i know that thats why i said trade for a manuel :popc:

 

Good choice not goin' with the EP3.

Now, you just need the 5spd!

 

im getting the airbag recall work done tomorrow, so i'll talk with the guy who sold me the car......see if he can pull any strings.. i doubt it but you never know

 

EP3 Hatch SI's are heavier than the RSX Type S

SO even after swapping out the K20A3 for the K20A2 powerplant, it will be slower than a stock Rsx Type S.

EP3's were the worst Honda SI that "Honda of Amrica" ever gave us. It was like a slap in the face...... If they gave us the EP3 JDM Type-R Version with suspension and powertrain, THEN WE'RE TALKING..... but they didn't.......

EP3 VS FIT,

THE FIT IS GO!!

And after you swap a K20A2 into a FIT!! .....Well I can tell you a thing or two about that! It will KILL both RSX Type S and JDM EP3 Type R! WIth the USDM EP3 on the sidelines waving as we all fly by!

 

don't you mean the EDM type R?;)

it didnt' get exported to japan until the last 2 years of production i think.


i don't think it was a 'slap in the face' especially if you consider that

a. honda has NEVER been good about giving us something on par with what they offer in europe or japan

and

b. while it didn't make as much hp per liter, the ep3 was more solid, comfortable and has a much nicer interior than the previous gen si. (which looked like a regular coupe on the inside if it were not for the 'si' written on the gauges. at least with the ep3, you knew you were in something different.)

 

Yes something different alright, but not worthy of the SI badge.


And NO, the EDM Type R was the K20A2 engine (200hp rsx typs-s engine), the JDM EP3 Type R had the K20A 220hp powerplant different gearing and LSD.

And yes the EP3 looked fast, felt nice, But wasn't what people came to expect from the Honda "SI".

All previous SI's were a better than stock Civic, an upgrade from a regular civic. This EP3 made people think, "WOW this SI thing stands out alone on it's own to be something interesting"....... But the let down was it's lack of "GO".

I would have rather had a 01-05 civic Coupe with a touch better suspension (bars at least) and the K20A3 in there! That would have been a better badged SI in my opinion. Or they could have had a Base EP3, and a Type R EP3, BUT NOOOO......

The '99-'00 Civic SI coupe woud have beat up on EP3 SI anyday.

It is true, Honda must still be mad at America after all these years..... THat's why us americans must make our own Honda's the way we like them!

Althought still Not TYPE R, at least the NEW 06-08 Civic SI is back on track! Great car! Great power, and Great upgrade from a regular Civic.

 

Get your facts straight.

RSX Type-S: Curb Weight: 2840 lbs.
Civic Si (EP3): Curb Weight: 2782 lbs.

The EP3 Civic's chassis was also 90% stiffer than that of the previous Si.

 

"Motor Trend.com"


2006 RSX Type -S : K20A2 (2840 lbs. curb weight)

2005 Civic SI with the K20A3 (2877 lbs curb weight)

2006 RSX Base with the K20A3 (2734 lbs. curb weight)

2840 is stll less than 2877 last I checked......

The CIvic SI is the heaviest of the bunch!

 

Well that's why... Try another source for your info. In my original reply, that shows Edmunds.com

car and driver:

EP3: Curb weight 2750 lb
RSX: Curb weight: 2848 lb

sports compact car:

EP3: Curb Weight : 2744 lbs

etc. etc...

In the BMI challenge, the had the Accord Euro-R (CL7), Integra Type-R (DC5) and Civic Type-R (EP3) run a couple laps. All of them had the same K20A engine. The EP3 was quicker off the line and out of corners than either of the other two cars because of the weight difference.

 

you guys are putting out alot of good info......in any case the fit w/ k20 (w/ obvious suspension upgrades) would have a good go vs those.....

oh and while at the dealership i talked about my auto for 5spd...they said the best way for me the get the most of my money would be to trade it in for an 08....since the used 07' i'd have to pay tax, other misc fees. so if that is the case.....my 07 auto is staying.......i can use all that wasted money in fees and taxes in some nice parts

 

the kraftwerks supercharger would be nice :cool:

 

We don't have the EP3 Type R here in the US AND the EP3 type R is 1210kg, and the Integra Type R is 1180kg. Still lighter. Go back and watch that video again. We are comparing cars he can buy here! The EP3 is nice, but still not worth it in the long run in comparison to the Fit swapped, or a stock RSX-S. Power to weight ratio of the EP3 - Sad!

That plus edmunds is a website. MotorTrend is a magazine that does extensive testing and actual weighing.

 

Good choice on the FIT! And there's always the option of turning your A/T into a 5sp! PM ME I have Most of the parts you would need!

 

Last year at an SCCA function, I ran circles around a couple lightly tuned EPs all day. Even a scion Xb with suspension mods were running better times.

 

Car and Driver is a magazine that does extensive testing too ;)

the weights from car and driver, edmunds, sports compact car, and i'm sure any other source all show the EP3 USDM civic Si as lighter than the USDM DC5. i think motortend may have had a typo or something.

i guess we can agree to disagree. :)

 

i still have my Ep3 and loved fixing it up, but now i have a fit and everything else is just better( gas, new, sexier ) . fit > ep3

 

sometimes it has more to do with the driver than the car.;)

 

motortrend has been regarded as a total joke amoungst the automotive press.

edmunds does an EXHAUSTIVE amount of research into their stuff and articles and is just worlds better than anything you find in motortrend, which has been known to misprint things frequently.


anywho, regardless if we have an ep3 type r here or not, the usdm version still only weighs the orginal 2744 lbs quoted, and i confirmed it going to different websites. (obviously NOT MT.) and if we are comparing cars we can get here, why bother with the weights of any type r?

as far as it being 'worth it' in the long run, some people would disagree with you.

its easier to buy a used 12k ep3 and get a plug and play k20a2 rather than all the modifying that it takes to shoehorn this into the fit. you have eloquently proven that it can be done, but it is no where near as easy. that ease of installation may be worth it more for some people. i don't doubt our gd3's chassis, but the ep3 really deserves some respect. (because while we got an only 'ok' version here, there is a version of it that exists that is a million times better....something that can be said of ALL of hondas sport compacts.)


as far as the superiority of the 99-2000 'em1' si, yes, the ep3 had worlds better seats and interior, and despite its poor power to weight ratio, it ran 0-60 in only a fraction of a second less than the em1. that, my friend, is FACT. us honda guys are not used to it, but its a little thing called 'torque'.

 

Oh i've been used to Honda Torque! for Many years. (full gutted eg hatch h22a drag car, '94 NSX I/H/E, S2000 stock, and of couse my Fit K20A2) I've experienced as a mechanic Honda's greatest torque and honda's lowest torque. Honda's greatest factory HP, and custom swaps. The EP3 Hatch has 130 hp to the wheels 112ft lbs of torque to the wheels! I don't know where you are going with that......


I Think some people are just used to a certain model year of EP3. There are heavier EP3's than RSX's out there. And here is your Car and Driver to Prove it, if you don't like Motor Trend.

ALL WEIGHTS ASIDE, Power to Weight Ratio is utmost important, and the EP3 was a SLAP in the FACE from Honda. PERIOD.!

"Car and Driver"

Here is Car and driver for you. (Click the links under each specs to go to the web site.)

Car and Driver
Acura RSX Type-S
Vehicle type: front-engine, front-wheel-drive, 2+2-passenger, 3-door coupe
Price as tested: $29,030 (base price: $29,030)
Engine type: DOHC 16-valve 4-in-line, aluminum block and head, Honda PGM-FI engine-control system with port fuel injection
Displacement 122 cu in, 1998cc
Power (SAE net) 200 bhp @ 7400 rpm
Torque (SAE net) 142 lb-ft @ 6000 rpm
Transmission 6-speed manual
Wheelbase 101.2 in
Length 172.8 in
Curb weight 2736 lb

Link Below to above:

Acura RSX Type-S Factory Performance - - Car and Driver - December 2002



Honda Civic SI

Base price: $19,460
Vehicle type: front-engine, front-drive; 3-door 5-passenger wagon
Interior volume, F/R/cargo (cu ft) 49/36/16
Wheelbase 101.2 in
Length/width/height 165.6/66.7/56.7 in
Turning circle 34.8 ft
Curb weight 2750 lb

Link below to above

HONDA CIVIC Si - Flash Cards - Car and Driver January 2003


Power to Weight Ratio is utmost important, And for that even putting in a K20A2 engine which is slightly heavier with the 6sp transmission is a waste of time and money. You might as well go buy a stock RSX-S and save Money and be faster, better handling b/ of better weight distribution, and a ton of more room under the hood for upgrades like Forced induction. If you want to be really quick with a K20A2 engine swap, Put it in anything else but the EP3!

 

You can hold a grudge against the EP3 all you want, or find select website that work in favor of your argument.
here is another car and driver webpage. the weights of both of these cars are very inconsistant, but 99 times out of 100, they show the EP3 and lighter weight than the DC5.
Acura RSX Type-S - - Car and Driver - January 2005

Vehicle type: front-engine, front-wheel-drive, 4-passenger, 3-door coupe
Price as tested: $24,140 (base price: $24,140)
Engine type: DOHC 16-valve inline-4, aluminum block and head, port fuel injection
Displacement: 122 cu in, 1998cc
Power (SAE net): 210 bhp @ 7800 rpm
Torque (SAE net): 143 lb-ft @ 7000 rpm
Transmission: 6-speed manual
Wheelbase: 101.2 in
Length/width/height: 172.4/67.9/54.9 in
Curb weight: 2848 lb
Zero to 60 mph: 6.2 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 16.6 sec
Street start, 5-60 mph: 6.9 sec
Standing 1/4-mile: 14.9 sec @ 95 mph
Top speed (drag limited): 136 mph
Braking, 70-0 mph: 181 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad: 0.86 g
EPA fuel economy, city driving: 23 mpg
C/D-observed fuel economy: 22 mpg