DIY on Installing Xenith Xenons HID Kits
#201
07-30-2010, 01:48 PM
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Irvine, California
Posts: 270
I just picked up my XX HID kit 6k heads with 3k fogs, and i'm super excited to make this my first project to do up north in san jose. Also gonna add the yellow film from koolkev and knock it all out at the same time with the DIY independant fogs too. I love this site lol.
Big thanks to George from Xenith Xenons for meeting me to pick up my HID's
Any Fitfreakers in San Jose area that I can meet and network with PM me
Big thanks to George from Xenith Xenons for meeting me to pick up my HID's
Any Fitfreakers in San Jose area that I can meet and network with PM me
#202
07-30-2010, 04:35 PM
I am editing this, only to say... I'm done with this thread... I hope I don't reply to other similar threads with similar fanatics. good grief. read on if you want... but don't expect a response from me here.
You're supposed to re-aim your headlights even when you replace your bulbs with halogens.
What's your point?
What part about my post mentioned about being "cool"?
The thing I've noticed about "glare" is that it gets most of its intensity from "leaking" light.
First, I want to mention...
Anyone who believes this is clearly mistaken.
An H4/9003/HB2 housing does not reflect light in that manner. It's an INVERSE reflector.
What does that mean? whatever light the bulb puts upwards, the reflector shines DOWN. And whatever bulb it puts down, the reflector shines UP.
This poster's argument is about placement... what is to stop a HID BULB from being placed in the same spot? The person says it can't be done... why? All this person sounds like is some one regurgitating words used elsewhere. As for "DanielStern"... he's a seller of halogen based equipment. He may have worked at the NHTSA, but it doesn't mean he couldn't be biased.
What's this stupid as argument about bulb vs capsule... a bulb is reference to the glass shape itself, not the filament. The HID capsule is still a bulb around the light source.
Going back to the current argument, to get upward glare with low beam, you have to have one of three things... (downward "glare" is the headlight beam itself)
1) light shining off an un-intended reflective surface that isn't part of the reflector itself. I'm actually getting this a bit with halogens in my new housing, but I've since re-aimed my lights, that un-intended reflection only goes off to one side and you'll only see it for a moment.
2) light is shining off the upper reflector. This happens if your source is too far to the back. Because of the parabolic nature of the reflector, moving it closer to the back widens the beam. Since it's supposed to be inverted in the first place, it now straightens out and you get more light going upwards from the low beam filament.
3) light is shining off the lower reflector. The lower reflector is reserved for the high beam pattern. If there is no shield around the bulb preventing light from shining onto the lower portion, then you will get light shining up. And this is what happened with my 3rd kit, the two shields (outer silvery one and inner black one) didn't line up to block all the light from going down.
When I talk about clean cutoffs, there's no direct light from the bulb on the lower reflector. If fact, if you look closely at your standard H4 headlamp from the side, you might be able to see a dark spot on it (in the Pathfinder, there is a clear dark spot on the lower part of the clear plastic/glass with only low beam on). There's no need to force the beam lower than it should.
It SHOULD look like:
You see the line that goes from left to right and then angles up? That was the pattern I got with my HID kit in the Pathfinder.
Some of you folks REALLY need to get off your soapbox and do some testing of your own. I mean, go out there try a few different brands (hopefully, run across a few that gave good cutoffs like mine) and THEN judge it. The majority of the posts I read from these fanatics do not seem like they have any direct experience with installing/using/testing them... just the experience from being blinded by the BAD installs. Which of course plague OEM HIDs and halogens alike.
Here's the thing with HID's...they produce glare at other drivers, it's not about being cool with retrofitted projectors, it's about safety of other drivers. If you have to re-aim the light output on halogen headlamps, then what's the point in getting HID's?
edit - wrong word usage
edit - wrong word usage
What's your point?
What part about my post mentioned about being "cool"?
The thing I've noticed about "glare" is that it gets most of its intensity from "leaking" light.
First, I want to mention...
I agree with this wholeheartedly. There is no safe way to retrofit HID lighting into headlamps that were meant for halogen bulbs. None whatsoever.
Why is this? First, you have to understand how a reflector headlamp like the one in the Fit works.
Notice how the light is collected off different facets of the reflector to form a beam pattern. These facets aren't created randomly. Computer aided design is used to map out these points according to certain mathematical formulas. In short, everything that a reflector does is based upon the specific position of the light source down to the millimeter. Need proof? Here is a paper that details the whole industrial design process for an automotive headlamp.
What happens then when you switch out the bulb that was specified to be used in a headlamp with an HID burner* ? You change the position of the light source within the headlamp. All those CAD calculations that were done in the headlamp design process are now incorrect. The headlamp no longer has a coherent beam pattern. Light can now reflect off the reflector in any number of ways. You get hot spots, dim spots, and the most dangerous, stray light glaring other drivers. This can't be fixed as the HID burner will always be in the wrong position relative to the halogen bulb it replaced.
You might not think that a small amount of glare would be that much of an issue but consider that a D2S HID burner emits more than twice the amount of light than an H4 halogen bulb does on its high beam setting. Remember the last time you encountered someone who left their brights on and how annoying that was? Using an HID kit is like that but even worse to other drivers due to that light intensity.
When it comes to headlamps, optics trumps everything else. You can have a great light source, but if it isn't in focus, what is the point? Light all over the place isn't going to help you see better down the road. You need to have the right optics to take advantage of all that light.
If you need more information, take the time to read this link. Keep in mind that this guy has worked with the NHTSA (link) and thus is in a better position to determine what is safe and what is not than someone trying to make a buck selling HID kits.
*HID lights don't use a wire filament to emit light so it is incorrect to call them bulbs.
Why is this? First, you have to understand how a reflector headlamp like the one in the Fit works.
Notice how the light is collected off different facets of the reflector to form a beam pattern. These facets aren't created randomly. Computer aided design is used to map out these points according to certain mathematical formulas. In short, everything that a reflector does is based upon the specific position of the light source down to the millimeter. Need proof? Here is a paper that details the whole industrial design process for an automotive headlamp.
What happens then when you switch out the bulb that was specified to be used in a headlamp with an HID burner* ? You change the position of the light source within the headlamp. All those CAD calculations that were done in the headlamp design process are now incorrect. The headlamp no longer has a coherent beam pattern. Light can now reflect off the reflector in any number of ways. You get hot spots, dim spots, and the most dangerous, stray light glaring other drivers. This can't be fixed as the HID burner will always be in the wrong position relative to the halogen bulb it replaced.
You might not think that a small amount of glare would be that much of an issue but consider that a D2S HID burner emits more than twice the amount of light than an H4 halogen bulb does on its high beam setting. Remember the last time you encountered someone who left their brights on and how annoying that was? Using an HID kit is like that but even worse to other drivers due to that light intensity.
When it comes to headlamps, optics trumps everything else. You can have a great light source, but if it isn't in focus, what is the point? Light all over the place isn't going to help you see better down the road. You need to have the right optics to take advantage of all that light.
If you need more information, take the time to read this link. Keep in mind that this guy has worked with the NHTSA (link) and thus is in a better position to determine what is safe and what is not than someone trying to make a buck selling HID kits.
*HID lights don't use a wire filament to emit light so it is incorrect to call them bulbs.
An H4/9003/HB2 housing does not reflect light in that manner. It's an INVERSE reflector.
What does that mean? whatever light the bulb puts upwards, the reflector shines DOWN. And whatever bulb it puts down, the reflector shines UP.
This poster's argument is about placement... what is to stop a HID BULB from being placed in the same spot? The person says it can't be done... why? All this person sounds like is some one regurgitating words used elsewhere. As for "DanielStern"... he's a seller of halogen based equipment. He may have worked at the NHTSA, but it doesn't mean he couldn't be biased.
What's this stupid as argument about bulb vs capsule... a bulb is reference to the glass shape itself, not the filament. The HID capsule is still a bulb around the light source.
Going back to the current argument, to get upward glare with low beam, you have to have one of three things... (downward "glare" is the headlight beam itself)
1) light shining off an un-intended reflective surface that isn't part of the reflector itself. I'm actually getting this a bit with halogens in my new housing, but I've since re-aimed my lights, that un-intended reflection only goes off to one side and you'll only see it for a moment.
2) light is shining off the upper reflector. This happens if your source is too far to the back. Because of the parabolic nature of the reflector, moving it closer to the back widens the beam. Since it's supposed to be inverted in the first place, it now straightens out and you get more light going upwards from the low beam filament.
3) light is shining off the lower reflector. The lower reflector is reserved for the high beam pattern. If there is no shield around the bulb preventing light from shining onto the lower portion, then you will get light shining up. And this is what happened with my 3rd kit, the two shields (outer silvery one and inner black one) didn't line up to block all the light from going down.
When I talk about clean cutoffs, there's no direct light from the bulb on the lower reflector. If fact, if you look closely at your standard H4 headlamp from the side, you might be able to see a dark spot on it (in the Pathfinder, there is a clear dark spot on the lower part of the clear plastic/glass with only low beam on). There's no need to force the beam lower than it should.
It SHOULD look like:
You see the line that goes from left to right and then angles up? That was the pattern I got with my HID kit in the Pathfinder.
Some of you folks REALLY need to get off your soapbox and do some testing of your own. I mean, go out there try a few different brands (hopefully, run across a few that gave good cutoffs like mine) and THEN judge it. The majority of the posts I read from these fanatics do not seem like they have any direct experience with installing/using/testing them... just the experience from being blinded by the BAD installs. Which of course plague OEM HIDs and halogens alike.
Last edited by Goobers; 07-30-2010 at 04:46 PM.
#203
08-11-2010, 08:49 PM
I finished the install. had a little snafu with the lights but I think it was something I did, but regardless I got it to work. All the mounting places are right on, but my brackets didn't cooperate as easy and needed a little bending and also think my bolts and nuts might have been different because they only worked with the nut on them. they didn't fit as oem honda bolts do and just screw right into the holes.
I'll take some pics tonight and see how they turn out as far as color and cutoff.
I'll take some pics tonight and see how they turn out as far as color and cutoff.
#204
08-12-2010, 04:18 AM
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Irvine, California
Posts: 270
I finished the install. had a little snafu with the lights but I think it was something I did, but regardless I got it to work. All the mounting places are right on, but my brackets didn't cooperate as easy and needed a little bending and also think my bolts and nuts might have been different because they only worked with the nut on them. they didn't fit as oem honda bolts do and just screw right into the holes.
I'll take some pics tonight and see how they turn out as far as color and cutoff.
I'll take some pics tonight and see how they turn out as far as color and cutoff.
Looking forward to some pictures
#205
08-12-2010, 11:19 AM
I didn't have a chance to put my car 25 feet from a wall but standing 25 feet away from the car and i was only lit up from the waist down, and in the picture you can see the car on the left is not lit up above the wheel well
#208
08-12-2010, 03:44 PM
If your bulb is straight up or straight down, check to see if the bulb is in the socket correctly. Putting it in wrong will do exactly what you are describing.
You NEED to find a wall. And the ground has to be flat. It doesn't need to be level, but so long as your car moves in a straight line (hence flat) should be fine.
Pull up as close to the wall as possible. Mark where the cut off is. Then pull slowly back the car up. At about 25 ft away, that cutoff should be BELOW the mark on the wall by about 2".
If you don't have a definite STRAIGHT line of dark above and light below... that's no good. Because if you aim the headlights the way you should, you'll be blinding people. If you aim it down, so as not to blind people, then you're losing forward light.
If the dark part isn't like RCNTYPE's picture, return the product and look for another kit. Try Xentec... well, no, the Xentec I got gave a really good cut off, but the ballast went out and then a bulb went out a bit too soon. Supposedly, I had two JLM branded kits, but I think the seller mix had bulbs mixed in from some other brand in the first kit, which had good cut off too. The one that I'm fairly confident is actually JLM, didn't have a good cutoff.
I can only hope you care enough to follow my suggestions... because if you don't, then I can only hope I never cross your path (at least your headlights).
#209
08-12-2010, 11:23 PM
I appreciate your suggestions and info. I haven't adjusted my headlights at all it is still at factory settings and as far as the upward light there are a lot of lights in my complex and when i stood where an oncoming car would be coming from, i had to practically get as low as my lights to get a "hey your brights are on" feel. so I'll try to find a good area that is dark and can get a good pic but I'm not worried about returning my lights. I've had my hid's on my element for 3 years and haven't gotten a flash from oncoming cars and IMO those lights are higher and more "blinding" than my fit's hid's.
I'll see what I can come up with for a dark alley
I'll see what I can come up with for a dark alley
#210
09-07-2010, 12:41 PM
I'm a little sad about my kits. I bought 2, both not very old. Both dead. One bulb went out on my low beam, got a ticket. Then my barely a year old hid fog kit went out. Sadly and ironically both the 1 year warranties were expired causing me to be ineligible for any repair/replacement.
On a side note, I also paid 140+ for my first gen kit, and 120+ for my 2nd gen kit. A little disappointed at how quickly the kits came apart in correlation to how much I paid. And no I did not lay finger prints on the bulbs and yes I installed them properly, including removing the bumper and headlights.
On a side note, I also paid 140+ for my first gen kit, and 120+ for my 2nd gen kit. A little disappointed at how quickly the kits came apart in correlation to how much I paid. And no I did not lay finger prints on the bulbs and yes I installed them properly, including removing the bumper and headlights.
#211
09-07-2010, 02:03 PM
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Irvine, California
Posts: 270
I'm a little sad about my kits. I bought 2, both not very old. Both dead. One bulb went out on my low beam, got a ticket. Then my barely a year old hid fog kit went out. Sadly and ironically both the 1 year warranties were expired causing me to be ineligible for any repair/replacement.
On a side note, I also paid 140+ for my first gen kit, and 120+ for my 2nd gen kit. A little disappointed at how quickly the kits came apart in correlation to how much I paid. And no I did not lay finger prints on the bulbs and yes I installed them properly, including removing the bumper and headlights.
On a side note, I also paid 140+ for my first gen kit, and 120+ for my 2nd gen kit. A little disappointed at how quickly the kits came apart in correlation to how much I paid. And no I did not lay finger prints on the bulbs and yes I installed them properly, including removing the bumper and headlights.
#212
12-23-2010, 10:43 PM
not sure if this is the best place to ask this question, but i didn't want to start another thread. I also know that this is the DIY for xenith xenons but maybe someone could help me anyways.
I just got my HID projector kit. I plan on doing my own retrofit. The actual headlight retrofitting isn't what scares me, its the wiring. I took a look at the wiring harness and from reading this tutorial, I still don't know where one plug goes.
(it may be a super stupid question that I will figure out once i start the process but I like to know and research things ahead of time so I don't go into things blind)
I have all the other ones labelled, but can anyone tell me where the 3 prong plug goes?
Looks like this up close:
The kit that I got is a bi-xenon projector with angel eyes around the projector if it makes a difference.
thanks in advance guys!
I just got my HID projector kit. I plan on doing my own retrofit. The actual headlight retrofitting isn't what scares me, its the wiring. I took a look at the wiring harness and from reading this tutorial, I still don't know where one plug goes.
(it may be a super stupid question that I will figure out once i start the process but I like to know and research things ahead of time so I don't go into things blind)
I have all the other ones labelled, but can anyone tell me where the 3 prong plug goes?
Looks like this up close:
The kit that I got is a bi-xenon projector with angel eyes around the projector if it makes a difference.
thanks in advance guys!
#213
12-24-2010, 12:47 AM
not sure if this is the best place to ask this question, but i didn't want to start another thread. I also know that this is the DIY for xenith xenons but maybe someone could help me anyways.
I just got my HID projector kit. I plan on doing my own retrofit. The actual headlight retrofitting isn't what scares me, its the wiring. I took a look at the wiring harness and from reading this tutorial, I still don't know where one plug goes.
(it may be a super stupid question that I will figure out once i start the process but I like to know and research things ahead of time so I don't go into things blind)
I have all the other ones labelled, but can anyone tell me where the 3 prong plug goes?
Looks like this up close:
The kit that I got is a bi-xenon projector with angel eyes around the projector if it makes a difference.
thanks in advance guys!
I just got my HID projector kit. I plan on doing my own retrofit. The actual headlight retrofitting isn't what scares me, its the wiring. I took a look at the wiring harness and from reading this tutorial, I still don't know where one plug goes.
(it may be a super stupid question that I will figure out once i start the process but I like to know and research things ahead of time so I don't go into things blind)
I have all the other ones labelled, but can anyone tell me where the 3 prong plug goes?
Looks like this up close:
The kit that I got is a bi-xenon projector with angel eyes around the projector if it makes a difference.
thanks in advance guys!
What type of projector are you using? The bi-zenon uses a relay and an actuator to flip the cut-off shield out of the way to engage the high beam setting. Do you have all these pieces? It requires that you have all these peices that match and work together properly and don't overload the factory wiring. Are you wiring this directly to the battery? You should. The wiring for the Fit is designed for a halogen bulb, and a bi-zenon set-up pulls more amperage than the stock system. You MIGHT not have any issues, but why risk it.
#215
12-24-2010, 04:30 PM
I am editing this, only to say... I'm done with this thread... I hope I don't reply to other similar threads with similar fanatics. good grief. read on if you want... but don't expect a response from me here.
You're supposed to re-aim your headlights even when you replace your bulbs with halogens.
What's your point?
What part about my post mentioned about being "cool"?
The thing I've noticed about "glare" is that it gets most of its intensity from "leaking" light.
First, I want to mention...
Anyone who believes this is clearly mistaken.
An H4/9003/HB2 housing does not reflect light in that manner. It's an INVERSE reflector.
What does that mean? whatever light the bulb puts upwards, the reflector shines DOWN. And whatever bulb it puts down, the reflector shines UP.
This poster's argument is about placement... what is to stop a HID BULB from being placed in the same spot? The person says it can't be done... why? All this person sounds like is some one regurgitating words used elsewhere. As for "DanielStern"... he's a seller of halogen based equipment. He may have worked at the NHTSA, but it doesn't mean he couldn't be biased.
What's this stupid as argument about bulb vs capsule... a bulb is reference to the glass shape itself, not the filament. The HID capsule is still a bulb around the light source.
Going back to the current argument, to get upward glare with low beam, you have to have one of three things... (downward "glare" is the headlight beam itself)
1) light shining off an un-intended reflective surface that isn't part of the reflector itself. I'm actually getting this a bit with halogens in my new housing, but I've since re-aimed my lights, that un-intended reflection only goes off to one side and you'll only see it for a moment.
2) light is shining off the upper reflector. This happens if your source is too far to the back. Because of the parabolic nature of the reflector, moving it closer to the back widens the beam. Since it's supposed to be inverted in the first place, it now straightens out and you get more light going upwards from the low beam filament.
3) light is shining off the lower reflector. The lower reflector is reserved for the high beam pattern. If there is no shield around the bulb preventing light from shining onto the lower portion, then you will get light shining up. And this is what happened with my 3rd kit, the two shields (outer silvery one and inner black one) didn't line up to block all the light from going down.
When I talk about clean cutoffs, there's no direct light from the bulb on the lower reflector. If fact, if you look closely at your standard H4 headlamp from the side, you might be able to see a dark spot on it (in the Pathfinder, there is a clear dark spot on the lower part of the clear plastic/glass with only low beam on). There's no need to force the beam lower than it should.
It SHOULD look like:
You see the line that goes from left to right and then angles up? That was the pattern I got with my HID kit in the Pathfinder.
Some of you folks REALLY need to get off your soapbox and do some testing of your own. I mean, go out there try a few different brands (hopefully, run across a few that gave good cutoffs like mine) and THEN judge it. The majority of the posts I read from these fanatics do not seem like they have any direct experience with installing/using/testing them... just the experience from being blinded by the BAD installs. Which of course plague OEM HIDs and halogens alike.
You're supposed to re-aim your headlights even when you replace your bulbs with halogens.
What's your point?
What part about my post mentioned about being "cool"?
The thing I've noticed about "glare" is that it gets most of its intensity from "leaking" light.
First, I want to mention...
Anyone who believes this is clearly mistaken.
An H4/9003/HB2 housing does not reflect light in that manner. It's an INVERSE reflector.
What does that mean? whatever light the bulb puts upwards, the reflector shines DOWN. And whatever bulb it puts down, the reflector shines UP.
This poster's argument is about placement... what is to stop a HID BULB from being placed in the same spot? The person says it can't be done... why? All this person sounds like is some one regurgitating words used elsewhere. As for "DanielStern"... he's a seller of halogen based equipment. He may have worked at the NHTSA, but it doesn't mean he couldn't be biased.
What's this stupid as argument about bulb vs capsule... a bulb is reference to the glass shape itself, not the filament. The HID capsule is still a bulb around the light source.
Going back to the current argument, to get upward glare with low beam, you have to have one of three things... (downward "glare" is the headlight beam itself)
1) light shining off an un-intended reflective surface that isn't part of the reflector itself. I'm actually getting this a bit with halogens in my new housing, but I've since re-aimed my lights, that un-intended reflection only goes off to one side and you'll only see it for a moment.
2) light is shining off the upper reflector. This happens if your source is too far to the back. Because of the parabolic nature of the reflector, moving it closer to the back widens the beam. Since it's supposed to be inverted in the first place, it now straightens out and you get more light going upwards from the low beam filament.
3) light is shining off the lower reflector. The lower reflector is reserved for the high beam pattern. If there is no shield around the bulb preventing light from shining onto the lower portion, then you will get light shining up. And this is what happened with my 3rd kit, the two shields (outer silvery one and inner black one) didn't line up to block all the light from going down.
When I talk about clean cutoffs, there's no direct light from the bulb on the lower reflector. If fact, if you look closely at your standard H4 headlamp from the side, you might be able to see a dark spot on it (in the Pathfinder, there is a clear dark spot on the lower part of the clear plastic/glass with only low beam on). There's no need to force the beam lower than it should.
It SHOULD look like:
You see the line that goes from left to right and then angles up? That was the pattern I got with my HID kit in the Pathfinder.
Some of you folks REALLY need to get off your soapbox and do some testing of your own. I mean, go out there try a few different brands (hopefully, run across a few that gave good cutoffs like mine) and THEN judge it. The majority of the posts I read from these fanatics do not seem like they have any direct experience with installing/using/testing them... just the experience from being blinded by the BAD installs. Which of course plague OEM HIDs and halogens alike.
Sorry, older post, but just read it.
Thanks for posting this, Goobers. I whole-heartedly agree. Seems like people take up a cause blindly (i.e. NO HID w/out retrofit, NO copied rims, etc.) then then spew their thoughts without evidence to back it up.
Again, I tip my hat to you sir for calm, logical reasoning in a stormy sea of loose cannons.
Cheers!
#216
12-24-2010, 10:25 PM
old thread but still very relevent. i just installed my bi-xenons. hella bright and not bad price. they really have come down havent they? Anyway. My 07 GD is getting older (72,000mi) and noticed that the lenses are really oxidized and scratched. my using the headlight restorer is just not cutting it anymore. But overall, my 8,000k kit is doing well and we will see just how it goes. BTW to the M3 DRIVER....that plug is what hung me up today as well, wish I would of read this thread instead of staring at the engine bay for 35min!lol.
#220
01-27-2012, 09:19 PM
Trying to order a set but don't know If I need the relay or do I just get the kit with the bi xenon (hi/low bulb)?