2nd Generation GE8 Specific Suspension & Brakes Sub-Forum Threads discussing suspension and brake related modifications for the 2nd generation Honda Fit (GE8)

Rubbing noise after front brakes job

  #1  
Old 07-08-2018, 11:57 AM
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Question Rubbing noise after front brakes job

Hey guys,

I'm sorry I've been posting a lot lately. I'm trying to learn more about mechanic and my car being now out of warranty, I figure it would be the best way to learn. Our car is also quite simple to do maintenance on it.

So I did my first brake job yesterday on my 2009 Fit and took it for a very small drive (less than 10 kms) this morning and notice some kind of rubbing noise. It does not seem to be when I brake, but when I'm coasting. I jacked the front wheels after my drive and noticed that when spinning the wheels (either forward or reverse), there's some kind of rubbing noise. Just as if the pads were rubbing. But this happens on BOTH sides. Braking performances seems good however. I did the same procedure on both sides. The procedure that I did is below.

I changed both front rotors and pads. I used the Centric rotors as well as the Akebono pads. I also used Permatex copper anti-seize, medium blue threadlocker, Permatex Silicon Ceramic lub and of course brake cleaner. I bought brand new brake hardware (caliper clips and pads springs).

Because this was my first brake job, I followed
as well as the Haynes service manual that I bought for the Fit. So I believe I had pretty good sources to perform my brake job including the Honda torque specs. This is what I did :
  1. Cleaned all the rust that I could using a wire metal brush on the hub, caliber bracket and caliper clam shell.
  2. Used brake cleaner on the hub to remove the rust that I scraped with the metal brush.
  3. Cleaned the new rotors with brake cleaner (non-chlorinated). Both sides of the rotor.
  4. Applied copper anti-seize on the back of the rotor (where the rotor meet with the hub) to help removal of the rotor next time. I read that somewhere few days ago.
  5. Bought new Honda OEM rotor screws to screw the rotor to the hub. Applied a small amount of copper anti-seize on each screw. Again, same source as above. 2 screws per side.
  6. Cleaned the piston with a small amount of blake cleaner on a paper towel trying not to touch the rubber seal.
  7. Installed new brake hardware clips on the caliper brackets.
  8. Screwed in the caliper brackets and torqued each 17mm screws to 80n*m. All screws have a bit of medium blue threadlocker on them.
  9. Lubbed the guide pins using silicon ceramic lub. I cleaned/removed the previous lub using paper towel before applying the new one.
  10. Using a very small amount of copper anti-seize, applied some on the clip hardware and went very carefull to not touch the rotor with anti-seize.
  11. Applied some copper anti-seize on the back of the pads.
  12. Once the pads were in the caliper bracket, installed brand new pads retainer/clip/string. 2x per side.
  13. Installed the caliper clam shell on the pads/bracket and torqued the screws to 22n*m. These screws have medium threadlocker on them. I had to hold the guide pin when screwing these screws otherwise it would spin.
  14. Started the car, pressed the brake pedal a few time to get a good feeling.

I think this pretty much sums up what I did. I did the exact same thing on both side.

Do you know why I would get a rubbing noise ? Did I miss something or did something wrong ? Or is it just a Break-In thing ? I read on the Akebono Pro-Act flyer that they do not have Break-In.

Thanks,

Neo.
 
  #2  
Old 07-08-2018, 03:23 PM
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If it's not the rotor dust shield rubbing a rotor.....and you KNOW you did the brake job correctly, just drive it normally. It's pretty typical for a fresh brake job to make light scrub noises until they "bed in". I'd expect 10-30 normal routine stops in traffic should be sufficient (a typical daily commute for some people).



When I do a brake job with Hondas pads, they are usually pretty quiet by the time a 5 mile test drive with about 10 stops is done.

Aftermarket parts may be different.
 
  #3  
Old 07-08-2018, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by ezone View Post
If it's not the rotor dust shield rubbing a rotor.....and you KNOW you did the brake job correctly, just drive it normally. It's pretty typical for a fresh brake job to make light scrub noises until they "bed in". I'd expect 10-30 normal routine stops in traffic should be sufficient (a typical daily commute for some people).



When I do a brake job with Hondas pads, they are usually pretty quiet by the time a 5 mile test drive with about 10 stops is done.

Aftermarket parts may be different.
Thanks ezone. I will let a few days go by and report later. I believe I did the brake job properly. This is why I posted all the steps that I did in my original post so that someone can correct me if I did something wrong or missed a step.

Thanks !
 
  #4  
Old 07-10-2018, 09:23 PM
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A small follow-up; feedback is welcome.

I had a 150 kms (~90 miles) drive today. Mostly highway but some back country roads. The rubbing is still there but at low speed I can hear a high pitch sound. On the highway I can't hear due to engine and road noise. Pedal sensation is very good and braking is excellent. No vibrations on the pedal or steering wheel when braking. So as for performances, they are very good.

Before dark tonight, I had time to check the front passenger side. From what I can tell, it seems as if the outside pad is rubbing on the rotor. If I remove the caliper and the pads (only the caliper bracket left on the rotor) and I turn the rotor manually, all the rubbing noise is gone. Installing the pads and the caliper introduces the rubbing. Looking at the pads when they are inside the caliper, it looks like the outside pad is the problem.

The wife was in the car pumping the brakes while I was looking at the caliper moving. It's not moving by much. I know it doesn't need to move by much, but still. If I turn the rotor and the wife pumps the brakes, then the rotor stops right away. Releasing the brakes pedal release the rotor but there's rubbing involved. It seems that the caliper is like a hair (or 2) too tight for the outside pad. The pads springs are doing their job perfectly; I can't put the springs on the pads without holding the pads otherwise one pad will move and I can't fit them in the caliper ! So the springs do not seem to be the issue.

Guide pins move freely from what I can feel.

Any idea ?

Thanks !
 
  #5  
Old 07-10-2018, 09:43 PM
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Check if one of the stainless clips in the caliper bracket ends got bent or shifted sideways and rubs the rotor?


Pads will almost always drag lightly against the rotor when the caliper is relaxed, no matter what. The little wire spreaders just help push the pads away but they aren't supposed to have all that much strength. If they actually pushed the pads far apart then you'd have excessive pedal travel to make up for it.
 
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Old 07-10-2018, 09:43 PM
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did u apply grease where metal contacts the brake pad? of course not the side that touches the rotor.
 
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Old 07-10-2018, 10:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ezone View Post
Check if one of the stainless clips in the caliper bracket ends got bent or shifted sideways and rubs the rotor?


Pads will almost always drag lightly against the rotor when the caliper is relaxed, no matter what. The little wire spreaders just help push the pads away but they aren't supposed to have all that much strength. If they actually pushed the pads far apart then you'd have excessive pedal travel to make up for it.
I'll check for the clips, thanks.

It has to be something with the caliper, caliper hardware or pads. Caliper hardware and pads are new. Could I be pretty unlucky and got a stuck piston on both side ? A piston that is not returning fully to his starting position in the caliper ? I can push fully the piston using a tool, but I don't know if it returns properly to his position in the caliper when released.

That high pitch noise, could it be actually something else related to a wheel bearing or something ? I don't know much about these.

Originally Posted by xxryu139xx View Post
did u apply grease where metal contacts the brake pad? of course not the side that touches the rotor.
Yes I did, just like ChrixFix did in his video. Copper anti-seize and also silicon grease/lub on both guide pins. Oh and copper anti-seize on the back of the pads.
 
  #8  
Old 07-10-2018, 10:45 PM
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I can push fully the piston using a tool, but I don't know if it returns properly to his position in the caliper when released.
It is never supposed to fully retract in use, it only relaxes.



Actual piston retraction is only a few thousandths of an inch when you take your foot off of the brake pedal.
 
  #9  
Old 07-11-2018, 06:56 AM
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Originally Posted by ezone View Post
It is never supposed to fully retract in use, it only relaxes.



Actual piston retraction is only a few thousandths of an inch when you take your foot off of the brake pedal.
Thanks. I'm getting better at understanding how it works.

One thing I am going to check as well are the guide pins once again. I'll remove the pads and test how the caliper is moving moving without the pads. I want to see if it moves freely and if it returns to his original position when releasing as I saw in many videos. I applied a good amount of silicon on the guide pins, but I did not clean inside the guide pins holes. There might be dust inside preventing the guide pins to fully go to the bottom of the hole and shifting the caliper slightly inside (which would make the outer pad touches the rotor). I'll also replace the boots of the pins as the old ones might be worn out.

I'll keep you posted. Any other feedback/reply is of course welcome

Thanks again guys !
 
  #10  
Old 07-11-2018, 11:01 AM
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The stainless clips that come with some aftermarket caliper (brackets) are crap, fit poorly and can make contact with the rotors (very metallic scrape/screech noises, sometimes not consistent). I tend to reuse originals just because they fit better.


In the last 2 days I've seen this with 4 NEW aftermarket calipers LOL
 
  #11  
Old 07-11-2018, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by ezone View Post
The stainless clips that come with some aftermarket caliper (brackets) are crap, fit poorly and can make contact with the rotors (very metallic scrape/screech noises, sometimes not consistent). I tend to reuse originals just because they fit better.


In the last 2 days I've seen this with 4 NEW aftermarket calipers LOL
Thanks. I bought clips from the Honda dealership at 8$CAD each so they are OEM. Maybe I just incorrectly clip them. I'll keep you posted once I look at this. It might be only this week-end as I'm pretty busy this week, but I'll follow-up for sure
 
  #12  
Old 04-22-2019, 11:56 PM
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From everything you describe, I don't think you have a problem. If it was my car, given it brakes properly, I'd drive it for a few hundred miles and see if complete bedding in of the pads to rotors solves the noise issue. If the noise persists, you should carefully examine the rotor on the side you hear the rubbing noise. Is there any pulsation in the pedal which indicates runout of the rotor? That could be enough to cause rubbing once per wheel revolution at the high point. The factory runout spec is pretty tight at 0.1 mm or .004". This can be easily checked with a magnetic base dial indicator gauge (if you have one). Some stores will loan them out or maybe you have a friend. If you get runout, don't automatically assume the rotor is bad. There could be a bit of debris or rust under the rotor mounting surface on the face of the hub. Clean it up and remount the rotor and retest runout. Your concern that the noise could be from a metal retainer clip rubbing on the rotor would normally cause a metallic screeching sound rather than the "rubbing" sound you describe. Your rubbing is more likely from pads against the rotor.Those clips would have to be quite a ways out of place to rub on the rotor and you should be able to spot them with a bright flashlight on tight focus. Your step by step procedure looks good, very meticulous and methodical which is good when doing something as critical as brakes. Keep a careful eye on your brake pad wear to be sure inner and outer pads are wearing at about the same rate. Inner pads on Fit's typically wear faster but if the friction points on the pad ears are lubed with silicone brake grease properly, this should ensure proper even wear. It is easy enough to swing the caliper up out of the way to clean and lube the retainer clips in 10K (or so) miles. Few owners or shops bother with this but it can help. In areas where roads are heavily treated with salt in the winter rotors suffer badly. Salt water on hot steel is never a good thing. As a previous poster said, different pad types wear in at different rates. Aftermarket ceramic pads take longer than softer factory pads.
 

Last edited by KwazyKwaig; 04-22-2019 at 11:59 PM.
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