redline of the 2000. Even my 2019 Si with its torque, turbo and even lower redline, still spins at over 3000 RPM on the highway.

In all of these cars, I could/can accelerate on the highway without having to downshift. Sure, its faster to do so but it's nice to have options.

The other common thread, is that fuel economy is fantastic despite the high revs. A taller overdrive gear isn't going to make these 50 MPG cars but it will make them sluggish when you try to accelerate in top gear.

What is annoying is that my 2019 Si is much faster and gets the same fuel economy of my Fit. lol.

Also my 2019 Fit Sport is a manual (as was my 2018 Sport) but I'm in Canada.

 

I use 5th for modest uphill sections at highway speeds below about 70. When climbing, I like to keep the RPMs above 3,000. Downshift to 4th for passing, unless I'm already going pretty fast. These little VTEC engines are designed for high revs.

 

2018 sport MT here.....i rarely go into 6th gear even on highways =S

I really think that they should've made 6th gear taller because when i am cruising on 6th gear, i am still hitting 3k rpm at 60 mph.....

 

actually , no , you're not right , i hope this settles this argument

 

2017 Fit LX MT, 80k miles
5th gear and 6th gear diverge at higher speeds. downshifting to 5th at 70-80 will place the engine directly in its powerband for highway passes, while 6th can do it, the engine seems happier to be at 4k+ for pulling.

 

Agreed. The gears are well chosen for the torque and horsepower characteristics of the diminutive rev-happy engine. I would agree with most here that 5th doesn't have much use in normal flat-terrain driving but is helpful on a mountain highway with climbing for added control in keeping the engine in its power band as well as engine braking.

I'm glad that Honda chose to gear the GK Fit for performance.

 

The Honda Civic VX had excellent gas mileage (49 Highway with the 1.5L). It achieve it with several technologies but the final 5th gear ratio was only 0.694 and can attest that 5th gear was all for economy and not for passing.

Fitted with the same manual transmission as the USDM CX, the VX was identical to the base model CX except that it gained improved fuel efficiency from various weight reduction methods such as reduced trim and molding, VX model-specific lightweight 13" aluminum alloy wheels, 165/70/R13 tires, and through a 92 hp (69 kW) 1.5 L (D15Z1) VTEC-E engine. These features on the VX yielded 48/55 mpg (city/hwy) [revised to 2008 EPA rating: 39/49 mpg city/hwy[5]] or 44/51 mpg (city/hwy) [revised to 2008 EPA rating: 36/46 mpg city/hwy[6]]

The D15Z1 engine's efficiency was enhanced by placing cam followers(bearings) at every cam lobe, to reduce friction, the use of only two piston rings per cylinder, to reduce friction, and the ability to burn an ultra lean(for the time) fuel air mixture at idle, and below 2500 rpm at low load. This was achieved by only opening one valve during the intake stroke, rather than both, below 2500 rpm engine speed, placing the multiport fuel injectors very near the intake valves, and by using an ultra sensitive oxygen (lambda) sensor. The oxygen sensor is mounted on the cast iron exhaust manifold, to be as close to the cylinders as possible, so the sensor will be as hot as possible for more accurate readings. It has two O2 measurement electrochemical cells, rather than the single cell that at the time was universal. This same model sensor has been adopted by racing teams to monitor the combustion in each cylinder of racing engines during the tuning process, one per cylinder, because of its sensitivity.

The opening of only one intake valve below 2,500 RPM results in much more of the pressure drop between atmospheric pressure, and the inside of the cylinder to be across the valve than would otherwise be the case. This results in an exceptionally turbulent flow, very good mixing of the charge, very high speed flame propagation at ignition, high resistance to predetonation (knock), and very low amounts of unburned hydrocarbons, and carbon monoxide, and increased engine torque, and power in both lean burn mode, and at more normal fuel-air mixtures, below 2,500 rpm. As a result of, the increased torque, and power at low rpm, the engine's torque, and power curves are between those of normally aspirated gasoline, and diesel engines. Since the VX has what was for the time an ultra low[citation needed] coefficient of aerodynamic drag of 0.30 cd, the car could operate at highway speeds in lean burn mode.

 

Think it's just a Japanese thing. I also have a 06 Miata. Gearing is pretty much identical. 6 gear where 5th is the lonelest gear. 80 mph = 4,000 rpm. They also programed the tack with the speedo in 6th gear. Both needles move exactly the same. I admit. Pretty cool.

I'm OK, as I know the V Tech kicks in at 4,000 rpm, so it keeps me under 80 mph.

 

I agree with you about skipping fifth gear a lot. The numbers for 4th, 5th and 6th gears are as follows. .949 for 4th, .81 for 5th and .727 for 6th. 6th gear should be .694 or even a little lower like .68.

This is probably the same everywhere. The manual transmission is made in Japan and the automatic is made in Mexico for the US models. I have experienced climbing a fairly steep grade in 6th gear
at the speed of 55 and I didn't have to down shift at all. My daily traveling is 1/3 city and 2/3 interstate. I have hills to climb going both ways and the only time I have had to shift out of 6th gear is
when my speed gets below 45 mph on steep hill. The torque band is steeply climbing from 1000 rpms through 3000. It starts to flatten out a little but it peaks around 4600 rmps. Horsepower is climbing
all the way to around 6600 rpms. This engine wouldn't have any problem cruising at 70 mph at 2200 rpms.

The isn't any reason that 6th gear couldn't be in the .69 to .67 range. Here in the states there is a big push to make only automatic transmissions. They say that all the new features of adaptive cruise and
lane assist, basically what Honda calls Honda Sense, does't work with manual transmission vehicles. Well those in the UK know better, you can even get a manual Fit with Honda Sense and it even has
Speed Limit sign recognition. That feature is only available on the Accord with an automatic here in the US. The two main reasons are so the manufactures don't have to make a semi autonomous system that
has to work with two completely types of transmissions and if you make that last gear ratio in the manual wrong, it will allow the automatic to have a higher MPG rating. The manual transmission is seeing it's
last days. I am glad I got one before it disappeared. Now they're trying to decide if the 2020 Fit will even come to the US. I have heard that the plant in Mexico that makes the Fit and HR-V will only be making
HR-V's for next year.

I feel bad for the rest of the people in the US that won't be able to purchase a 2020 Honda Fit whether it be a manual or automatic. It is a great little vehicle. Maybe Honda will change their mind. At the Tokyo
Motor Show, they only said it was under consideration at this point.

AgileFit 2019 Fit Sport 6M PWP with HFP Suspension Package.

 

Not sure the point you’re making but to me you’re pointing out that the Fit with a taller overdrive 6th gear would be a slug when passing on the highway like Civic VX.

 

6th gear should have been designed for economy. The MPG on the vehicle would be higher. The power band on the engine starts low enough that down
shifting would still be rare. It would also be nice to have the RPMs a little lower on the Interstates. Say a little under 3000 at 75 MPH. I could go for a little
more MPGs. It seems that 6th gear was designed for slower Interstate limits. Just in a 100 mile radius of me the Interstate speed limits range form 55 to 70.

 

The GK sixth gear ratio is identical to the fifth gear ratio in the second gen Fit. All Honda did was sneak the extra gear between fourth and fifth really.

 

I am satisified with the gearing of the Fit. Honda started out as a motorcycle building company and as such I appreciate the way their engines behave in their cars much like a motorcycle drives...rev happy and responsive. Want speed?.rev out the engine and it obliges...even in the Fit. Want economy?...slow down and keep it steady at 60-65 mph. Still get 40+ mpg.

 

As owner of a first gen. 2007 Fit Sport manual five speed, I am surprised by some of these posts. I really wish I had a sixth gear. At 80-85mph on western Interstates, my poor little Fit is whirring away at well over 4000 rpm in 5th gear. Gas mileage suffers BIG TIME! Sure wish I had a sixth with longer legs.

 

See quote below...

 

This is exactly what I do. The engine seems happiest in the 3,500 to 4,000 range.

 

Of course it would be more comfortable to cruise 85 mph if the 6th gear would have longer ratio. However, Honda is using the same 6MT gearbox in all Fit/Jazz market areas around the world. At the time of designing this 6-speed manual transmission for GK, the highest speed limit in Japan was only 100 km/h (62 mph). Had Honda made the ratio for 6th gear any longer it would have been really unusable anywhere in Japan, their home market. Not a good idea for reputation and sales there. Instead they made gear ratios to be decent for all market areas, and as mentioned earlier in this thread, the gears are well chosen for the torque and horsepower characteristics of the engine.

I am driving so often older and louder cars that GK5 Jazz feels pretty silent even when driving at illegal speeds like 140 km/h (87 mph).

 

Something not yet mentioned is the cargo/passenger load. I really appreciate the close ratio gearing in high altitude (less power) on a mountain road (climbing) when the car is loaded down with passengers and cargo. It's much easier to keep the engine in the sweet spot RPM wise and that little engine needs all the help (from gearing) it can get in those conditions.

 

I agree that the shorter gearing does help when the car is loaded up. I notice myself cruising in 5th gear a lot more often when I have passengers and cargo, but when I'm commuting by myself, I always skip 5th gear entirely.

I don't find myself using 5th on a mountain road, because if 6th is insufficient, 5th will only give me 300-400 rpm, so I always go straight to 4th which gives me 600-1000 rpm, which is typically exactly what I need. However, on a mountain climb, I don't find my self wishing for a gear any taller than 6th.

I would also hesitate to call this a "close ratio" transmission. 1st, 2nd, and 3rd, are all pretty widely spaced. 1-2 is 85.1%, and 2-3 is 51.4%. (Contrast that with the K24 Civic Si,1-2 at 60.1% and 2-3 at 42.8%.) The rest of the gears of the Fit's 6 speed would qualify as "close ratio" though.

I believe it would be better if they left 1st and 6th alone, while making 1-3 a little closer together, and 3-6 a little more widely spaced. Since there's no room under the hood for a substantially taller 6th gear, I think a compromise would be to switch from a 4.625 to the 4.294 final drive would be acceptable. The European Jazz does have a 0.689 final drive, which I think they should have used in the USDM model.

Comparing the current ratios vs what I would revise them to follows:

1) 3.462 (13:45) (4.41mph@1000rpm) ___ 3.462 (13:45) (4.75mph@1000rpm)
2) 1.870 (23:43) [85.1%] (8.17mph@1000rpm) ___ 2.143 (21:45) [61.5%] (7.68mph@1000rpm)
3) 1.235 (34:42) [51.4%] (12.4mph@1000rpm) ___ 1.452 (31:45) [47.6%] (11.3mph@1000rpm)
4) 0.949 (39:37) [30.1%] (16.1mph@1000rpm) ___ 1.111 (36:40) [30.7%] (14.8mph@1000rpm)
5) 0.810 (42:34) [17.2%] (18.9mph@1000rpm) ___ 0.854 (41:35) [30.1%] (19.3mph@1000rpm)
6) 0.727 (44:32) [11.4%] (21.0mph@1000rpm) ___ 0.689 (45:31) [23.9%] (23.9mph@1000rpm)
Final: 4.625 (16:74) 4.294 (17:73)

This would be a proper close ratio 6 speed. The revised 1st, 5th, and 6th are all taller, but 2nd-4th are actually shorter than the current ratios. 6th would only be useful after 45 mph with just a driver and little or no cargo.

The current 6th will be revving 3333 rpm at 70 mph, while the new 6th will be 2929 rpm at 70 mph, which is an improvement, without going overboard. 5th is basically the same as before. Then 1-3 will all be closer together, improving acceleration and smoothness and mitigate the annoyance of any rev hang.