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Ticketed

  #1  
Old 02-26-2013, 01:58 PM
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Ticketed

Basically, in Dec 2010 I got a speeding ticket. I plead not guilty and prepared myself to go to court and fight it (got evidence, pics etc). Anyway, my court date kept getting pushed back and rescheduled by the DMV, 3 times to be exact. On the date when it was supposed to be held, Nov. 2012, Hurricane Sandy came by and flooded the DMV a week before my scheduled hearing. So then I received another notice my date was pushed back to Sept 2013. By that time, the hearing would be almost 3 years since the date the ticket was issued.

Question is, can I get the judge to dismiss based on the fact it was so long ago? Say the cop does show up, how will he even tell his side of the story, would he even remember or have kept records for that long? Can I use the fact it was so long ago to question his recollection of events? Do you think he would even show up if it was that long ago?

Anyone else in this situation? BTW, im in NYC so everything is handled by the TVB, which means no plea bargaining or point reduction, etc.
 
  #2  
Old 02-26-2013, 02:27 PM
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..interesting...
 

Last edited by phenoyz; 02-26-2013 at 09:13 PM.
  #3  
Old 02-26-2013, 04:21 PM
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Originally Posted by sy_edison View Post
Basically, in Dec 2010 I got a speeding ticket. I plead not guilty and prepared myself to go to court and fight it (got evidence, pics etc). Anyway, my court date kept getting pushed back and rescheduled by the DMV, 3 times to be exact. On the date when it was supposed to be held, Nov. 2012, Hurricane Sandy came by and flooded the DMV a week before my scheduled hearing. So then I received another notice my date was pushed back to Sept 2013. By that time, the hearing would be almost 3 years since the date the ticket was issued.

Question is, can I get the judge to dismiss based on the fact it was so long ago? Say the cop does show up, how will he even tell his side of the story, would he even remember or have kept records for that long? Can I use the fact it was so long ago to question his recollection of events? Do you think he would even show up if it was that long ago?

Anyone else in this situation? BTW, im in NYC so everything is handled by the TVB, which means no plea bargaining or point reduction, etc.
How strong is your evidence? If you had gone to court a week after the ticket, would your evidence have PROVED that you were innocent (and the cop was lying)?

"Innocent until proven guilty" doesn't really work in traffic court. Any judge is going to assume that his county does not pay cops to pick on innocent people and lie in court. If you think that your evidence was strong enough to prove your case right after you got the ticket, the wasted time since then might help even more to get you off. Just be sure to never show any attitude toward the judge or the cop, and speak clearly and respectfully.

In the "Off Topic" forum I described how I was arrested for speeding and for two gun violation charges. It took six months and six pretrial hearings, but my efforts resulted in all charges being dropped and my arrest record being expunged. And I didn't have the effects of Hurricane Sandy to help me.

After all of this time and all of the damage from the storm, the cop who ticketed you probably won't show up. But, you had still better be very ready to prove your case to a doubtful judge.
 
  #4  
Old 02-26-2013, 04:21 PM
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Looks like you can try to file a motion to dismiss on the basis of your right to a speedy trial, but it may not work. Did you send anything back or sign anything agreeing to the new court dates?

New York Speedy Trial

In many New York traffic courts it is taking up to a year for your New York speeding ticket trial to be scheduled. New York traffic judges normally rule that the right to a speedy trial does not apply to traffic infractions. If you do not object to your trial date you are considered to have waived your right to a speedy trial. If you want to assert this right you must timely file an objection with the court.

In People v Thorpe, 160 Misc.2d 558; 613 N.Y.S.2d 795 (1994), the Supreme Court, Appellate Term, Second Department, unequivocally stated:

“In answer to the defendant’s assertion in his affidavit of errors that his constitutional right to a speedy trial had been violated, the return of the court merely asserted that the right to a speedy trial did not apply to a traffic violation. This assertion is incorrect, since the constitutional right to a speedy trial applies to all prosecutions (People v Wertheimer, NYLJ, June 5, 1986 at 15, col 5 [App. Term, 2d & 11th Jud Dists]).” See also People v. Matera, 2003 WL 21974065 (N.Y.Sup.App.Term), 2003 N.Y. Slip Op. 51180(U)(unexplained delay of over two years in bringing traffic infraction to trial warranted dismissal); People v. Rogoish, 2003 WL 21700087 (N.Y.Sup.App.Term), 2003 N.Y. Slip Op. 51120(U)(unexplained delay of over three years in bringing the traffic infraction to trial warranted dismissal)

Statute of Limitations On A New York Speeding Ticket
 
  #5  
Old 02-26-2013, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Triskelion View Post
How strong is your evidence? If you had gone to court a week after the ticket, would your evidence have PROVED that you were innocent (and the cop was lying)?

"Innocent until proven guilty" doesn't really work in traffic court. Any judge is going to assume that his county does not pay cops to pick on innocent people and lie in court. If you think that your evidence was strong enough to prove your case right after you got the ticket, the wasted time since then might help even more to get you off. Just be sure to never show any attitude toward the judge or the cop, and speak clearly and respectfully.

In the "Off Topic" forum I described how I was arrested for speeding and for two gun violation charges. It took six months and six pretrial hearings, but my efforts resulted in all charges being dropped and my arrest record being expunged. And I didn't have the effects of Hurricane Sandy to help me.

After all of this time and all of the damage from the storm, the cop who ticketed you probably won't show up. But, you had still better be very ready to prove your case to a doubtful judge.
Thanks for the reply. As for evidence, unfortunately it will probably be a my word against his situation. What basically happened is this: I was driving down the parkway within speed limits and in heavy traffic due to rush hour and all the cars trying to get off a particular exit ramp. Once I passed that exit with the jam it clears up and people are picking up speed again. I guess from all that waiting people are antsy to get going so they pick up lots of speed to try to make up time or whatever. As you can imagine there are a whole bunch of cars zooming around. Anyway, 3 miles up the road and about 2 exits later I get pulled over saying I was clocked speeding a bit past that that ramp. Of course I say I was not speeding ( and I wasn't ) and i'm pretty sure the cop mixed up my car with another. Back then I had a 4d sedan, white, a common color and car. Next day, I figure that they had one guy up on an overpass near the ramp shooting laser down on traffic and he radios another guy to intercept. In terms of hard evidence I suppose I don't have it, except for the fact that his violation location was at the exit but our pull over stop was 3 miles further along. Also the same story and pictures documenting the situation with traffic and such. But I plead not guilty since I wasn't doing what they accuse me of doing.
 
  #6  
Old 02-26-2013, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Wanderer. View Post
Looks like you can try to file a motion to dismiss on the basis of your right to a speedy trial, but it may not work. Did you send anything back or sign anything agreeing to the new court dates?

New York Speedy Trial

In many New York traffic courts it is taking up to a year for your New York speeding ticket trial to be scheduled. New York traffic judges normally rule that the right to a speedy trial does not apply to traffic infractions. If you do not object to your trial date you are considered to have waived your right to a speedy trial. If you want to assert this right you must timely file an objection with the court.

In People v Thorpe, 160 Misc.2d 558; 613 N.Y.S.2d 795 (1994), the Supreme Court, Appellate Term, Second Department, unequivocally stated:

“In answer to the defendant’s assertion in his affidavit of errors that his constitutional right to a speedy trial had been violated, the return of the court merely asserted that the right to a speedy trial did not apply to a traffic violation. This assertion is incorrect, since the constitutional right to a speedy trial applies to all prosecutions (People v Wertheimer, NYLJ, June 5, 1986 at 15, col 5 [App. Term, 2d & 11th Jud Dists]).” See also People v. Matera, 2003 WL 21974065 (N.Y.Sup.App.Term), 2003 N.Y. Slip Op. 51180(U)(unexplained delay of over two years in bringing traffic infraction to trial warranted dismissal); People v. Rogoish, 2003 WL 21700087 (N.Y.Sup.App.Term), 2003 N.Y. Slip Op. 51120(U)(unexplained delay of over three years in bringing the traffic infraction to trial warranted dismissal)

Statute of Limitations On A New York Speeding Ticket
Thanks for the research Wanderer. No I did not file a motion right away for a speedy trial, I also didn't sign or send anything back agreeing to the new dates. However since I didn't object right away, I guess I am SOL.
 
  #7  
Old 02-26-2013, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by sy_edison View Post
Thanks for the research Wanderer. No I did not file a motion right away for a speedy trial, I also didn't sign or send anything back agreeing to the new dates. However since I didn't object right away, I guess I am SOL.
I will bet that every suspect in every crime who is awaiting trial is trying to get a reduction or some benefit from the "speedy trial" situation. I will also bet that all judges and all cops and DA's who keep hearing that objection are getting more pissed off by the day. You would be better off not adding to that.

And, without absolute proof that your cop was wrong, you probably can't win in court. But it is still worth a try. If you are lucky, everybody else that comes before the judge ahead of you will be rude and stupid insisting that "I know my rights!". If you stand there calmly and persuasively suggest that your cop actually targeted a different car than yours but nailed you because of all of the confusion, your being there with a calm, intelligent demeanor after the months of delay (and maybe the cop too busy to show up) you might just win.

The fact that you are there, losing wages to state your case, along with an attitude that is opposite of the people in the dozens of other cases who are shooting off their mouths would probably be refreshing to the judge. GOOD LUCK!!!!!
 

Last edited by Triskelion; 02-26-2013 at 05:48 PM.
  #8  
Old 02-26-2013, 07:23 PM
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Unless it was a huge ticket, I would doubt the officer will even show up.
 
  #9  
Old 02-26-2013, 07:36 PM
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They show up, they have a designated day each month when all their tickets are scheduled.

If you were spotted by another officer overhead, HE'S the one who has to come to court, because otherwise it's hearsay. But only if you object to it, otherwise it's evidence...

You can try to ask the officer to prove he remembers anything from that day, and you can try to get him to put his notes away (they're not evidence unless they're entered into evidence, and they won't do that because that would mean you have the right to examine them).

But you are correct, there are no rights for a defendant in a NYC TVB hearing. On the positive side, I believe that your insurance company may raise your rates for three years, based on a ticket, but it's three years from the violation date, which means even if they know about the ticket there's not much they can do.
 
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Old 02-26-2013, 07:37 PM
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I know A LOT of cops and I've never heard of that.
 
  #11  
Old 02-26-2013, 08:20 PM
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The designated day? That's how it works in NYC, cops write tickets, the city needs the money and they schedule it so they don't miss out on it. I'm surprised that every jurisdiction doesn't work it that way- one day a month or quarter for each officer...
 
  #12  
Old 02-26-2013, 08:44 PM
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Thanks Brian, some info I was not aware of. In the case of insurance, if I am found guilty I will have points applied to the license though right? In NY, I believe the points fall off after 18 months, does that mean those points get applied on the date of violation and even though I am found guilty they will drop immediately since its been more than 18 months since date of violation? Or does that mean they get applied on the date found guilty and drop off 18 months from then? If this is the case, you're saying the ins. company can't do anything even though I just had points applied to my license, is this correct?
 
  #13  
Old 02-26-2013, 09:36 PM
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Not Brian.

Anyway, I don't know how points work, only that the ins companies sometimes raise rates based on a conviction (even if you take the safety class- that gets rid of points but not necessarily the ins surcharge). But I'm reasonably sure that if the conviction is for a long-ago ticket it's hard for them to claim it makes you a worse risk, because the actuarial data typically goes back only three years (or at least that's the way it used to work).
 
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Old 02-27-2013, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by sy_edison View Post
..... In NY, I believe the points fall off after 18 months, does that mean those points get applied on the date of violation and even though I am found guilty they will drop immediately since its been more than 18 months since date of violation?
Not sure in this case (since you're past the 18 months) but that's how it normally is (from date of infraction). BUT, it will affect/stay on your insurance record for 36 months.

Originally Posted by Brain Champagne View Post
They show up, they have a designated day each month when all their tickets are scheduled.

You're also guilty before proven innocent in TVB in NY...

Which highway were you on when you got the ticket?
 

Last edited by FitStir; 02-27-2013 at 10:36 AM.
  #15  
Old 02-27-2013, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by FitStir View Post
Not sure in this case (since you're past the 18 months) but that's how it normally is (from date of infraction). BUT, it will affect/stay on your insurance record for 36 months.
well as long as its from the date of infraction, it would fall off within a few weeks after the hearing date, that wouldn't be too bad.

Originally Posted by FitStir View Post

You're also guilty before proven innocent in TVB in NY...
Yeah, in a lot of cases I feel some of that has to do with the city needing money more than the police trying to keep people safe. Its worse in Manhattan, you see meter maids in full force, you can't even try to get a parking slip before they try to give you a ticket.

Originally Posted by FitStir View Post
Which highway were you on when you got the ticket?
Belt Parkway.
 
  #16  
Old 02-28-2013, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by sy_edison View Post
Yeah, in a lot of cases I feel some of that has to do with the city needing money more than the police trying to keep people safe. Its worse in Manhattan, you see meter maids in full force, you can't even try to get a parking slip before they try to give you a ticket.
I noticed that shortly after 9-11... Had to go to a TVB, and all 20+ people before me were guilty... even the ones with lawyers... :rotfl:

I've heard of them scanning on overpasses... seen them upstate...
I've even seen the metermaids in Manhattan around those high traffic gridlock intersections hiding behing the corners, or in building doorways waiting for someone to block the box.... they just run out with their scanners, and zap em, and give them the little receipt tickets...
 

Last edited by FitStir; 02-28-2013 at 10:20 AM.
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Old 02-28-2013, 11:11 AM
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belt parkway and it's surrounding streets in Brooklyn is pretty nasty of traps. on long streets in that area they put up traps, they shoot you down with a radar and radios it on the next stop light.
 
  #18  
Old 02-28-2013, 12:18 PM
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Yah, that Belt-Southern State pkwy stretch is full...
Probably cause it was on the news (heavily publicized) last yr or the year before, about it having the most accidents/fatalities.

Must be the twisties..... ?

Just this past weekend within 40 miles I saw about 15-20 cars pulled over....
 
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