My Turbo Build: Possibly the first USDM GE8 turbo build actually completed
Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 115
From: Palmdale
Put the intercooler in. Took 7 hours last night and another hour today. Clearance is insanely tight. I had to completely remove the fog lights and even then I had to cut into the bumper a bit. There is only 1 way to get pipes past the radiator.
I actualy like the look, i think it appeals to my inner ricer. Just gotta throw some mesh up. And maybe some door edge trim to cover up the parts of the foglight area I cut into.
The bad news is that with all the bends and pipe size changes (all my components are 2.5 but only 2.25 will get through the space under the headlights) 2.25->2.5->BOV->2.25->2.5->Intercooler-> -2.5->-2.25->Maf->2.5->TB I have a 1.5 psi drop across the system (no leaks)
The intercooler is nothing short of incredible. I saw intake temps at about 120 degrees during wot with no intercooler with ambient temps at about 20 degrees. Now with the intercooler I see intake temps at about 30 degrees with 25 degrees ambient. Due to the pressure loss across the system I have slightly less power in 1st and 2nd gear but oddly enough I actually feel like I am going faster in 3rd gear than before. Can't wait to turn up the boost to get 8psi in the manifold again and realy feel the difference.
I actualy like the look, i think it appeals to my inner ricer. Just gotta throw some mesh up. And maybe some door edge trim to cover up the parts of the foglight area I cut into.
The bad news is that with all the bends and pipe size changes (all my components are 2.5 but only 2.25 will get through the space under the headlights) 2.25->2.5->BOV->2.25->2.5->Intercooler-> -2.5->-2.25->Maf->2.5->TB I have a 1.5 psi drop across the system (no leaks)
The intercooler is nothing short of incredible. I saw intake temps at about 120 degrees during wot with no intercooler with ambient temps at about 20 degrees. Now with the intercooler I see intake temps at about 30 degrees with 25 degrees ambient. Due to the pressure loss across the system I have slightly less power in 1st and 2nd gear but oddly enough I actually feel like I am going faster in 3rd gear than before. Can't wait to turn up the boost to get 8psi in the manifold again and realy feel the difference.
Why would you want a top mount if you had a front mount? Sleeper look? even then you would be better with a sidemount tucked in a fender?
Why would you run a half-radiator unless you are running a compressor that is to big to fit or doing something like a forward facing turbo?
Last edited by DiamondStarMonsters; Jan 23, 2011 at 04:47 AM.
![Lyon[Nightroad]'s Avatar](https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/customavatars/avatar31469_2.gif){kind=avatar}
Ugh, I'm so envious of all that room to work with. Why o why does the header have to point backwards on the fit into an area that can only be accessed with 1 hand at a time, from the top or bottom.
If you can fit a front mount and are willing to go through the "hassle" it is worth it. Especially in something that will be driving in traffic..
A top mount heat soaks like a mofo, and can actually defeat the purpose of an intercooler and act like a hotpipe when soaked.
Notice how most of the serious subie guys ditch the top mount?
It is about pump gas efficiency and charge density. If he was spraying methanol and/or water he would be able to do it.
But if he is going to locate the charge cooler back under the hood he should go air-to-water and get something like a PWR barrel core.
The long route piping is not a big deal considering the air inside is constantly moving, either through the BOV or the throttle plate.
Additionally all the charge piping adds surface area to cool the charge further.
I would bet money Lyon is not considering going to a top mount.
In a situation where you can fit a front mount, you do it.
Otherwise it would be like going from nice modern wheels and tires back to solid wood and steel wheels.
It'll work, but not nearly as well. Besides how mean is a GE with an FMIC?
Especially since he is the only one in the US that we have been able to find.
Last edited by DiamondStarMonsters; Jan 23, 2011 at 02:09 PM.
Yep. and it still gets better mpg than my super slow backup parts getter car:
'hey let's play fitbook guys!'
T-bird in the background. ugh, she was actually kind of pretty before the quarter and rocker panels got the cancer. Its incredible that once upon a time it was possible to make a 3.8l v6 that gets 140hp and 200ftlbs and get away with it. Thats also me before I started working for the man. Never get an office job. I gained far too many pounds sitting on my ass all day at work.
Nothing can overstate the importance of having a back up car.
'hey let's play fitbook guys!'
T-bird in the background. ugh, she was actually kind of pretty before the quarter and rocker panels got the cancer. Its incredible that once upon a time it was possible to make a 3.8l v6 that gets 140hp and 200ftlbs and get away with it. Thats also me before I started working for the man. Never get an office job. I gained far too many pounds sitting on my ass all day at work.
Nothing can overstate the importance of having a back up car.
Last edited by Lyon[Nightroad]; Jan 24, 2011 at 07:53 PM.
Man I would kill for a fedora like that... I can see myself on stage now with green bullet microphone, Fender Bassman honking on a low B flat Hohner in a South side blues club with Buddy Guy.
Some wise words here.
And that is a sharp suit. Looks like you are about to perform a hit.
Member
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,462
From: Vermont
They See Me Rollin'... they Hatin'...
Guy I went to high School with had one of those... An SC with the following pinstripe on the side. (name right below the driver's/passenger's window)
--------------------------------------~~~"frankie"~~~-----------------
He also wore his Z.Cavaricci Pants.
those were the Days.
~SB
It's amazing how something that would take 20 minutes on a normal turbo'd car takes 2 hours on a turbo'd fit, like installing an MBC
The piece with the arrow is the Tee for the MBC. I was only able to reach about 3 fingers up there to work with. You have to stop working constantly due to never ending hand cramps. The rust colored barrel is the halfshaft directly in my way.
Access from the top is... impossible. Removing the charge pipes would take needlessly long, just as long as working from the bottom. Note the MBC hose in front of the air filter leading down to the turbo.
Getting access to the firewall would take FOREVER so I routed my MBC hose another way.
Had to cut into the rubber door grommet to let the hose go through
Then pop it all in and route behind the dash.
Finally route to upper glove compartment.
And then when you finally go to test it... THE F#%&ERS PUT THE BALL AND SPRING IN BACKWARDS IN THE TEE. I was boosting up to 16 psi again. Thank god nothing broke. So I had to drive home, jack it up again, and figure out wtf was going on. Finally I just took the whole tee out. Whatever assholes put it together, put the spring and ball in the opposite end so that boost would never be able to reach the actuator. WTF! The arrow clearly said to point towards the actuator yet it should have been pointing away. O well, another hour of my life gone.
The piece with the arrow is the Tee for the MBC. I was only able to reach about 3 fingers up there to work with. You have to stop working constantly due to never ending hand cramps. The rust colored barrel is the halfshaft directly in my way.
Access from the top is... impossible. Removing the charge pipes would take needlessly long, just as long as working from the bottom. Note the MBC hose in front of the air filter leading down to the turbo.
Getting access to the firewall would take FOREVER so I routed my MBC hose another way.
Had to cut into the rubber door grommet to let the hose go through
Then pop it all in and route behind the dash.
Finally route to upper glove compartment.
And then when you finally go to test it... THE F#%&ERS PUT THE BALL AND SPRING IN BACKWARDS IN THE TEE. I was boosting up to 16 psi again. Thank god nothing broke. So I had to drive home, jack it up again, and figure out wtf was going on. Finally I just took the whole tee out. Whatever assholes put it together, put the spring and ball in the opposite end so that boost would never be able to reach the actuator. WTF! The arrow clearly said to point towards the actuator yet it should have been pointing away. O well, another hour of my life gone.
I'm learning some interesting things as time goes by.
First, the AT loves, I mean LOVES to kickdown into boost. If I kickdown from part throttle 3rd to WOT 2nd it's like a bat out of hell. It HATES to go from part throttle to full throttle in the same gear (unless from a standstill), the slushbox is, well, very slushly under those circumstances. In fact most of my spark/fuel cuts occur when I slush it up. I get about 20 degrees btdc base timing when I downkick and about 16-15 degrees base timing when I hit it in the current gear.
Second, the ecu, without some way to crack it, is too complex to understand. I actually think of the ECU as a personality. Oddly enough she, the ecu, can never make up her mind on exactly what she wants to do about all the new found boost love in her life. Fortunately everytime I reset the ECU I can start over. She truly is like a woman. If I treat her like a doll when we first meat, after a reset, and take her out for nice rides and never show her my turbo, she turns into an evil bitch and shuts me down everytime I try to enter the sweet embrace of boost on our later dates. However, If I am upfront with her from the start, and show her exactly what I really want from her she will let me into boost much more often even with the exact same tune. I find that I am growing very attached to each personality and sometimes I find myself a bit hesitant to throw her to the curb and start over but in the end its best to throw the woman out when she gets bitchy and start over with a new one.
...
And yes, piggyback tuning is seriously this f$%*ed up.
First, the AT loves, I mean LOVES to kickdown into boost. If I kickdown from part throttle 3rd to WOT 2nd it's like a bat out of hell. It HATES to go from part throttle to full throttle in the same gear (unless from a standstill), the slushbox is, well, very slushly under those circumstances. In fact most of my spark/fuel cuts occur when I slush it up. I get about 20 degrees btdc base timing when I downkick and about 16-15 degrees base timing when I hit it in the current gear.
Second, the ecu, without some way to crack it, is too complex to understand. I actually think of the ECU as a personality. Oddly enough she, the ecu, can never make up her mind on exactly what she wants to do about all the new found boost love in her life. Fortunately everytime I reset the ECU I can start over. She truly is like a woman. If I treat her like a doll when we first meat, after a reset, and take her out for nice rides and never show her my turbo, she turns into an evil bitch and shuts me down everytime I try to enter the sweet embrace of boost on our later dates. However, If I am upfront with her from the start, and show her exactly what I really want from her she will let me into boost much more often even with the exact same tune. I find that I am growing very attached to each personality and sometimes I find myself a bit hesitant to throw her to the curb and start over but in the end its best to throw the woman out when she gets bitchy and start over with a new one.
...
And yes, piggyback tuning is seriously this f$%*ed up.
Last edited by Lyon[Nightroad]; Jan 29, 2011 at 04:45 AM.
Found some 100 octane unleaded on tap at a near by gas station and 50/50'd with 93 premium. Holy shit what a world of difference. I never see knock retard now. I mist go watermeth soon! 6.50 a gallon is too much.
.... Nothing like cold air intake temperature and octane to bring out the best in a boosted engine
